PLD Negotiation (Vs WAR)

[AppleGrocer]

Usually I don't agree with callous remarks like Leiron's, but yeah. Your wrong Reyhart.

Look over the math posted above again.

[glen7187]

Here's that post:

You're neglecting the fact that that 20% Healing needs to be applied to a 25% bigger Health pool.

+20% damage resistance:
Starts at 5000 HP.
Receives a 2000 damage hit, takes 1600 damage.
= 3400 HP (68% of max)
Receives a 1000 HP heal. Gains 1000 HP.
= 4400 HP (88% of max)


+25% HP and +20% healing:
Starts at 6250 HP.
Receives a 2000 damage hit, takes 2000 damage.
4250 HP (68% of max)
Receives a 1000 HP heal. Gains 1200 HP.
= 5450 HP (87.2% of max)

PLD actually still have a slight edge because the +Healing is only 20%, not 25%
But realistically the performance is now so close as to be effectively equal in normal gameplay.



Granted.

(My point was they were stripping the +Healing from additional Wrath Stacks and adding it to Baseline Defiance!)

[Traek]

Here's that post:

I think we might have to have every tank who posts in the tank forums put the math in their sigs so people will stop arguing under false assumptions between Shield Oath and Defiance. Its usually the beginning of half the bad posts/topics in the tanking section.

[Zoomie]

So, Leiron's calculation was wrong and he should apologise to VoxInaBox.

You're not thinking it through man.

If a PLD takes a hit for 200 they will take 160 damage (200*.8 = 160). Requiring only a heal of 160 to fully mend the damage from a 200 damage attack.

If a WAR takes a hit for 200 they eat the full 200 damage. They are now 200 HP down and need to be healed to full. However if a heal of 160 is applied just like the paladin got your 20% healing buff only brings it up to 192 (160*1.2 = 192) leaving this poor warrior 8hp short of full.

The point being that PLD hp is worth more than WAR hp simply due to Shield Oath's built in mitigation which results in a "effective" healing buff.

Sadly your opinion based upon nothing but your own opinion is wrong and you should apologize to Leiron.

[glen7187]

I think we might have to have every tank who posts in the tank forums put the math in their sigs so people will stop arguing under false assumptions between Shield Oath and Defiance. Its usually the beginning of half the bad posts/topics in the tanking section.

lol I couldn't agree more!

[Reynhart]

The logic ?
Simple:
Shield Oath effect is reducing damage by 20%. It's basically 25% more eHP.
Defiance gives you 25% more HP, it's basically 25% more eHP.

So, for the same hit, PLD and WAR lose the same ratio of HP, providing they have the same base HP (Which is wrong, even if the difference is slim)

Example :
PLD HP = 5000
WAR HP = 5000
incoming damage = 1000

PLD gets hit for 800 with Shield Oath : 5000 - 800 = 4200 HP remaining HP (84% HP)
WAR uses Defiance and take the hit : 5000*1.25 = 6250 HP - 1000 = 5250 HP remaining (84% HP)

Now, for the healing part, Shield Oath doesn't give any bonus.
Let's say the healer toss a Cure for 400 HP. He need two Cures to replenish the PLD's HP pool
As for the WAR those two Cures won't heal 400 HP, but for 480. Indeed, it won't bring the WAR back to full Life but missing 40HP, but you can't put aside the WAR other means to Cure himself with Storm's Path, or even Inner Beast.

[AppleGrocer]

You have it backwards... and still wrong.

Just look at the math man. LOOK AT IT PLEASE!

[Traek]

The logic ?

Please read glen7187's post quoting Maelwys. You are wrong Reyn.

[Lemon8or]

The logic ?
Simple:
Shield Oath effect is reducing damage by 20%. It's basically 25% more eHP.
Defiance gives you 25% more HP, it's basically 25% more eHP.

So, for the same hit, PLD and WAR lose the same ratio of HP, providing they have the same base HP (Which is wrong, even if the difference is slim)
But, to recover those HP, healers needs 20% more healing power to bring back the PLD to full life.

Not so simple a caveman can do it it seems. Just look at the math instead of arguing just for the sake of arguing. You are wrong.

[Reynhart]

You're not thinking it through man.

If a PLD takes a hit for 200 they will take 160 damage (200*.8 = 160). Requiring only a heal of 160 to fully mend the damage from a 200 damage attack.

If a WAR takes a hit for 200 they eat the full 200 damage. They are now 200 HP down and need to be healed to full. However if a heal of 160 is applied just like the paladin got your 20% healing buff only brings it up to 192 (160*1.2 = 192) leaving this poor warrior 8hp short of full.

The point being that PLD hp is worth more than WAR hp simply due to Shield Oath's built in mitigation which results in a "effective" healing buff.

Sadly your opinion based upon nothing but your own opinion is wrong and you should apologize to Leiron.

You could be right, if being "full life" DID matter. You don't need to be full life, you just want NOT to drop to 0.
So your 5000 HP PLD took 160 and is now at 5840, but your 6250 (5000*1.25 for Defiance) HP WAR is still at 6050 HP after taking 200.