Rank Speculation: How would Corsair/Pirate/Musketeer play in XIV

[Hayward]

Seeing as there's a guild right in the Coral Tower waiting to be occupied by someone, let's just get the speculation out of our systems.

I see Musketeer as a primary class with the storyline centering around our services to the Admiral. Not really sure if Hexaguns would be used (likely if Corsair/Pirate turns out to be the job) or regular pistols.

I cannot see this class or job being a semi-support class in the way COR was in XI unless the devs weave in some Gambler elements better than in XI (i.e. streamline the roll options, make them last long enough to get some shooting in, etc.)

[Shioban]

It was originally in the works for 1.0, but obviously that faltered past and it never even made it past the conceptual stage, only the assets really exist, hence why the guild exists for it just like it did in 1.0.

I don't really see it being a support role, but I hope they find something interesting along the lines of gambling or chance should the job for Musketeer turn out to be Corsair.

Hopefully it doesn't turn out to be a blame 1-2-3 experience, (which I doubt) considering Yoshi-P is adamant to add in things such as Red-Mage, however finding a balance for these traditional jobs and their roles is proving difficult apparently.

You could easily add in a roll system similar to FFXI, I don't see this as 'unfeasable'. where-in you can gamble for a higher stake at the risk of busting for the chance of getting a stonger temporary buff would be make this a really useful and interesting DPS class/.


At least we won't have to buy ammo or dice...

[Tupsi]

In all honestly, they really should check into the XI Corsair, it was a great DD class along with being support. Considering Yoshi's decision to give everyone only a handful of skills, 'Phantom Roll' could grant access to more skills while keeping the other skill slots free for other junk.

But considering Bard...yeah I don't think Yoshi made ARR with support classes in mind.

[Raskbuck]

But considering Bard...yeah I don't think Yoshi made ARR with support classes in mind.

Admittedly that's one of the reasons I quit GW2... the lack of a dedicated support role is disappointing in my opinion. What's with this new mentality in games where full support doesn't exist? :shrug:

[Linadae]

Admittedly that's one of the reasons I quit GW2... the lack of a dedicated support role is disappointing in my opinion. What's with this new mentality in games where full support doesn't exist? :shrug:

I think modern mmo's are starting to move so fast that support/debuff classes are becoming fairly useless unless its a prolonged fight. Even summoners are having issues. Regular monsters die so quickly that one simply doesn't have time to cast multiple dots and its the same with support. They would be pretending to be full dps until there's a boss or a bad pull, only then could their job shine.

It's really a shame too. A good support can turn a mediocre group into something good and a good group will reach a whole new level.

It also removes a level of complexity that I kind of miss.

[Tupsi]

It also removes a level of complexity that I kind of miss.

Not to mention certain buffs/debuffs (beneficial debuffs) only lasts 1-6 seconds..Not sure if you played XI or not but the Pieste family you could keep blind on (even some NMs) and it prevents them from using their glare attacks. Stuff like that I really..really miss in FF MMOs. I know some people will immediately jump on "PS3 limitations", ignoring that this is being made for the PS4 as well..FFXI was capable of all kinds of classes and even huge spells lists.

Sure you didn't use 100% of your spells every second of the day..you at least had variety even if some weren't as strong as others, a BLM could nuke with Blizzard/Thunder/Fire/Wind/Water/Earth if they so chose and based on monster weakness while Thunder/Blizzard was the strongest in terms of formula until recently. In ARR..you're pretty ah...yeah stuck with Fire. Support roles are really what balances an MMO in the long run honestly.

[Reslin]

Not to mention certain buffs/debuffs (beneficial debuffs) only lasts 1-6 seconds..Not sure if you played XI or not but the Pieste family you could keep blind on (even some NMs) and it prevents them from using their glare attacks. Stuff like that I really..really miss in FF MMOs. I know some people will immediately jump on "PS3 limitations", ignoring that this is being made for the PS4 as well..FFXI was capable of all kinds of classes and even huge spells lists.

To be fair more spells are harder to balance. Also the big problem is sadly most people find classes that are 100% support unfun and they tend to be incredibly hard to balance. Now before you jump on me realize I'm in support of support classes. I loved playing mesmerizer for instance on EQ but this game isn't designed like 11. The problem is balance, how fun you can make it, how much effort it'd take for a support class to be wanted by a group, and how dungeons are designed. If you take out a dps class you end up with longer encounters. How do you make a support worth losing a dps class? Without a healer.. same difference. In FF11 many support classes had trouble getting groups and in raids.. well raids were large enough that there were quite a few slots to put them in but in 14 the biggest raids are only going to be 24 man.

It's a shame but true support has trouble existing in the modern mmorpg world. Another problem is Yoshi wants to focus on making a really good pvp experience (I personally have doubts on how well pvp will work in this in all honesty.) and a 100% support class would be useless in that kind of environment.

[frostmagemari]

Admittedly that's one of the reasons I quit GW2... the lack of a dedicated support role is disappointing in my opinion. What's with this new mentality in games where full support doesn't exist? :shrug:

The reason support roles do not, and should not, exist in MMOs like this is because there's only two outcomes from content developed...

The first being that the devs design the content and classes in mind that you will have support in every group, and design the bosses accordingly; Which unfortunately means that if you do not have that support class with you (for whatever reason), you are at a severe disadvantage for content.
- There is also the side-effect that the DPS classes which are already dime-a-dozen will have even fewer spaces to fill in the group creating an even worse bottle-neck.

The second outcome is that the devs design content and classes without the support in mind; Any encounter that you do bring the support class to will be trivialized because you have all of the default buffs that the classes bring on their own -plus- the buffs offered by the support.
- There is also the possibility that the devs will not make the support class too powerful, so as to prevent trivializing content; In that case the support class will be forgotten by almost any group as it would probably be better to bring another DPS that could support itself with it's own buffs.

[Raskbuck]

The first being that the devs design the content and classes in mind that you will have support in every group, and design the bosses accordingly; Which unfortunately means that if you do not have that support class with you (for whatever reason), you are at a severe disadvantage for content.
- There is also the side-effect that the DPS classes which are already dime-a-dozen will have even fewer spaces to fill in the group creating an even worse bottle-neck.

The second outcome is that the devs design content and classes without the support in mind; Any encounter that you do bring the support class to will be trivialized because you have all of the default buffs that the classes bring on their own -plus- the buffs offered by the support.
- There is also the possibility that the devs will not make the support class too powerful, so as to prevent trivializing content; In that case the support class will be forgotten by almost any group as it would probably be better to bring another DPS that could support itself with it's own buffs.

Regarding your first point, isn't that like saying something like "If you don't have a healer, you are at a severe disadvantage for content."? If we treat support as a fully fledged class, that could be applied to any role in a party. Much like a party won't be able to clear content easily without a tank, or without DPS.
About DPS classes already being too many and adding a support role will make things worse, I can't disagree much with that. Unless, of course, you add a fifth slot in the current Light Party setup for Support and either replace a DPS or add a ninth slot in Full Parties.

As for not designing the content with Support in mind, they can always adjust the encounters. I mean, they are not precisely set in stone; much like they modified WP so that you couldn't skip almost all of the dungeon.
As for making the support class too powerful or too trivial, they can always adjust the content to make it feel appropriate.

[Reslin]

About DPS classes already being too many and adding a support role will make things worse, I can't disagree much with that. Unless, of course, you add a fifth slot in the current Light Party setup for Support and either replace a DPS or add a ninth slot in Full Parties.

The big problem with the add another slot to light/full parties is that they'd need to re-balance existing encounters on top of this it presents the problem of making support worthwhile enough to have over another dps or healer. If they are it becomes the problem of balancing them so they don't replace an existing role by being too strong. Support classes have always been the hardest to balance.

While Blue Mage in XI is quite OP in the general sense

And this proves my point. It's very easy to make them too strong or too weak and any overpowered class is bad for the health of an mmo. It's why constant measures are taken to keep things balanced.