Why is race and nationality ignored so much in the lore? (why does the lore fail)

[Azurymber]

Do they teach to resort to meaningless strawman arguments in behavioural sciences classes?

Marketing teaches that there are many "averages", and that new "averages" can be created every day, that's the whole meaning of target. Cereating any kind of product for some kind of all-encompassing "average" (including games), is something that can lead only to failure.



And says who that it's the wrong medium? Videogames were born with text, even MMORPGs. Text in videogames will never go away, as it's a foundational part of the medium.

People don't understand the medium they are using if they make a video game with ten times as much text as there is interactivity.

I'm quite sure that "people" from Bethesda, CDProjekt, Bioware and, mind you, even Square Enix, understand the videogame medium quite a lot better than you. [/QUOTE]

So according to you humans aren't born with an ingrained need or propensity for the following:
-desiring pleasure or enjoyment
-desiring food
-desiring water
-personality changes at different parts of life such as puberty
-a propensity to seek vengeance when wronged
-a preference for relative gains over absolute gains (which has recently been proved in over 50 experiments worldwide)
-the ability to learn languages
-a childs need for attention
-the desire to feel wanted
-the desire to be attractive
-the desire for intercourse (in order to propagate reproduction)
-adrenaline rushes during periods of danger or with extreme pain
-an ability to become addicted to certain substances


i can go on for a long time and list things that all humans have in common.

When marketrers talk about branding to different segments, they aren't saying there are different averages. They are saying that different cultures, different time periods, different social groups, different nationalities, different languages, etc, all effect how people respond to things or what appeals to people.
But that doesn't mean that our brains don't all develop essentially the same. There are things that exist in almost all humans because that just how evolution works. Those don't really change. And a lot of marketers target those.

[Abriael]

So according to you humans aren't born with an ingrained need or propensity for the following:

"propensity" is a mighty wide field. Between each of those elements there are millions of variables in the brain of each human, in intensity, orientation, importance, etcetera, etcetera, etcetera.
Mind you, many don't have some of those elements at all.

Basically, you're oversimplifying humanity in a way that, if applied to any product, (games included) would lead to a monumental failure.

When marketrers talk about branding to different segments, they aren't saying there are different averages. They are saying that different cultures, different time periods, different social groups, different nationalities, different languages, etc, all effect how people respond to things or what appeals to people.

Which means exactly that there are thousands of different averages (some of which bunched together to create a target,some cannot), just with a slightly different wording.

You say it's "the best way to convey complex lore" when in reality you just mean it's the easiest.

Nope. It's the best considering the limitations of realism.

And yes, I agree, I am severely underpaid considering I have to tell everyone how to do their job.

Luckily for us all, you don't "have" to, but you seem to be oddly obsessed with the idea of doing it.

[Azurymber]

"propensity" is a mighty wide field. Between each of those elements there are millions of variatiables in the brain of each human, in intensity, orientation, importance, etcetera, etcetera, etcetera.

Basically, you're oversimplifying humanity in a way that, if applied to any product, (games included) would lead to a monumental failure.



Which means exactly that there are thousands of different averages (some of which bunched together to create a target,some cannot), just with a slightly different wording.

no. it means as a species there is one average. Humans are -predictable- on average. Thats why political systems work, thats why economic systems like capitalism work, thats why wars occur, etc.
Then you can split that large average up into many different subsections.
And then you can determine averages in those cultural or political or whatever subsections you like.
But the "average human" still exists. And that "average human" is why we are successful as a species.

[Abriael]

no. it means as a species there is one average. Humans are -predictable- on average. Thats why political systems work, thats why economic systems like capitalism work, thats why wars occur, etc.
Then you can split that large average up into many different subsections.
And then you can determine averages in those cultural or political or whatever subsections you like.
But the "average human" still exists. And that "average human" is why we are successful as a species.

Basically you're saying that the "average human" is just a nondescript theoretical concept that doesn't really exist, has absolutely no practical application, and has no relevance to the gaming field (or any practical field actually) whatsoever.

So basically basing any form of storytelling on that nondescript, theoretical average human would be a complete failure.

And that's why gaming companies employ writers (supported by marketers) to write the stories of their games and (Thankfully) they don't employ behavioural scientists or other kinds of similar brain moles

We can agree on that, yeah.

In any case, time for me to go to work, I have some actual specific targets to work with, luckily there is no "average", or I wouldn't have a job.

[Azurymber]

Basically you're saying that the "average human" is just a nondescript theoretical concept that doesn't really exist, has absolutely no practical application, and has no relevance to the gaming field (or any practical field actually) whatsoever.

So basically basing any form of storytelling on that nondescript, theoretical average human would be a complete failure.

We can agree on that, yeah.

In any case, time for me to go to work, I have some actual specific targets to work with, luckily there is no "average", or I wouldn't have a job.

I'm saying we know humans want relative gains. so make a game with relative gains (ex. people can get e-peen gear). HINT HINT, EVERY MMO DOES THIS, INCLUDING FFXI

I'm saying we know humans like drama, action, etc. So have dramatic or action filled quests. HINT HINT, EVERY MMO DOES THIS, INCLUDING FFXI

I'm saying people don't enjoy running through repetitive areas. HINT HINT, ALMOST EVERY MMO HAS MOUNTS, INCLUDING FFXI

its not like im making up complete bs. Every game adheres to these things because they are successful. FFXIV ignores them and has essentially failed.

[Kilta_Firelotus]

I'm saying we know humans want relative gains. so make a game with relative gains (ex. people can get e-peen gear). HINT HINT, EVERY MMO DOES THIS, INCLUDING FFXI

I'm saying we know humans like drama, action, etc. So have dramatic or action filled quests. HINT HINT, EVERY MMO DOES THIS, INCLUDING FFXI

I'm saying people don't enjoy running through repetitive areas. HINT HINT, ALMOST EVERY MMO HAS MOUNTS, INCLUDING FFXI

its not like im making up complete bs. Every game adheres to these things because they are successful. FFXIV ignores them and has essentially failed.

1 i could care less about epeen gear and mostly level to help other for sake of
2 i do enjoy stuff like that
3 i can have a mount in oblivion but I chose walk. I walk around mostly in ffxi even had my own chocobo I barely used. If i renred one it was because I had to rush to a pt. Or i wanted to hear the music.

I suggest you look up what a Kanon/canon is (the other one was matketuing so ignore it XD)

[Mack]

1 i could care less about epeen gear and mostly level to help other for sake of
2 i do enjoy stuff like that
3 i can have a mount in oblivion but I chose walk. I walk around mostly in ffxi even had my own chocobo I barely used. If i renred one it was because I had to rush to a pt. Or i wanted to hear the music.

4 you alone wont make this game a success, funny how things work isn't it?

Do not play a game you do not like then. Yopu at fault and no matter how fixed the game gets, you will never enjoy it I do not think ffxiv is A failur. And trust mre I know what a fail game looks like.

...and please stop pretending like you're the only one who plays video games here.