Why is race and nationality ignored so much in the lore? (why does the lore fail)

[Abriael]

I'm saying we know humans want relative gains. so make a game with relative gains (ex. people can get e-peen gear). HINT HINT, EVERY MMO DOES THIS, INCLUDING FFXI

I'm saying we know humans like drama, action, etc. So have dramatic or action filled quests. HINT HINT, EVERY MMO DOES THIS, INCLUDING FFXI

I'm saying people don't enjoy running through repetitive areas. HINT HINT, ALMOST EVERY MMO HAS MOUNTS, INCLUDING FFXI

its not like im making up complete bs. Every game adheres to these things because they are successful. FFXIV ignores them and has essentially failed.

And with every "humans want" you wrote, you completely overlooked the fact that "humans want" a lot of other things, and even those that want those things want them in different variations and intensity, and that's why game developers continue to try and innovate, finding new things that humans (actually not "humans", but "enough humans to create a success") will want.
There are a lot of games out there that ignored what people like you thought "Humans wanted" and succeeded. That's how gaming has evolved from text based adventure games to nowadays.

You're basically advocating sticking to the boring staples done and overdone a thousand times, negating the value of evolution, and yes, ultimately making things up. The fact that ONE game didn't meet instant success (while it still can in the long run) doesn't mean that pursuing innovation and working outside the box isn't a successful venue.
The story of MMORPGs is actually a continuous demonstration that going on to try and create clones that follow the rules you listed is a failed enterprise. That's what you get by looking to appease your theoretical, non-existant average: a crapton of games all based on the same concepts none of which ever manages to grab a significant slice of the market off the first one that got an headstart, and they all ultimately die forgotten.

oh, and by the way, to lead back towards the topic at hand that you derailed all by yourself (it's funny when the OP of a topic goes on a completely wild tangent derailing his own thread):

I'm saying we know humans like drama, action, etc. So have dramatic or action filled quests. HINT HINT, EVERY MMO DOES THIS, INCLUDING FFXI

Seriously, says who? Humans like a lot of different kinds of storytelling (that's why there are a lot of different genres of movies, books and, oh my! games), that range from the action to the "slice of life". Again, you're oversimplifying, and to create an immersive and complex world a mix of those genres is necessary.
Which is exactly what Final Fantasy XIV is doing, mind you.

Can't have the heroes without the bystanders. No matter how much you continue to wave around your "average human" flag. That's simply how quality storytelling works.

But again, we did learn something today: we have to be glad for the fact that SE has writers, and not behavioural scientists.

i would argue the bigger trolls are those consistently defending the game regardless of it being a failure at the moment.

Nope, the biggest trolls are those that think that disagreeing with their outlandish views that would most probably lead to even more disastrous failures automatically means "defending the game".

And now, I really have to go to work.

[Azurymber]

And with every "humans want" you wrote, you completely overlooked the fact that "humans want" a lot of other things, and even those that want those things want them in different variations and intensity, and that's why game developers continue to try and innovate, finding new things that humans (actually not "humans", but "enough humans to create a success") will want.
There are a lot of games out there that ignored what people like you thought "Humans wanted" and succeeded. That's how gaming has evolved from text based adventure games to nowadays.

You're basically advocating sticking to the boring staples done and overdone a thousand times, negating the value of evolution, and yes, ultimately making things up. The fact that ONE game didn't meet instant success (while it still can in the long run) doesn't mean that pursuing innovation and working outside the box isn't a successful venue.
The story of MMORPGs is actually a continuous demonstration that going on to try and create clones that follow the rules you listed is a failed enterprise. That's what you get by looking to appease your theoretical, non-existant average: a crapton of games all based on the same concepts none of which ever manages to grab a significant slice of the market off the first one that got an headstart, and they all ultimately die forgotten.

oh, and by the way, to lead back towards the topic at hand that you derailed all by yourself (it's funny when the OP of a topic goes on a completely wild tangent derailing his own thread):


Seriously, says who? Humans like a lot of different kinds of storytelling (that's why there are a lot of different genres of movies, books and, oh my! games), that range from the action to the "slice of life". Again, you're oversimplifying, and to create an immersive and complex world a mix of those genres is necessary.
Which is exactly what Final Fantasy XIV is doing, mind you.

Can't have the heroes without the bystanders. No matter how much you continue to wave around your "average human" flag. That's simply how quality storytelling works.

But again, we did learn something today: we have to be glad for the fact that SE has writers, and not behavioural scientists.



Nope, the biggest trolls are those that think that disagreeing with their outlandish views that would most probably lead to even more disastrous failures automatically means "defending the game".

And now, I really have to go to work.

says tv...
how many successful shows do you know of that are based simply on some random persons desire to sell cookies to customers with no drama and no action.

Popular media, or what is -successful- tells us very clearly what the average person wants. To ignore that is to create a product that will fail UNLESS ON THE OFF CHANCE YOU CREATE SOMETHING NEW THAT A LOT OF PEOPLE LOVE which is very rare. FFXIV obviously has not done that.

just because 5 people enjoy a story about cookies does not mean its a good idea to design a game based around that.

its not about creating a game to leave a legacy. games are created to make a profit. Its not difficult to see what people are willing to pay for and what they aren't. They obviously aren't willing to pay for what FFXIV offers, or we would all be paying already.

[Kilta_Firelotus]

says tv...
how many successful shows do you know of that are based simply on some random persons desire to sell cookies to customers with no drama and no action.

Popular media, or what is -successful- tells us very clearly what the average person wants. To ignore that is to create a product that will fail UNLESS ON THE OFF CHANCE YOU CREATE SOMETHING NEW THAT A LOT OF PEOPLE LOVE which is very rare. FFXIV obviously has not done that.

just because 5 people enjoy a story about cookies does not mean its a good idea to design a game based around that.

its not about creating a game to leave a legacy. games are created to make a profit. Its not difficult to see what people are willing to pay for and what they aren't. They obviously aren't willing to pay for what FFXIV offers, or we would all be paying already.

what does tv have to do with a quest about cookies? Also fyi even in tv the mundane characters do have their purpose.