BARD NERF, does it have to be done by removing abilities???

[Starplayer]

So Yoshi has confirmed that the nerf will come by way of changing the cross class abilities that can be equipped. I hope this doesn't mean taking blood for blood or internal release away because imo, that would kill the DPS too much. I think we all agree that Bard's problem is that they are capable of attacking too fast and therefore building hate too fast, which leads to hate management issues. Based on this I have thought of a few different ways to possibly fix this issue without removing abilities.

1) Increase animation lock on all abilities that can be used outside the global cooldown.

Abilities like Bloodletter, Misery's end, Flaming Arrow and all buffs like Barrage and Raging Strikes take longer to get out and therefore slows the Bard down, resulting in a decrease in DPS and enmity. Right now, the Bard can be spamming Heavy Shot, have Bloodletter, Straighter Shot and Misery's End proc at the same time and get all three out barely halfway into eachother's animations. If we know that most of the Bard's DPS comes in bursts, then this would effectively slow him down at the most crucial time for hate management; when he's popping all of his cooldowns.

2) Tweak BfB and/or Internal Release when used as a cross class skill

You can change the amount of buff you get or the recast timer. This way, you can achieve the nerf you want without changing the nature of the role.

3) A global reduction in enmity gain across all Bard skills

some people are of the belief that this Bard OPness is an illusion. Having mained it since the first day of 1.0 alpha, I agree with this statement. I often play with other DPS classes in my FC, geared as much or less than me, and although I don't really notice a disparity in DPS, I most definitely notice one in hate generation. Bard simply generates too much hate, which causes them to pull aggro, which makes everyone believe that they're OP. Is this some kind of coding error? Or maybe it's because they attack too fast? (like I mentioned in point 1). If you're of the belief that Bard DPS is an illusion, then this is the way to go.

Anyway I'm at work and have nothing better to do so I thought I would post my thoughts and see what all of you think. Don't flame me too hard

To be clear, I don't think we need ANY changes, I like things the way they are.

[prymortal]

Honestly its stupid if they touch it, Its also stupid to suggest ways of touching it.

Here, lets look at the obvious:
How often do you get 2 bards in 1 4 man party via Duty Finder? Quite often actually.

*2 bards in 1 party with no DPS limit break. It is proven that they are set right currently & shouldnt be touched.

*2 nerfed bards in a party missing those cross class abilitys & no DPS limit break is going to be iffy at best.
(talking about AK currently, but after they nerf AK as they said it'lll be the new dungeon that will have probliems)

Also turn 4 of coil without those abilitys on bard kinda messes it up a bit.
(In fact by the sounds of what they are doing class wise to bard & blm there turning to make turn 4 + a few other areas harder to do?)

& to top it off they will need to remove the 20% loss of damage from songs to make up for the cross class abilitys nerf.
Which once again they have proven time & time again wont happen. Because Well we all know why!!

Heres some examples of flaws to there actions:
1 hit AOES or damgaing attacks in general that you need to target enemy to see, But they have you targeting ADDS at the same time so you cant see it. Also in healers case your targeting players.
(i know your saying Tank sohuld macro warn but NO, its not there job if it was there would be a macro already set up in the class! + gamepads dont really have the space for them!)

2 tanks 1MT, 1 OT vs 1 boss & 2 adds. Doesnt add up does it. although it works its just not smart!.

healers getting aggro from healing.. instant Regen aggro.. Not a smart or good idea for a mmo.

Warrior VS PLD currently, dragon jump currently, no DPS LB for DPS class ~ healer LB for a class that cant use healing abilitys... What where you thinking.

e.t.c. we can talk about client & server as well, but we already know the points been made.


Also like to point out that an equally geared Summoner gets the same amount of Aggro from enemys as bards!

You can think im being negitive all you want, but im only thinking with my brain & looking at the facts from experiance!

& i'll probably be banned for speaking the truth & pointing out the facts. ITs very Sad when they do that. But some of this stuff needs to be addressed in game.

[Reiterpallasch]

1) Increase animation lock

I believe you mean add it, not increase it. You can't increase something that doesn't exist. As you said:

Bard can be spamming Heavy Shot, have Bloodletter, Straighter Shot and Misery's End proc at the same time and get all three out barely halfway into eachother's animations

Which just goes to show that there is no lock.

[Starplayer]

I believe you mean add it, not increase it. You can't increase something that doesn't exist. As you said:



Which just goes to show that there is no lock.

Sorry if I got the terminology wrong. What I meant was to extend the animation so that you can't cut it short with another ability.

[Fiorana]

Don't nerf me bro.

[Starplayer]

Honestly its stupid if they touch it, Its also stupid to suggest ways of touching it.

I believe it's stupid to change it because I don't think that one is warranted, but I don't believe that making suggestions on the nature of the change is stupid because they're gonna do it anyway. Why not give suggestions to try and ensure that they don't make WRONG changes?

[Warthain]

you tell me the stacking of the following buffs isnt to much , raging strikes, internal release, blood for blood, straight shot, hawk's eye, and we can add straighter shot for every now and then a guaranteed crit... no other class cans tack this many buffs on itself and still have the kind of mobility the bard has..

15% dex
20% accuracy
40% dmg increase
3X autoatack
30% crit chance
20% chance for next straight shot to crit

may just be me but i think its to much, if you add on this your CC abilities, and your utility, you're just a power horse afraid to admit it so you dont get hit with the nerf stick.

[Starplayer]

you tell me the stacking of the following buffs isnt to much , raging strikes, internal release, blood for blood, straight shot, hawk's eye, and we can add straighter shot for every now and then a guaranteed crit... no other class cans tack this many buffs on itself and still have the kind of mobility the bard has..

15% dex
20% accuracy
40% dmg increase
3X autoatack
30% crit chance
20% chance for next straight shot to crit

may just be me but i think its to much, if you add on this your CC abilities, and your utility, you're just a power horse afraid to admit it so you dont get hit with the nerf stick.

These abilities only last for 20 seconds, outside of this, it's simply 2 dots with Heavy Shot spam while waiting for the occasional Bloodletter or Straighter Shot proc. And outside of Internal release, the recast timers on these are very high. It's all burst damage, which is why I think they should just be made to attack slower rather than mess with abilities.

[UBERHAXED]

Stuffz

Not sure if we are playing the same game because all of bard's moves are animation locked and you certainly can't use any of the above less than 1/2 GCD from each other. Like WTF? Bro, do you even play? All DoW abilities are animation locked. In fact, why do you actually play bard? Try to interrupt anything with silence and you'll notice that the silence doesn't happen until the damage happens, and the damage doesn't happen until the move connects. Or even simpler, use straight shot and notice the damage doesn't appear until you finish the 2-shot animation. You most certainly can't use something like bloodletter (or raging strikes or any off GCD move for that matter) until you are half way done with the GCD. And you certainly have to wait to use another off GCD move while the animation of the first is playing.

[UBERHAXED]

you tell me the stacking of the following buffs isnt to much , raging strikes, internal release, blood for blood, straight shot, hawk's eye, and we can add straighter shot for every now and then a guaranteed crit... no other class cans tack this many buffs on itself and still have the kind of mobility the bard has..

15% dex
20% accuracy
40% dmg increase
3X autoatack
30% crit chance
20% chance for next straight shot to crit

may just be me but i think its to much, if you add on this your CC abilities, and your utility, you're just a power horse afraid to admit it so you dont get hit with the nerf stick.

Ya? Marauder? All that and more... Add +50% damage buff, +10% damage buff, +10% damage buff, to all of that. Not sure if serious. And oh yeah Marauders weapons (all weapons in fact) have 5 more points in attack damage. >.> Oh yeah and that's a tank. Bard is DPS...