Should they really be thinking about making another Tank job?

[Garnatian]

Taking in the latest changes into account, they don't seem capable of balancing around different Tank paradigms and any/all Tanks will simply converge into mitigation Tanks.

[ZDamned]

WHAT OTHER TANKS ARE THERE?!?!

Mitigation is the very definition of what a Tank does!

Next think you'll tell me that they have a hard time creating Damage Dealer jobs because they all deal damage, and so they're all the same.

[Garnatian]

WHAT OTHER TANKS ARE THERE?!?!

Mitigation is the very definition of what a Tank does!

Next think you'll tell me that they have a hard time creating Damage Dealer jobs because they all deal damage, and so they're all the same.

Well I use mitigation and "mitigation" interchangeably. Usually mitigation means damage reduced, but when I say "mitigation" I just refer to damage that was not needed to be healed, i.e. dodged, reduced, healed damage.

One of the main ways you create diversity in Tanking classes is by them having unique "mitigation" styles, however this is hard to balance and it would appear SE isn't capable of doing it, as is evident with WAR transforming in Axe PLD.

[ZDamned]

Well I use mitigation and "mitigation" interchangeably. Usually mitigation means damage reduced, but when I say "mitigation" I just refer to damage that was needed to be heal, i.e. dodged, reduced, healed damage.

One of the main ways you create diversity in Tanking classes is by them having unique "mitigation" styles, however this is hard to balance and it would appear SE isn't capable of doing it, as is evident with WAR transforming in Axe PLD.

I don't see Axe Oath, or Shield Oath, nor so I see a GCD Stun, or Flash with a Blind Effect, Or hallowed Ground, I don't see a Shield Block, or Sentinel, I don't see an OFF GCD Aoe DOT, or a Silence, or a Riot Blade. I don't see how I am becoming a, Axe Paladin.

[Duelle]

I don't see Axe Oath

"By this axe, I rule!"

There's your axe oath.

SE can balance tanks but they chose to go the easy way and add mitigation to Warrior. I am concerned that all tanks in ARR will be like some sort of paladin that has mitigation.

Having damage mitigation doesn't instantly make you a paladin. The focus is and should be on tanking mechanics without making one more of a penalty to have around than the other while maintaining a common denominator between the tanks. Some form of reduction of incoming damage and something ressembling defensive cooldowns are non-negotiable.

They've also got the same change of taking no damage for 100 attacks in a row. The only reason you think that the RNG is horribly unfair is because the human brain is designed to place much more import upon deviation from expectations rather than evenly weighting everything.

You're missing the societal aspect of it. NIN displaced PLD in FFXI because to the hive mind no damage taken >>>>>>>>>>> damage mitigation of any sort. Math doesn't even enter the scenario. People see no damage taken and that instantly makes one superior to the other. Even before factoring party resources spent per tank (the other main reason why parties preferred ninjas over paladins).

[Eightbit]

Diversity is always better. Just because they couldn't get warrior as an absorption tank doesn't mean something like an evasion tank or a new absorption tank will be flubbed. Of course they should not be thinking about adding until after this new stuff hits and they adjust as/if needed.

[Krystalynn]

Diversity is always better. Just because they couldn't get warrior as an absorption tank doesn't mean something like an evasion tank or a new absorption tank will be flubbed. Of course they should not be thinking about adding until after this new stuff hits and they adjust as/if needed.

Um that's not how credibility works. lol How do you trust that they can do this, when all signs point to the opposite? Where is your faith coming from?

[xRitzx]

There's mitigation tanks, HP sponges, dodge tanks, and more. I kind of agree with the OP. SE can balance tanks but they chose to go the easy way and add mitigation to Warrior. I am concerned that all tanks in ARR will be like some sort of paladin that has mitigation.

[Kitru]

There's mitigation tanks, HP sponges, dodge tanks, and more. I kind of agree with the OP. SE can balance tanks but they chose to go the easy way and add mitigation to Warrior. I am concerned that all tanks in ARR will be like some sort of paladin that has mitigation.

There's a substantial difference between how a tank *plays* and the mechanics that it utilizes. In 2.1, both WAR and PLD are going to have a lot of DR (though it's not nearly as much as people seem to think; WAR is still "huge hp and increased self healing") but they're going to *play* completely differently: WAR is *still* going to be all about leveraging Inner Beast for maximum benefit, generating/spending Wrath stacks on various other benefits, and selecting the appropriate combo for the situation (which now is even more applicable since SP is going to be useful); PLD is still going to be one combo and not much else (sometimes Stoneskin and Flash).

It's because of *this* that you can have a *lot* of different tanks even if they share many of the same fundamental mechanics. In fact, playstyle difference is *more* important than mechanical difference. As long as there are ways for tanks *play* differently, which is not a question of what mechanics are used but in the interplay of given abilities, there will always be room for more tanks. The same is true for DPS and healers as well. If they add BST, it's going to *have* to play differently than a SMN, and not just "SMN in melee range". The only time that you can really afford to cross over playstyles and still have it be justifiable is when you're going from tank to DPS, or vice versa, mainly because tanking and DPS focus on entirely different aspects of the fight so that you can get a completely different experience even if your character is using all of the same abilities in largely the same way.

[WingsofWar]

I wouldn't mind seeing some sort of Magic TANK/SUPPORT class ~ Low HP, high MP Magic user that casts a series of Magic Barriers on self/party/mobs that generate enmity while mitigating self damage. Big self heals, low outgoing heals, moderate DoTs. Uses LB of a healer, rather LB of a tank & can only roll as Tank in DF.