Highly Notorious Monsters

[ShadowDan]

I could see them adding to the Hunting logs and players getting the rewards from there (or via related achievements). I think the way to go with these special foes would be instanced fights (like Chimera and Hydra).

[ThePatriarch]

. (They do have better rewards though- rewards is the real problem with the NMs we currently have)

In my opinion you have a pretty silly system when the challenge is not in fighting the NM, but rather being the first one to press a button when it appears.

I agree on both fronts here. There is almost no reward whatsoever.

And again, camping and claiming should be a hitting point. I think we can all agree that camping for hours and fighting others over claim isn't the goal we are after. Something simplified. A system where botting would not be a concern. FATE NM's are fine if they have some sort of drop system implemented to make it worthwhile.

But again, open world NMs. Please feel free to link me to developer comments saying open world NMs will not have any focal point. While I know that they obviously aren't a prominent priority for SE, I am hard-pressed to believe it will be getting zero attention.

Just off my old 1.0 thread, the community at the very minimum, has quite a bit of interest in some open world action. Now, if people would take a moment to read the entirety of the OP in the thread, they would see that we aren't going after 21-24 hour mega HNMs. There are literally 20+ ideas (given by members of these forums, not just myself) that give variant options to how open world NMs would work. Some of these options fit under the "instanced" mode as well, for all the people who for some reason are just horrified at the possibility of open world NMs. I keep seeing the same responses about botting and claiming, when we have already provided multiple options to bypass those fears and give us more content which would give friends/pt's/linkshells/fc's some more things to do during their downtime if they don't feel like running that same instanced dungeon over and over and over again.

And in the end, more variety in content shouldn't be a bad thing, right?

[Gilthas]

Competition scares a lot of players. Handouts are the best way to handle gear.

Want some real competition? Do PVP.

Claim wars is a crap game mechanic where 1 player (or their party) gets to experience content while everyone else that lost claim gets to have wasted their time.

That's the point of a claim system someones gotta lose and waste time. Not everyone gets a cookie. If you can't handle you could always craft enough money to buy it.

P.S Video games are a waste of time.

P.P.S Claim system is over a decade old in ffxi, it can be improve dramatically.

*rolls eyes*

Lets compare actual PVP with claim wars:

- In PVP all parties experience content.

- In claim wars only the party that wins claim gets to experience content.

This is why claim wars are a crap mechanic. I want to actually play the game.

For the guy that actually posted an argument with thought behind it:

- I have zero issues with stuff like Dynamis, Limbus, Salvage, Nyzul, Einherjar. I also have zero issues with stuff taking a lot of effort (time really) to obtain.

But camping NM/HNMs? **** that crap. I probably spent more of my FFXI endgame career camping stuff than actually fighting stuff.

[ThePatriarch]

Want some real competition? Do PVP.

Claim wars is a crap game mechanic where 1 player (or their party) gets to experience content while everyone else that lost claim gets to have wasted their time.

PvP has never had any significance in the prior MMO made by SE. I do hope that changes in this game, but my breath is held. We all remember ballista. Fun, but nothing great.

And I do appreciate your empty statement about claim wars. First time I think anyone has brought it up. None of us want it either.



But on the topic of NMs (in a sense), how about the items that came with it? A lot of these drops were very rare, as many of us have stated. Although we don't want to redo some of the fights that dropped said items, just how rare were they?

Lets say 2005-2006. You saw someone wearing a crafted haubergeon (which was worth some bucks back then!), it was pretty cool. They obviously crafted and worked hard to get one. Now lets say you saw someone walking around in an Armada Hauberk... On most servers, you could count the amount of people who had one on one hand. Same goes for items like Defending Ring, and some relics. Items back then had significant value, and awe factor. Relics in FFXI were incredible, and made most of us stop and stare. IMO, that is how a relic should be.

In FFXIV, a relic is a toy you can get in about 4 hours (pending you have tomes stacked up beforehand). Right now, the hardest set of items to get is Allagan right? How hard are those items to get? When you see someone standing in a piece of allagan is it very impressive? Yeah, but its nothing in comparison to items in FFXI. The amount of work put in to get almost every item in FFXIV can be counted in days, as compared to XIV's older brother where you put in copious amounts of work to get your shiny item, and it held its "awesomeness" for months, years really. This is something I believe FFXIV severely lacks. Everyone has the same items. We all wear the same gear. Adversity among gear is just terrible in this game. Outside of allagan weapons, there are no items that give you that epic feeling of achievement.

Albeit, we all know where the MMO crowd is going. Putting in hard work to get specific pieces of gear is seemingly a thing of the past. Anything past a couple days of working towards a specific item is quite frowned upon, and we should all be able to wear the same gear because the people new to this game shouldn't be left out right? Why can we not have a very limited set of content aimed at people who don't mind putting in the extra effort, possibly over a period of a few months (weeks maybe, months scare people). ZNM progress comes to mind here, going for drops from the T4 Mobs, and then taking a stab at PW. How about, Einherjar? That's instanced!!!! Odin had great drops, many of which were quite rare.

In the end I think it once again boils down to just plain old "we need more content". I just like to think that there may be a little content for the ones of us who enjoyed FFXI's content (Dynamis/Limbus/Ein/Kings/world NMs, see the SS below/etc/yada/ramble)

And yes, I know, camping sucked, losing sucked, but feel free to go ahead and tell me again.

[Doo]

Want some real competition? Do PVP.

Claim wars is a crap game mechanic where 1 player (or their party) gets to experience content while everyone else that lost claim gets to have wasted their time.

That's the point of a claim system someones gotta lose and waste time. Not everyone gets a cookie. If you can't handle you could always craft enough money to buy it.

P.S Video games are a waste of time.

P.P.S Claim system is over a decade old in ffxi, it can be improve dramatically.

[ThePatriarch]

That's the point of a claim system someones gotta lose and waste time. Not everyone gets a cookie. If you can't handle you could always craft enough money to buy it.

P.S Video games are a waste of time.

P.P.S Claim system is over a decade old in ffxi, it can be improve dramatically.

Absolutely, no argument there. Well, aside from video games being a waste of time, lol. Perspective, my friend!

The claim system from XI is old, out-dated, and in desperate need of overhaul. I would love to see a different system in XIV if they did indeed provide us with a little bit of open world content. Maybe Initial party claims, and they can obtain the main drop. But lets say outside parties could fight and assist and get sub-tier drops (low drop rate ofc). Or who knows, there are 100 different ways to allow a claiming system that allows outside help, drops to more than the initial claim PT, etc etc.

Say main PT has "need" option, when outside help could only greed? I'm just throwing out random ideas. But alas, if we had forced pop NMs, (i.e. trigger popped) there wouldn't be an issue with outside claim, because you are popping your own monsters that you worked/farmed hard for.

Yada yada, there are so many alternatives that could be used as compared to the methods used in XI for open world spawns. They just need to be discussed! Who knows, open world NM's may be brought to the game, they may not be. But judging by the developers responses in my prior thread, we can atleast tell that they were interested in what we had to say. Why not give them ideas, suggested by the community for content that we would like to see brought into the game under certain circumstances. XI laid some great groundwork down, and can easily be built upon and bring boatloads of awesome content to XIV. XIV has a promising future to it, I just like to know that we as a playerbase threw as many ideas out there in hope of more content for our enjoyment.

[Doo]

Yada yada, there are so many alternatives that could be used as compared to the methods used in XI for open world spawns. They just need to be discussed.

Pretty much. Seems like the main concern players have are "bots" or "claim wars". FFXI systems are a decade old they could definitely improve upon them. Putting everything in Fate and making items worthless isn't the way imo. We already know how fun Odin and Behemoth fates are. I could barely see anything fighting Odin and it almost gave me a seizure.

[Alhanelem]

That's the point of a claim system someones gotta lose and waste time. Not everyone gets a cookie. If you can't handle you could always craft enough money to buy it.

It's not a matter of handling it or not handling it. I can take it like a man, but that doesn't mean that it is fun, or a well-designed mechanic. People only like mechanics like this when it benefits them. Personally, even when I win, I feel bad for the people who spent hours waiting for content to come to them only for them not to be able to play it. I just love how the best defense to this system is "you have to man up and be a man and manly press your claim button at the right time. If u no like, u R sissy care bear."


All this "man up or get out" bullshiat needs to stop. Games aren't about "being a man", they are about having fun. This mechanic denies people cookies just for the sake of doing so. The main problem with the whole system is the method of deciding who gets the cookie. It has nothing to do with skill, your gear, or your level. It's entirely luck/timing, and that's ignoring if anybody is cheating. That is bad design at its finest. If we are going to fight over who gets a cookie, it should go to the people with better skill, more something, or better something else. This isn't what happened in XI. The cookie went to whoever was lucky enough to be handed the claim by the random delay (meant to thwart botters but it didn't really work).

In short, the method used to decide who gets the cookie in XI was crap. At least in the FATE system (when it's functioning as intended) the reward goes to whoever did the most of something, not the luckiest person. Just like in XI HNMs, teaming up with people gives you a greater shot at the reward. The only thing lacking is the actual rewards.

(Note: I wrote this post hours ago but #*&^*$#ing posting limit)

Pretty much. Seems like the main concern players have are "bots" or "claim wars". FFXI systems are a decade old they could definitely improve upon them.

The thing that's good about NMs in fates is your chance at a reward is consummate with how much you contribute to the battle. If you play poorly / don't do enough, particularly in the fates with a large crowd of people present, you are less likely to get rewarded. Under the classical HNM system in XI, the reward generally goes to whoever happens to push the "claim button" at just the right time- something which takes no skill or manliness or anything other than luck. I'm kinda repeating myself here, but the problems with XI's HNMs can't be stressed enough.

[Babydoll]

Pretty much. Seems like the main concern players have are "bots" or "claim wars". FFXI systems are a decade old they could definitely improve upon them. Putting everything in Fate and making items worthless isn't the way imo. We already know how fun Odin and Behemoth fates are. I could barely see anything fighting Odin and it almost gave me a seizure.

Yeah there are solutions for that. Also people who freak out about RMT...I think someone said it earlier but Bind on Pickup fixes that for the most part. If people don't want the claim system...they could always have us do FATES for GC seals..and then use them to buy pop items to fight our NM/HNM in the open world. I dunno, just an idea ^^;

Fighting Odin and Behemoth in this game is really, really pathetic imo. It's like..really, this is what they've been reduced to? Some of the most scary and difficult fights in the FF series are now nothing more then a spam fest...and that is if your lucky enough to even see it.

[SynMaris]

1.0 had a decent system to be honest, the pop times weren't insane, and everyone had a decent shot at claiming, the drop rates were meh, but at least you weren't there for 72 hours or whatever ridiculous time it was in XI I don't even remember anymore. Would be nice to see some legitimate Open World content in this game for sure.