Does this game truly need minmaxing?

[Molly_Millions]

So I assume you get your enjoyment out of this game mostly by insulting random people?

Judging by the duty finder, he wouldn't be alone.

[Majidah]

Min Maxing is more involving than just blindly grabbing all the items in one set. I had to change my food in order to be able to get my AF2 belt due to the drop in accuracy, for example. But the overall numbers leave me with higher damage than I had before.

Also, vanity system coming eventually. So no excuse not to min max.

[cotti]

There's minmaxing in basically every game. It's fun for some people, it isn't for others, and for some it can even be fun in some and not fun in others!

Those BiS discussions are there and you are free to take part in them or ignore them. They are absolutely not meant to personally offend anyone - that's a job for the players, not for a list based on theorycrafting + practical testing.

It shouldn't hurt anyone. If you want to do Coil but are strict on "looking good" before vanity, do it with a group with the same mindset. It's not nuclear physics.

Why would a minmaxer want to join a 7/8 casual/middlecore group who are there mainly for fun-and-an-occasional-loot and force everyone to do BiS just because he does?
Why would a "casual" want to join a 7/8 hardcore-progression-noscope-cornshot minmax group and yet feel bad after he's called on his lack of responsability?

[TaranNos]

you think minmaxers are dumb for mixing sets and they think you're dumb for gimping yourself. get over it.

[Majidah]

snip

What you said is the same as saying "all japanese people like sushi". I'm sure this is not true, it's a bland generalization based on your own stereotypes.
I'm an end-gamer, who loves min-maxing, and I enjoy the content as I play it. I read all the quests, I do all the side quests, I leveled my one unleveled job in ARR without fate grinding...

And the only reason we complain about lack of content is because coil can only be done once a week (and we are at that point in which we can clear it within 2 hours) and because we've capped our jobs in 1.0

Not to mention that AF2 is tied directly with how much time you've been playing. Which is pretty damn silly.

[Teon]

Vanity system, will come. When available we can minmax freely. No doubt. God bless the vanity system

Get a full myth set (with stats from other gear) is possible just actually owning that item and use it for appaerance. Same for a full alllagan set.That's the endgame goal (as i said, my goal is a whm with myth set, and a bard with allagan set for example ), and the core of this thread: don't go around like a dumb just for minimax purpose (until vanity system is available) !!!
When available, get a nice looking set (and maybe the 80 one , why not. Something tells me it will be a quite cool armor ). It's an endgame goal after all. And doesn't hurt our community.

I see so many sad players just sitting on their minmaxed gear, looking so horrible with a patchwork of crafted, allagan and myth pieces but hey, BiS..
And not even working anymore on coil with his class, because well, he just "got the best yet, i'll switch class, i'm bored".
Leading to a lack of roles of that "so beloved" core group.
A possible community issue, next months.
Now good luck telling to the healer to leave his spot because you're BiS and you want to roll that SCH
Lucky you if you got a huge FC with multiple core coil group waiting just you , your SCH desire and your boredom , BiS with a ugly patchwork of armor pieces

I respect the playstyle of a minmaxed player. Some truly love those 18 more dps points
Let's just try to not make this game an other stupid mmo with elitism and that pathetic "Hey, 2849 dmg points or kick him, do an inspect" (something i expect when vanity system will be out , some may try to hide their real "output" )
Those 2 posts summarize the point of this thread and what i meant

I don't care if people minmax. What I find confusing is when I hear that this game is waaaay too easy, while at the same time people want you wearing the best of the best of the best (SIR, WITH HONORS!) because for the dear love of the twelve we need to shave EVERY G.D. SECOND off that run time! *froths at the mouth*

Although, that's probably just the result of people trying to use DF pugs to get a party with people who all just happen to want to run it the exact same way. So... *shrugs*

Short answer, no.
Long answer noooooooooo. ilvl is most important, as long as you're wearing some kind of ilvl90 stuff, it doesn't really matter all that much. min/maxing helps your raid of course but is it necessary in this game? one can argue only for twintania, and even that is debatable. Min/maxing stats is always helpful, but never make or break. Min/maxing spell timings is often unnecessary and failure can lead to a wipe. Many tanks are 40-50 points over accuracy cap with their gear at some point and theres basically nothing they can do about it.

edit: I am a tank on turn 5.

Is he a god? Why minmax didn't fix turn 5?

If someone got lost: the core of the thread was: take care of your look, more than lead our community to the boring rule "minmax or nothing" on this game where minmax is not needed at all
Some crafted armor fullset are so cool. And even not minmaxing you will perform good enough to enjoy the content
Minmax if and when possible, if you're so fond to it. But don't pretend to turn this game and our community like some "well know" cesspool mmo out there where "minmax rule or kick"
On this game, minmax is not the key. ilvl 90 armor and you're done with your beloved "endgame", time to make your char cool

Also: you miss a guy for a coil run? Is he wearing a crafted set? He will perform the same exact way of a full DL set guy. Maybe he just chose that set, and extremely experienced about Coil. Oh hey, 8347 dps output instead of 8470, right
Like Archona said, even twintania with minimaxing is debatable, expecially when it's all a matter of player's performance, not numbers

p.s stick to the present, this thread was made today, and today we don't have vanity system online, we don't need an other post "meh soon vanity system will be online, who cares"

[Zantetsuken]

I'm an end-gamer, who loves min-maxing, and I enjoy the content as I play it. I read all the quests, I do all the side quests,

Respect~

So I take it you enjoy the game then?


However,

What you said is the same as saying "all japanese people like sushi"

You need to read more closely.

Most people who min-max and drive hard for endgame content don't seem to be enjoying much of anything from where I sit.

Sure, they'll scream "f***yeah" for 10sec solid after their FIRST big victory over any particular content, but the other 99.999999% of the time, they're yelling "WTF" at the game, at SE, and at other players.

Sadly, they appear to be a joyless bunch of content-addicts who are hell-bent on proving themselves in the game rather than actually enjoying it.



I could be wrong though. it could just be the 'hardcore hard-cores' on my server (and in DF)... maybe others are different?

So yeah, I've left plenty of room for hardcores who actually enjoy the game. But it's the exception rather than the rule, from what I've experienced.


It's like saying: "MOST Japanese like sushi." (which is true)

[Yamimarik]

So... what is this about then? you like having pretty gear (which I agree I hate ugly gear, which is why when I get WAR to 50 I'm having Relic head/body ready not using that crap DL....) but what does it matter if others want to mix and match sets? I love doing that! Some times mix and matching sets actually conveys a whole new style with it's own flair! In XI and Tera I'd do that all the time, and I'd find multiple sets that actually were cohesive with each other. Some sets (just my personal opinion) look awesome mixed up! Like some Allagan and some Relic or some Allagan and some DL or some Relic and some DL!! I love DL and SCH Relic together, but again that's my opinion. But you shouldn't just discredit other peoples play styles b/c it doesn't fit yours @.@

EDIT:
Oh ya I love mixing the crafted Vanya with DL! It makes a fun set too ^.^

[EmSix]

Respect~

However,
You need to read more closely.
So yeah, I've left plenty of room for hardcores who actually enjoy the game. But it's the exception rather than the rule, from what I've experienced.

You're still making huge generalizations though. Whether you're using absolutes or not you're implying the majority is as you say they are.

[Zantetsuken]

You're still making huge generalizations though. Whether you're using absolutes or not you're implying the majority is as you say they are.

But is it true?

I could say that 99% of casual players choose Female Elezens as their char, and ppl would laugh.

I could say that 78% of former FFXI players lack the skills to dodge Garuda's whirlwind attacks, and ppl would laugh.

When I say that most hardcores just play compulsively and thus might not really ENJOY the game...

well...