Twisting [Life Surge] and [Speed Surge]

[Peregrine]

Probably because you still don't have speed surge II.
Really hurts my head that anyone would think that simply riding 1 or the other would be optimal in all situations.

Considering no one said that, you're obviously just mad from the other topic.

As another lancer said, it's not worth the hastle and probably best to just pick one or the other for that situation. I believe it. It doesn't look like it would on paper, don't have to have the abilities to necessarily come to that conclusion. You just have to be a believer in the null hypothesis sometimes, not a believer in every little thing you do mattering just because it's you that does it.

"A debuff is a debuff" is a logical fallacy. Sometimes one more doesn't matter. That statement depends on an all or none mode of thinking, when that line of thinking is more detached from reality and thus irrelevant to the truth. You have to ask what your debuff is actually worth, because it is costing you something. Not just "is it there or not."

Sometimes a debuff is just meaningless wheel spinning.

Life surge may be a complete waste of stamina compared to lancers equipping disorient and contributing to keeping it stacked to x3 with that stamina. I kick up a disorient II at the start of fights while on lancer. Not as much hate as a token life surge, and I bet that disorient x3 blows life surge out of the water if two other meleers kick up and do the same immediately.

Then you have to ask yourself what is the benefit of life surge debuff on a disorientx3'd mob? Probbly nil.

[Synapse]

Haha, i remember having this conversation months ago, i've actually seen the effects and tried it on grind parties. Switching Surges like that is not worth the stamina cost(cost more than the stamina generated by Speed Surge II - and thats only if the mob is alive with activated speed surge on for over 2 mins~ assuming u hit consistantly, if the mob is alive for over 30 sec, its not worth partying or switch mobs).

Its easy to think or talk about switching skills but in actual application its not worth it unless u do NMs, and even on NM(if only 1 LNC is present) its better to stick with Life Surge to help the entire party(havnt fought NMs as party since their nerf), if multiple LNC, then make 1 into debuffer and rest go haste.

Solo play, yes u should switch skills, if u really need it but thn again life surge(my solo perference) helps alot during solo play because of HP absorb and pseudo bloodbath with each weaponskills but solo play really depends on the player's set up.

[Airlea]

Considering no one said that, you're obviously just mad from the other topic.

As another lancer said, it's not worth the hastle and probably best to just pick one or the other for that situation. I believe it. It doesn't look like it would on paper, don't have to have the abilities to necessarily come to that conclusion. You just have to be a believer in the null hypothesis sometimes, not a believer in every little thing you do mattering just because it's you that does it.

"A debuff is a debuff" is a logical fallacy. Sometimes one more doesn't matter. That statement depends on an all or none mode of thinking, when that line of thinking is more detached from reality and thus irrelevant to the truth. You have to ask what your debuff is actually worth, because it is costing you something. Not just "is it there or not."

Sometimes a debuff is just meaningless wheel spinning.

Life surge may be a complete waste of stamina compared to lancers equipping disorient and contributing to keeping it stacked to x3 with that stamina. I kick up a disorient II at the start of fights while on lancer. Not as much hate as a token life surge, and I bet that disorient x3 blows life surge out of the water if two other meleers kick up and do the same immediately.

Then you have to ask yourself what is the benefit of life surge debuff on a disorientx3'd mob? Probbly nil.

tl;dr = As has been stated, life surge is rarely useful outside of solo play, though it still has it's situational use. I can only hope that this post will promulgate the peerless perfection with which I produce proclamations of my perfidious perspicacity.

[Col]

So, uh... Now that Stamina is gone.... This strategy is a lot better now, isn't it? o_o You could just start off with Life Surge, lower the enemy's evasion, then cast Speed Surge right after an auto-attack with absolutely no drawback.

You lower the targets evasion for the party, then you gain a faster attack speed and give Absorb HP to the party.

[origamikitsune]

Indeed. In fact, I do keep both of them on my bar except in battles that benefit from more specialized setups and I simply don't have the points for it.

[Frein]

Seeing how you sometimes miss and and how the effect sometimes fails to proc, it seems somewhat unlikely that you can consistently keep both effects on. I suppose it could be something to experiment with, though.

[carraway]

Time spent activating an ability is still time not spent using a different ability with more offensive value. With the accuracy changes, Life Surge is not very valuable, and if Speed Surge affects autoattack delay similarly to how it affected stamina regen (flat 8% stamina regen increase for both I and II, tested extensively), it's even more of a necessity in order to best weave WSs and abilities through autoattacks.