How to properly mix equipment crafting and endgame dungeons (a suggestion)

[msoltyspl]

Well, looking at the current state of the crafting after both researching and playing the game - it's somewhat saddening. Even more so - as relatively to other mmos - FFXIV has pretty decent crafting system (or rather mini-game) going beyond simple "click to craft". Emphasis on word relatively - it's not without issues - enduring excuriating boredom of playing same simple mini-game thousands of times during leveling phase leads to obvious side effects (same applies to gathering sadly).

Nevermind pre-50 boring and almost completely pointless timesink - enter level 50, and what do we have ? Game handing down equipment indirectly by means of tokens (tomestones) and npcs/quests - /or/ - directly through full item drops (with RNG on top). Equipment crafting plays secondary role as essentially a single ilvl70 feature - an adventure rather time consuming and expensive relatively to other options, while hardly necessary in practice (min-maxing, etc.). As this is about equipment, we will leave ALC and CUL issues for different threads. Small ironic bonus issue: crafters can't even craft their own best mainhand tools (seriously that's lame).


Below is a simple outline of I'd say simple and logical system that makes both part of the game - dungeons and equipment crafting - both necessary at the same time, without making one of those roughly pointless.

So - instead of full item drops - make the respective bosses drop crafting key materials with craft-bound property. What does it mean ?

• key materials stack with each other only if they are looted by the same person
• all types of key materials supplied during crafting must come from the same looter (raider)
• no constraints on trading

After the item is crafted:

• it's automatically use-bound to the person that looted the key-materials - namely it cannot be equipped or converted by anyone else; at the same time:
• no constraints on trading

Alternatively - as the game already has many recipes where other items are used as the crafting components - instead of materials, the item drops could remain as they are - but then could be improved through crafting (so they would be craft-bound as well - equippable/convertible by original looter, but tradable).

This system solves typical issues with the crafter vs. endgame dungeon loot:

• crafter =/= raider (though of course it can be the same person)
• both endgame crafting and dungeons play equally important role
• for raiders: part of usually frustrating RNG is removed - namely getting drops they don't need [anymore] or want at all in the first place
• crafted items are usable only in the hands of the rightful owner (person that looted the materials) - that property is of course simple on/off flip, mostly applicable to the endgame dungeons and BiS stuff
• very fine grained control over the content gating (amount of materials required for a craft, amount of materials dropped per run)
• this naturally opens tons of extra options that could be possible through crafting (e.g. customizing the item's base bonuses set)
• no RMT related issues either

It's simple, elegant and fair to both craft and combat classes.

[Darkwerk]

Nice idea. I could get behind a system like this.

I agree that crafting is rather lacking right now in usefulness, I have only leveled the crafts I have out of just wanting to play the mini game.
That along with hopes that in the future it will pay off for those of us with foresight . A system like this would be a long way to making that time invested(and gil) worthwhile for more than just bragging rights.

[donlep]

something definitely needs to be done
crafting should be able to produce items of about the same power as the best drops, maybe slightly less powerfull but with the bonus of custumization
either that or crafting should be able to improve the best drops
right now why bother with crafting? if you farm the tome mats needed to craft gear for an alt, you could just buy the DL gear
in my opinion crafting should produce all the BIS items, but off course with mats needed from various dungeons, coil etc

[Skyhound]

People come up with all of these complicated solutions, yet it won't solve anything. Especially since we already have dungeons that drop crafting materials (WP). The real solution is in fixing the prices. There is no reason high-end crafted gear to be so expensive, it isn't competitive with DL or even Myth gear. 200k for one piece? The time it would take me to earn that with raiding alone would net me enough Myth tomes to not even bother making that money. Gatherers have to lower their prices, for Crafters to lower their prices, so Raiders will even think about looking at that gear.

[Low_Kick]

People come up with all of these complicated solutions, yet it won't solve anything. Especially since we already have dungeons that drop crafting materials (WP). The real solution is in fixing the prices. There is no reason high-end crafted gear to be so expensive, it isn't competitive with DL or even Myth gear. 200k for one piece? The time it would take me to earn that with raiding alone would net me enough Myth tomes to not even bother making that money. Gatherers have to lower their prices, for Crafters to lower their prices, so Raiders will even think about looking at that gear.

I don't think you understand the mechanics of this. "Raiders" are the ones raiding WP/AK for philo mats to get tome mats to sell to the crafters. The philo mats are about 60-80% of the final cost, while gatherer's mats are about 10% of it or less. So if you think the gear is too expensive, tell the raiders to lower their pricing, but since you are a raider, it would come down to telling yourself to take a paycut.

Also, you said crafted gear isn't competitive with DL gear, which is true, it's actually better than it when melded. It's not better than most myth/allagan but it's readily available and you don't need to wait weeks for it. I hear some pieces of crafted are BiS, such as gryphonskin rings for tanks.

I kind of like OP's idea, and I kind of don't at the same time. It would give crafters an extra thing to do, but it seems it would be very similar to the way melding is now and won't have much benefit to crafters. Since more ppl are lvling crafting, getting hired for melds is becoming more rare since ppl meld themselves, or have friends/fc/ls members do it for them, or even random crafters that do melds for free. Since this is one piece of equipment to be crafted, the crafter can't charge much for time. Since the person requesting the craft has the materials, the crafter can't charge for materials. Only thing crafter can really charge for is the effort leveling the craft, but like I stated, alot more ppl are lvling crafts so crafting is becoming a dime a dozen.

[Skyhound]

Snip

After doing the math, I see that you are correct on philo items being overpriced. I personally will begin selling philo mats at lower prices to see if it brings some balance to the economy on Couerl. Though I do foresee SE lowering Philo mat requirements, it's really the only thing they can do without a major rehaul.

[Giantbane]

or they could add a "request craft" feature that works similarly to "request meld".

Then they can add recipes that both bind immediately and require mats that bind immediately. This also allows for crafters making gear that is usable by anyone (so you're not required to level a craft to have access to that gear) but can't be purchased with gil (to avoid the gil seller problem). It also doesn't rely on the quirky binding and trading rules you're suggesting.

If implemented, the one thing I would suggest they change from Request Meld to Request Craft is that the "reward" only gets paid if the craft is successful (pretty sure "Request Meld" currently pays whether the meld is successful or not).

[Giantbane]

After doing the math, I see that you are correct on philo items being overpriced. I personally will begin selling philo mats at lower prices to see if it brings some balance to the economy on Couerl. Though I do foresee SE lowering Philo mat requirements, it's really the only thing they can do without a major rehaul.

They are lowering the philo mat requirements for those recipes by about half in 2.1.

Anyhow, the OP's suggestion isn't intended to effect the prices of these recipes at all. Currently, the devs have made it so Crafted gear is NOT the best stuff out there (much weaker than allagan/myth items, for instance). This is intentional because the devs are worried that if you can just buy the best gear, it's going to encourage people to purchase gil for real $$. The OP's suggestion is to create a crafting system that could create high end gear (on par with myth/allagan) without having it be purchased directly via gil (which the devs won't allow).

[Teleniel]

The problem with a system like this is you *MUST* have a craftsman to have your equipment. While people are likely to undercut one another you are kind of SOL if you can't find anyone selling the service for less than more money than you've ever made.

[msoltyspl]

The problem with a system like this is you *MUST* have a craftsman to have your equipment. While people are likely to undercut one another you are kind of SOL if you can't find anyone selling the service for less than more money than you've ever made.

One of the core points of my suggestion is that you don't need any crafting/gathering professions yourself (if that's what you meant).