A different view of why we complain about lag and "the net code"

[Jonny_Tapas]

Lag or no lag. We have established that some of us have lag and some don't and severity differs. So arguing that in to the ground is well a continued waste of time.

Here's a different look.

If any of us at all have had a problem. That problem is:

We clearly dodged something dangerous and still took damage! That's the big beef right?

What about this problem. I can run right through the actual landslide itself and not take any damage or get knocked back! Ifrit's eruptions. As long as I get off the cracks, I can strike a pose in the explosions all I want!

This leads me to believe we're playing a game where the actual mechanics themselves do not pose any danger. We are dodging warning indicators! You don't have to dodge the explosions or landslides or any of that stuff. What you have to dodge is the red circle or red cone!

So fighting a Succubus! A red circle appears for Void Fira and I run out of it and then back in the moment it disappears! What follows is I'm hit by a big explosion and I take no damage from it. Just playing around in the fire!

The other option. I see that an indicator that explosion is coming and I take it as a warning. Smack the Succubus one more time and then run away. I get to safety before the big ball of fire lands, but in this situation I will take damage!

Sure we all know that is the case now, and we have no trouble dodging Void Fira but this does not mean it is not broken or just plain silly!

Many of us have memorized Titan and have no trouble dodging our way through the rotation. But this does not make it OK for 1 player who ran half way across the arena before there was an explosion to be knocked off, while another player ran directly into the explosion suffers no harm!

Me personally I'd rather see myself getting blown up by an explosion or a lazer or whatever it may be because I was actually hit by it.

Seeing myself take damage because I didn't run out of the red circle before it disappeared even though I'm miles away from the explosion itself seems silly and well... BROKEN!

By all means blow me up with all this cool stuff you're throwing at us... The red circle needs to be a warning, not the deciding factor!

[Tashigi]

I am going to sound angry, but I assure you, I am not.
I am mainly concerned for a game I love and value a great deal currently.

Lets put it this way: If I've played GW2/TERA/WOW/AION, etc. Even some Korean MMO, Blade & Soul in this case (You can imagine the huge amount of ping; over 600 MS in some cases, 250-400 with third party help) and I do not experience this skill input delay and general delay (0.3 sec from what's been gathered/calculated) in any of those games, what makes it OK for this game to have this problem, when I have a 40-80 MS ping?

There is no way I'll accept anyone walking up to me and telling me this problem doesn't exist, when clearly it exists and has persisted for many BETA phases of the game and made it to release.
If this community doesn't wake up and voice their concerns, we'll be in for more problems/trouble as game content continues to progress/elevate in difficulty as expansions come and go.

[ChiefCurrahee]

Hit detection needs to be placed client side, or SE needs to add longer wind-ups to mobs skills.

I dunno how many times I've watched a mobs cast bar continue to fill, while I'm outside the "danger zone" and yet still get hit.

How many times have I been hit by Weight of the Land during a Titan run when I was well outside the areas influence, before the wind-up cast bar completed.

If SE continues to move forward with these types of game mechanics they need to so something about this sever/client lag.

[Jonny_Tapas]

Once again it's because the warning indicator is deciding weather or not you are to take damage/effects. Not the actual mechanics.

Seriously find a landslide that is not targeting you and run directly into it as the warning line disappears... Jump around in it, have a seat, dance a jig! You will not take damage!

However if you don't get away before that indicator disappears + 0.3 sec position update + server ping + hardware latency... You can be on the other side of the map and you're toast!

It's awesome it's like you have to escape the warning with a giant random vision debuff! But you can totally play around in the explosion no problem!

[Keeff]

I agree completely. Too many say nothing or simply except it as part of the game.

Playing Everquest, back in 1999, this wasn't a problem for them, yet in 2013 SE can't seem to figure this out.

Please SE, I love this game, played 11 for 4 years. Fit it!

[theflo84]

I also think the detection zones are very often to small. I offten get hit when i stand to close but out of it.

But i am not 100% sure

[Sylve]

Something i wish they'd look into is adapting the HSR (Host State Rewind) that the team over on MechWarrior:Online built. Granted, thats an FPS game, but i feel like the general mechanic there, which literally eliminates Ping as long as its 400~ or lower, starts to get a lil shaky if you get too high over that, but generally works fine up to 500.

What it does is tracks/records the geo position of all players, and uses a sort of rewind server side to see if the target was where the bullet/laser passed through.
What it means for gameplay is that at a latency of 250, i can shoot a latency 10 player square in the face from 500 yards, and as long as my bullet hits the target on my screen, the damage will be applied to the guy i was shooting at, no matter where his client says he NOW is, so i don't have to guess how far ahead of the target i need to shoot to compensate for lag.

What it is, in its simplest form, is {Server Authoritative, Client Side Hit Detection}. Adapting this system to work here in an MMO would basically eliminate Latency as a gameplay factor for the vast majority of players.

For us here, i think it could work with modification.

[Terius]

You won't get far with all the white knighting. Whatever SE has decided is sacred law. You should be happy they are even willing to take your money and let you play.

[Jonny_Tapas]

You won't get far with all the white knighting. Whatever SE has decided is sacred law. You should be happy they are even willing to take your money and let you play.

In what world does the Consumer cater to the company? On this planet the company caters to the consumer.

[Mazi]

Snip!

I gotta agree with ya on the Void Fira thing, I do find it quite silly that I feel like I am dodging circles and not the actual move, another one that gets me is Ifrit's plumes, soon as they go off you can run into them as they are still blazing away.

I am not sure but I think it be nicer that instead of a lingering shape that it literally shows up for a second or two to warn you where its going to be then goes away and the actual move is what you need to dodge.

Actually now that I think of it a nice example is the Cyclops mobs, they don't have any indicator of where the move is but if they 100 tonz swing you BAM. So that concept but add in a tiny warning of where its at.