Current fix for Warrior is not using Warrior Skills?

[AppleGrocer]

I completely agree Hiir, and that just reinforces the point I was trying to make. Warriors only have a few options when it comes to periods of constant high damage, and blowing wrath on IB during those times is counter productive. We get better mileage making the healers job easier/more effective than trying to mitigate the damage ourselves. CD's like Convo and ToB are very much in this vein, they don't make us take less damage, but they help out on the healer's side of things.

[Judge_Xero]

Thrill of Battle requires the participation of a WHM or SCH to be really noticeably effective.

Another (and I feel actually BETTER) option is to put Max HP dependent buffs on you. For Example: Stoneskin: Creates a barrier around target that absorbs damage totaling 18% of target's maximum HP.

If a WHM throws Stoneskin on your as your Thrill of battle is starting to fade that Stoneskin is 20% stronger than what it normally is. The result is an actual EXTENSION of the Thrill of Battle Buff.

Of course, this requires coordination for this to work. BUT it allows you to completely skip a Rotoswipe or a Mountain Buster or What Have You

Great points. It seems like a reduced CD on ToB would be a great step on War mitigation. 120s seems like a long CD for that skill. At least if it was 60 seconds you could rotate ToB + Stoneskin and Double Inner Beast with Infuriate for most fights.

@ 6k HP you could make a ~2.4k shield with ToB and Stoneskin

Double Inner Beast would also net around 2.4k HP Absorb.

[DartFx]

I've seen this and the problem is more so they can't keep hate off the healer because they are also stating vit. Vit stat+ 25% reduced damage = no enmity. As a Lancer it's easy to pull hate from a warrior stating complete vit, so I'd hate to play with one as any fast attacking class(to include wars spamming overpower.) For those Wars ready to argue this, go back to Stone Vigil and try it before commenting. If it doesn't work during level up what makes you think it'll work at endgame?

You're running with bad wars. That is all. I stat full vit, went back to stone vigil to try this(funny enough) nevet lost hate once. Only place I might come even remotely close to losing hate is WP in 2-3 group pulls, and that rarely happens, even when dps has relic +1.

I also doubt the "enmity" produced via defiance. I don't think it's too adjusted to accommodate for the dmg lost.

[Maqaqa]

Defiance the static ability that "Increases Enmity." I quote because of it's falsehood that I wish not to discuss.

Ahah did you notice that too? :P

[Maqaqa]

Wouldn't your solution then, be for the healers NOT to heal you then if you're topping yourself off? If they're spam healing you when you're capable of topping yourself during that particular time, then yes that's mana wasted since they can hold off during that time.

Way too dangerous there are situations in which you have to be constantly spammed with heals.
Its scary from a healers point of view.

[Uliq]

You're running with bad wars. That is all. I stat full vit, went back to stone vigil to try this(funny enough) nevet lost hate once. Only place I might come even remotely close to losing hate is WP in 2-3 group pulls, and that rarely happens, even when dps has relic +1.

I also doubt the "enmity" produced via defiance. I don't think it's too adjusted to accommodate for the dmg lost.

I must be, but I don't run with a static team so meh. Or it could be your running with 50 gear which caps at item level 45 while everything that drops from there is 40-42.
As for the defiance statement it's all speculation since nothing can prove it right or wrong.

[Leiron]

As for the defiance statement it's all speculation since nothing can prove it right or wrong.

That is not remotely true.

[Uliq]

That is not remotely true.

Then what exactly can prove it true or false. Please entertain me.

[Leiron]

Simple test really and all you need is 2 tanks.

You can use full DL gear/GC gear to equalize.
Have them both use the exact same rotation for threat.
For Warriors, BB combo spam.
For Paladins, RoH spam.

Include a DPS in GC/DL gear for a comparison of threat.


Observe.


The original enmity modifer was 2x, it was changed, and my belief is that the enmity modifier is according to one's damage debuff.
i.e. Sword oath is 20% damage debuff, the enmity builder is probably 1.2
The thing is that a debuff of 20% is equivalent to a loss of 25% of your damage, so the 20% enmity modifier isn't enough to compensate, hence why Tank's in defiance/ShO create less enmity.
Even then, there is absolutely no reason for a tank to lose agro to a DPS.
The enmity generated is simply too great to overcome, and you can easily test it on a dummy or a stand still boss.

It is unwise to make statements of "Prove me wrong!', because the tools to do so are available.

[Uliq]

Stuff.

This would work if you can get the same person with the same stats to test it using 2 wars, the exact same armor to include materia and rings and such. They would also have to be the same EXACT race. Otherwise your not proving anything. Using a pld off tank to test it wouldn't prove anything because the abilities are different and all the classes stat base modifiers are also different. This could also mean the enmity modifiers to Paladin are different then Warriors.