Jumping Risk Assessment

[Elexia]

Someone else having fun with a feature offends others that don't like said feature.

It's more like people wanting said useless..err "fun" feature are extremely stubborn and feel it will make the game better. I've played more than 20 MMOs with a jump feature, 2 of which had a use for it and all 20 didn't have enhanced or fun gameplay because you can jump.

The game's features and specific focus, i.e Dungeons, Rifts, Air Combat, War etc were what made the game fun, not because I can jump.

Guess what made Mass Effect fun? I can promise you it wasn't the vault mechanic.

[Nikita]

It's more like people wanting said useless..err "fun" feature are extremely stubborn and feel it will make the game better. I've played more than 20 MMOs with a jump feature, 2 of which had a use for it and all 20 didn't have enhanced or fun gameplay because you can jump.

The game's features and specific focus, i.e Dungeons, Rifts, Air Combat, War etc were what made the game fun, not because I can jump.

Guess what made Mass Effect fun? I can promise you it wasn't the vault mechanic.

Ahh, back again to tell us what is and isn't fun, what we should and shouldnt want, what is and isn't needed and to preach your opinions as facts.

[Elexia]

Ahh, back again to tell us what is and isn't fun, what we should and shouldnt want, what is and isn't needed and to preach your opinions as facts.

Funny thing is, people who say it will make the game "better" seem to think FFXIV is going to instantly have platforming or a battle implementation. What's fun is subjective, but the ability to jump doesn't make a game fun.

So I take it if someone made a flash game where all you did was jump back and forth and did nothing else for hours on end would be considered fun? Since that would say that a jump mechanic is what makes games fun.

[Jennestia]

Ahh, back again to tell us what is and isn't fun, what we should and shouldnt want, what is and isn't needed and to preach your opinions as facts.

I don't see her saying what is and isn't fun or what people should and shouldn't want -- the beginnings of personal attacks are always fun.

Realistically, why would a jump mechanic make the game more fun compared to actual content? No one can answer this question without throwing in rhetorical situations i.e "it will lead the way to platforming puzzle solving" -- how do you know SE would intend to create said puzzles?

[Tiraelina]

It's more like people wanting said useless..err "fun" feature are extremely stubborn and feel it will make the game better. I've played more than 20 MMOs with a jump feature, 2 of which had a use for it and all 20 didn't have enhanced or fun gameplay because you can jump.

The game's features and specific focus, i.e Dungeons, Rifts, Air Combat, War etc were what made the game fun, not because I can jump.

Guess what made Mass Effect fun? I can promise you it wasn't the vault mechanic.

Stubborn because they want the feature or is it just that you can't see how someone would find it fun to have? It's really amusing reading about how the addition of auto-attack is bad because it removes player control and interaction. Letting everyone walk over everything without a second thought is doing the same thing and yet we have suggestions that make it a glorified walking and automate everything further.

Guildwars 2 is even letting players be able to jump and swim over terrain freely after locking everything to the ground on a set path around the world just like XIV, its also being used for more than travelling.

"One of our priorities in developing Guild Wars 2 has been to make the simple act of moving around and interacting with the world an enjoyable experience for our players. We often refer to this as introducing "joy of movement" into the game. This means being able to jump and swim freely, but it also translates directly into combat."

Funny thing is, people who say it will make the game "better" seem to think FFXIV is going to instantly have platforming or a battle implementation. What's fun is subjective, but the ability to jump doesn't make a game fun.

So I take it if someone made a flash game where all you did was jump back and forth and did nothing else for hours on end would be considered fun? Since that would say that a jump mechanic is what makes games fun.

From my earlier post.

"Jumping is part of the package and if they want to implement it with any worth they can't keep putting it off unless they are going to design around it beforehand going forward."

I don't know why you keep looking at jumping in a vacuum, that isn't how developing a game works. Especially thinking the only uses for jumping is platforming.

[Jennestia]

I don't know why you keep looking at jumping in a vacuum, that isn't how developing a game works. Especially thinking the only uses for jumping is platforming.

That's all Jumping is used for in a few MMOs though -- "Platforming", traversing certain terrain (which you can now in XIV) and dodging enemy moves (very very few MMOs does this..only 1 I can think of.) so again no one can realistically answer why Jumping will instantly make a game better compared to the addition of actual content.

[Arcell]

so again no one can realistically answer why Jumping will instantly make a game better compared to the addition of actual content.

Right because this game currently has no jumping and as such has no content designed for it (that would be stupid right?).

The only way to answer how it could improve the quality and "fun" of the game is to bring up situations in which it would if they were added. Jumping itself wouldn't make the game instantly better either way. It has the potential to make it "better" based on what the jumping is used for and what content could be created to suit it.

It would be hard to use it to evade attacks because currently the game doesn't really use hitboxes, it just kind of directs attacks at things. Are you within attack range? Attack <t>, hits or misses based on all the algorithms and whatnot, not if it physically made contact with you.

[Jennestia]

The only way to answer how it could improve the quality and "fun" of the game is to bring up situations in which it would if they were added. Jumping itself wouldn't make the game instantly better either way. It has the potential to make it "better" based on what the jumping is used for and what content could be created to suit it.

So in essence, it's the same line of thinking other people have with other suggestions that get shot down because they're thinking long term rather than in the now?

Jennestia, those who think jump will add to the game haven't made the argument that it will instantly make the game better compared to the addition of actual content

When you read between the lines, those who are pro-jump seem to make it seem like the most important thing they can add to this game, because they're the loudest group of supporters -- the louder you are about a subject the more important you're making it out to be.

No, but I've heard plenty of people complain when they find out they can't jump in a game.

Yeah, much like there's groups of people complaining you can't shoot in a x,y,z game either simply because a lot of games lately have a shooting mechanic of some kind. Certain designs just become so commonplace that it'll always be a con no matter how good or bad the game itself is if it lacks said feature.

[Neptune]

That's all Jumping is used for in a few MMOs though -- "Platforming", traversing certain terrain (which you can now in XIV) and dodging enemy moves (very very few MMOs does this..only 1 I can think of.) so again no one can realistically answer why Jumping will instantly make a game better compared to the addition of actual content.

Jennestia, those who think jump will add to the game haven't made the argument that it will instantly make the game better compared to the addition of actual content. Most of the jump-lovers seem to think jumping will improve the game in a way that I suspect they would say, pales to the comparison of other content with high production values. In fact, framing the addition of jump to the game in the context of a contest between instant fun and actual game content seems like a nonsensical tactic deployed by someone who can't win an argument by appealing to reason and must use any other way possible to get what they want to satisfy their (presumably) questionable tastes. However, I know it only seems that way but really you are just good at outsmarting those jump-lovers! /bow to Jennestia!