Warrior "buff" in 2.1: not what we are expecting?

**Azurewrath** · 11-21-2013 06:10 AM

rip pld

10char

**Amas** · 11-21-2013 06:13 AM

Originally Posted by Azurewrath

rip pld

10char

lolwut?

10char.

**Dhex** · 11-21-2013 06:15 AM

Originally Posted by Enlike

Over all I like these changes but looking at these two I quoted.

It is good to get lower CD on brutal swing but the animation is still way too long. Or rather the time when the skill applies the stun takes way too long. Paladin still has way superior stun compared to this. And I am not bitching that WAR needs exactly same kind of stun. No. Just that the skill applies the stun at least almost instantly.

Overpower enmity increase makes WP farming easier (as if it needed to be). What I wanted more is overpower TP cost reduce.

Actually you can clip Brutal Swing - the Stun effect is applied when you hit Brutal Swing and not when the animation finishes. Shield Bash has a short animation but the stun applies after the animation plays.

(You can test them by running past a mob while spamming Brutal Swing/Shield Bash it's very interesting but not really a valid complaint)

**Ladon** · 11-21-2013 06:20 AM

Originally Posted by Gilthas

- Inner Beast's changes are very nice. Again, some people are acting like you'll constantly have the 20% incoming damage reduction, but that's not actually true. The ability is still tied to Wrath and lasts only 6 seconds. People won't be spamming this but rather using it when they know a big attack is coming. Still, the ability sounds fantastic at least.

The fact that the 20% mitigation is pretty much on demand for when it is needed most is actually the only real concern I have about making Warriors the undisputed main tanks in the game. This is the only skill change I think that deserves scrutiny when considering all of the other changes being made as well. The overall effect of the skill working like this on top of all of the other changes warriors will be getting is very similar to giving the current Paladins a new skill on a very short cooldown that gives 100% block rate for a couple of seconds.

Personally I think the mitigation from this should be dropped to the 5-10% range. BUT also have the effect enhanced by Foresight where it give 15% mitigation while the Foresight buff is also on.

**Tiggy** · 11-21-2013 06:28 AM

Originally Posted by Amas

lolwut?

WAR...
-Has a much harder time of sustained AoE threat generation

WAR still will...
-Have a less user-friendly AoE threat generation tool.

Clearly you've never seen a proper Overpower spam. It isn't that difficult to run in, flash, coral them in front of me and spam overpower like mad. Not only do I get ridiculous threat, but I'm doing damage. Sure it's a cone, but it's not like it's difficult to do the job at all. Now with a defiance and a overpower enmity boost this will become even more effective. I have to disagree that I can't sustain it, and that it isn't user friendly.

**Ryios** · 11-21-2013 06:31 AM

Originally Posted by Tiggy

Clearly you've never seen a proper Overpower spam. It isn't that difficult to run in, flash, coral them in front of me and spam overpower like mad. Not only do I get ridiculous threat, but I'm doing damage. Sure it's a cone, but it's not like it's difficult to do the job at all. Now with a defiance and a overpower enmity boost this will become even more effective. I have to disagree that I can't sustain it, and that it isn't user friendly.

And then you run out of TP and have no MP for flash and the next wave of adds spawns and you shout for TP song and then can't figure out why dps is so low when bard 1 lost 20% on tp song and bard 2 lost 20% on mp song. So you ask bard 2 to remove mp song, then you die because the whm wen't oom because they had to raise to dps early on in the fight and it was all for nothing.

Meanwhile a pld can run in that trash pack on turn 4 in BCB and spam 10+ flashes and circle of scorn, hold them all threw aoe dmg and single target riot blade to keep regenning enough MP for flash spam, proceed to phase 2 and pick up the night and solider and get mana back before phase 3. Oh and pld does all that without losing any TP because the regen rate on savage blade and riot blade is > what it uses with the flash and circle spam weaved in the rotation.

If I run my war on turn 4, I basically just stand there single targeting unil the night and soldier comes out. Then I flash them both for snap agro and pull back for 1 overpower, then I combo the soldier before the blm pulls it and flash to hold the night (thats 2 flashes), then I switch to combo the night and flash (last flash now Im oom), and pray the BLM doesn't crit. Because if I blow all my TP here... I have nothing for phase 3 where I need to overpower spam 1 rook and 5 spiders so the pld can have their rook killed and pick up the 2nd dreadnaught.

**Maelwys** · 11-21-2013 06:31 AM

Originally Posted by Tiggy

Clearly you've never seen a proper Overpower spam. It isn't that difficult to run in, flash, coral them in front of me and spam overpower like mad. Not only do I get ridiculous threat, but I'm doing damage. Sure it's a cone, but it's not like it's difficult to do the job at all. Now with a defiance and a overpower enmity boost this will become even more effective. I have to disagree that I can't sustain it, and that it isn't user friendly.

I think the point they were making here is that Overpower Spam is great for Spike hate, but it's very TP intensive.

PLD can just spam Flash and recover MP themselves via the Riot Blade combo (and/or BRD Ballad). Also Flash is AoE not a cone, and is therefore slightly easier to position yourself to tag everything with one ability. And it inflicts Blind, which adds a little to your ability to mitigate the damage from the horde of mobs you just aggroed.

Also, using overpower interrupts your Combos. Using flash doesn't.

**Tano** · 11-21-2013 06:33 AM

So far the most interesting changes are:
- Holmgang: aside from the gimmick pull (not going to work on bosses imo and pretty useless on trash mobs since ~~war has no instant short-range enmity generator as Rage of Halone~~), the pseudo-pseudo-invincibility will play a role against ADS's adds and Cade, the same way Hallowed Ground does it now. Still inferior to hallowed, but better then nothing
- Brutal Swing: it will be possible for War to be a dedicated stunner against Ifrit, and also dps, since Brutal Swing is not on GCD, so we won't need to stay on AA all the time.
- Storm's Path: underestimated in this post, that's a permanent def buff. It only takes 5 seconds to do a SP combo, so you have a def buff every 5 seconds that will probably be up 100% of the time.
- Vengeance: finally a second def boost, also midway between Sentinel and Foresight/Rampart, but with shorter cd then Sentinel (2/3 cd and 3/4 buff, overall better, let's say situational) and also damages foes (helps to keep hate and to generate burst enmity).
- Defiance: finally on par with Shield Oath.
- Inner Beast: can spam 6 seconds def buff, takes 10-12 seconds to gain 5 wrath. simply amazing, can have a def buff up 50% of the time.

Overpower buff is nice. Still inferior to flash spam, since flash also mitigates damage and uses MP, not TP. But does damage.
Better then nothing I guss. WP will still be asier as pld probably.

**Sinte** · 11-21-2013 06:33 AM

About time they're getting some love. I still don't see a point of taking a war over a paladin as the main tank, but now they're a very viable, if not a better, off-tank than a paladin for progression content.

I don't really get all these paladins crying "rip pld". Maybe your only content is WP speed runs and so you're afraid they're taking away your niche? lol.

**Tanaya** · 11-21-2013 06:38 AM

Can't wait to sink my teeth into these changes.

Thread: Warrior "buff" in 2.1: not what we are expecting?

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