The Black Mage Rotations

[PessimiStick]

Hasted F3 and F1 both cost 1 GCD, so it's essentially just a Cost/Benefit thing.

F1 is 638 mana for 270 potency, F3 is 1064 for 396
0.423 vs. 0.372 Potency/Mana, and that excludes the F1's 40% chance for Firestarter.

Edit: It *may* be possible that there are situations where F3 could be superior, like when you had to pay for your initial F3, and you don't have 251 Pie. There are times where I *just* miss my cutoff of 1674 mana, in which case I could have double dipped the F3 and still had the same number of casts. In that case, you'd have to evaluate F3's damage against the expected damage of F1+FS, which is 428, but also costs and extra GCD, so there's a lot more math needed that I don't have time to do right now, hah. And even then, I'm not sure you can *recognize* that you had to pay for the first one in time to change to a double dipped F3 anyway.

[EasymodeX]

I mean it accelerates the whole cycle too.

1a. F3 - F1 - [F1x4 + F3 x2] - B3 - T2 /repeat 100% of the time

2a. F3 - F3 - [F1x3 + F3 x1] - B3 - T2 /repeat 80% of the time
2b. F3 - F3 - [F1x3 + F3 x2] - B3 - T2 /repeat 20% of the time


So that would be ...

220*.7 + 150*1.8 + [150*1.8*4 + 220*1.8*2] + 220*.7 + 250 = 2700

220*.7 + 220*1.8 + [150*1.8*3 + 220*1.8*1] + 220*.7 + 250 = 2160
220*.7 + 220*1.8 + [150*1.8*3 + 220*1.8*2] + 220*.7 + 250 = 2556

For time [gcds]:

1 - 1 - [6] - 1 - 1.2 = 10.2

1 - 1 - [4] - 1 - 1.2 = 8.2
1 - 1 - [5] - 1 - 1.2 = 9.2

Scenario 1: 2700 / 10.2 = 264.7 p/gcd.

Scenarios 2: [.8*2160 + .2*2556] / [.8*8.2 + .2*9.2] = 266.6 p/gcd.


I'm not entirely sure that I have the modifiers (cast times and stance buff values) accurate, though.

Edited based on corrections.

Edit: Holds true at a smaller gap with 1 less Fire1 cast.

[PessimiStick]

First change is that you're casting too many F1s in any case. For someone with 251 PIE, you get 5 Fire 1s per cycle. With < 251 PIE, you get 4 or 5 Fire Is, and I'm not sure on the frequency of each. It depends on when your mana ticks during the initial F3. GCDs are all 1 except for the hardcast thunder refresh and the initial cast to start your rotation (if you don't swiftcast it). The only thing this changes in your numbers is the 1.4 you have for B3 should be 1 instead.

Edit: I feel like you really need some probability modelling to really answer the question. There are multiple outcomes for your fire casts in a given cycle.
0 FS procs
1 FS proc - used in AF3
1 FS proc - on last fire, used with AF1 via transpose
2 FS procs - after second fire, after 4th fire, or after 3rd and 5th
2 FS procs - one in AF3, one in AF1 via transpose
3 FS procs - after second fire, after 4th fire, in AF1 after transpose

Double dipping F3 to start means that any time you would have been able to FS after the 4th cast above, you're forced to use that with AF1 on your restart. Not sure whether that's a good thing or a bad thing.


For your edit with cast #/time corrections, the potency for 2b is incorrect because you won't ever get 2 AF3 Fire 3s in the same cycle. If you proc twice, the second one will always be an AF1 version on the restart, since you're already casting B3 when the second FS would proc.

[avecha]

All very interesting but i think i'm more confused than before.

[PessimiStick]

Mage's Ballad ticks every second? I should probably know since I have a 50 BRD, but I definitely wasn't under that impression. If it does actually tick every second, then F3/Flare/B3 is certainly competitive and possibly superior. I ignored the single-target DPS because it doesn't really have any impact on overall clear speed. Everything needs to die, so 1 or two mobs dying first doesn't actually change anything. Crit has a flat impact on everything. Crit is essentially just a (critrate * 1.5) modifier on whatever potency you're already outputting.

Edit: Mage's Ballad definitely does NOT tick every second on the BRD, at least. It's 3 seconds like everything else. It *may* act differently on other people, but I can't test that right now.

[Youmu]

Crit is essentially just a (critrate * 1.5) modifier on whatever potency you're already outputting

Please see the calculations at https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...TDVkM1E#gid=23 . Average damage is heavily determined by the skills you use and number of mobs you hit. Start using mostly flares, and suddenly your 500 crit is worth an extra 40 int because your average damage is 1k+

Edit: Mage's Ballad definitely does NOT tick every second on the BRD, at least. It's 3 seconds like everything else. It *may* act differently on other people, but I can't test that right now.

Of course, its a different effect type entirely when BRD has it up. Any class receiving the buff gets its ticks every 1 second.

[PessimiStick]

Please see the calculations at https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...TDVkM1E#gid=23 . Average damage is heavily determined by the skills you use and number of mobs you hit. Start using mostly flares, and suddenly your 500 crit is worth an extra 40 int because your average damage is 1k+

Stat weights have no bearing on the actual DPS of the rotations. That's why we're doing the calculations in Potency per second, because it's gear agnostic. Better gear will do more damage, but they both will place the same since the PPS is the same.

If MB does actually tick every second for others, then I agree that in the average case, you'd get a tick after ~0.21 GCDs, which would make F3/Flare/B3 superior at ~145.8 AEP/S.

Edit: Just got out of WP, and Ballad does NOT tick every second, even for others. It's 3, like every other tick. Original math is still valid.

[Youmu]

Stat weights have no bearing on the actual DPS of the rotations. That's why we're doing the calculations in Potency per second, because it's gear agnostic. Better gear will do more damage, but they both will place the same since the PPS is the same.

Its not stat weights, its the effect of your skill choice on your average damage. The higher your average damage, the higher the damage bonus you get from your criticals on average. When you're using nothing but fire3/flare/blizz3, your average damage skyrockets, because you're not spending time hitting mobs for 450-600 blizzard2 or fire2s, you're just flaring. All your calculations don't take this into account.

tl;dr - Crits mean more for flares than they do for blizzard/fire2s. The PPS should reflect that.

[PessimiStick]

Its not stat weights, its the effect of your skill choice on your average damage. The higher your average damage, the higher the damage bonus you get from your criticals on average. When you're using nothing but fire3/flare/blizz3, your average damage skyrockets, because you're not spending time hitting mobs for 450-600 blizzard2 or fire2s, you're just flaring. All your calculations don't take this into account.

tl;dr - Crits mean more for flares than they do for blizzard/fire2s. The PPS should reflect that.

A) Average damage = total damage / casts and/or GCDs, aka the same thing as DPS/PPS
B) No, they do not. Crits are just 1.5x damage for whatever crits. The only thing that matters is how much base damage you're doing, aka PPS.

[Borfin]

Its not stat weights, its the effect of your skill choice on your average damage. The higher your average damage, the higher the damage bonus you get from your criticals on average. When you're using nothing but fire3/flare/blizz3, your average damage skyrockets, because you're not spending time hitting mobs for 450-600 blizzard2 or fire2s, you're just flaring. All your calculations don't take this into account.

tl;dr - Crits mean more for flares than they do for blizzard/fire2s. The PPS should reflect that.

That's not how math and multiplication work. :P

150% damage is 150% damage whether that's for a 100 damage hit or a 1000 damage hit.

It means the same across the board.