A Call For Originality

[edgar131]

I'm just writing this to gage how people really feel about some of the changes that are being made specifically in regards to physical levels and class changes. I'm all for making some modifications to how stats work and adding some more class uniqueness however completely changing the system to remove physical levels and move towards standard FF classes such as Black Mage, Dragoon etc. seems to be moving backwards in making a new and exciting game. These are some things that make FFXIV a unique game and not just another FFXI. I'm just hoping that SE still wants to maintain some of their originality and isn't completely caving into the whims of fans (even if it's a lot of them).

[Kallera]

Name a change, and I can splice Final Fantasy XIV's Title into it. =)

[AngryNixon]

This is a solid point and I'm inclined to want them to make something new and exciting that isn't the usual rote.

The problem is that what the fans want might be cloaked in nostalgia and a desire to return to familiar systems, but what it really is is a desire to move to a system that works well and is enjoyable to play. If SE had some brilliant idea that was unlike anything seen before and was actually good, people would be on board. The trouble is sometimes being original for the sake of originality is a bad idea if you don't get lucky and hit off on some brilliant new way of doing things, it's a disaster. I think Yoshi-P actually mentioned something to that affect in a previous Letter from the Producer. If you don't get it right it comes off as complicated, random and not nearly as good as anything that came before it.

So if the fan base just wants them to fall back on 'tried and true' that, to me, is a clear indication that they tried the high road of originality and novelty and didn't quite hit the mark. Not every new idea is a gem.

I won't be too sad if they fall back on some fundamentals that worked right and had no need to be changed (see: something as basic as a mail system) and then went forward from there developing new and exciting systems over time. Starting from the unknown and moving further into the unknown doesn't always work, but starting from the known and branching out into the unknown, at the very least, gives you a sensible anchor and core of satisfactory content that people won't take too much issue with.

[Malakhim]

More than anything, I would like the devs to stick to their guns and deliver a unique game experience. Naturally there should be recurring themes(such as transport methods like chocobos, airships) and characters(always gotta have a Cid) with FFXIV and the rest of the series as well as recurring ideas and concepts that are inherent in MMOs, but this is an entry in a series that has thrived off differences. No two Final Fantasy games are ever totally alike.

Regardless of whether or not the shift in the dev team was warranted, I'm glad that Tanaka stepped down as head of the project, not because I was particularly dissatisfied with his work as much as I feel that "new blood" and change have always been beneficial to the series as a whole. FFVI was a big departure from the norm, as was VII, X, and XII. Right now however I'm very much concerned about FFXIV losing that potential to be a really unique thing under the weight of all the "bring back FFXI" feedback.

I'm somewhat split on whether or not Yoshi has a real vision or whether he's going to pander to a certain subset. I guess only time will tell, but I for one don't want to see a game I'm currently enjoying in a series I love be tarnished.

[Kallera]

Just for clarification, I have nothing against them trying for something original, I'm just saying its only natural for games to tweak assets and features from other games in order to do so. I don't want a FFXI-2, I want a new FF Online game.

[AngryNixon]

Just for clarification, I have nothing against them trying for something original, I'm just saying its only natural for games to tweak assets and features from other games in order to do so. I don't want a FFXI-2, I want a new FF Online game.

Kallera this raises an interesting topic of underlying assumptions or mistaken assumptions. I think it is often the case that when anyone references WoW or FFXI there seems to be this automatic hostility in some that manifests as "I don't want a WoW clone!" or "Oh you just want FFXI-2 that's stupid".

You're view is, I think, the real general opinion of most. I don't think many are really saying they want the old games back or for this one to be a carbon copy of other games, they're just using a frame of reference that is familiar to them to make an argument for systems and content that works. Invoking the names of WoW or FFXI to make a point does not logically or automatically lead to the conclusion that they want this game to be a copy of those games.

I read this after the fact but reference this where Blitz0309 has to insert a phrase to cover himself against that automatically hostile response:

Market wards... great idea. However since they released a beta game, people are sick of them and demand an AH (and hopefully an actually auction house and not the 11 system). Even making them searchable and basically turning them into an AH... its just to late.

Hopefully these forums are a step in the right direction of not needing to cover yourself against what should be self evident as has been the case across many 'fan forums'.

[Kirith]

@Malakhim

See it like this: they have FFXI, a now old game, that made them lots of money and had lots of player enjoying it. Most of the current players are FFXI players. The current game is being disliked.

It is an obvious choice to make it more familiar to FFXI players to quickly gather a solid player base.

What i believe is that it is necessary to get back the immersive atmosphere and uniqueness of FFXI, surely not to regress the current engine and gameplay to a 10 years old one.

[Malakhim]

What i believe is that it is necessary to get back the immersive atmosphere and uniqueness of FFXI.

And that's what they're going to be doing with FFXIV. While the argument is shaky at best, that doesn't make it any less true that Final Fantasy XI had a full 9 years of growth at this point. FFXIV has had 6 months. While it can be argued that in this day and age, it's hardly a good idea to release a game that's as barebones as FFXI was when it released(speaking about before it was released stateside a full year and an expansion after the Japanese release, which didn't even have chocobos or arrow stacking above 12), I'm willing to bet that once FFXIV is actually "finished", and there are plenty of rough edges in the game to indicate that this is the case, it'll probably surpass what a lot of people think of it now.

Naturally there are things in FFXI and other MMOs that work, but this is Final Fantasy we're talking about here. There are always going to be cosmetic and system changes with each iteration.

[Kirith]

And that's what they're going to be doing with FFXIV. While the argument is shaky at best, that doesn't make it any less true that Final Fantasy XI had a full 9 years of growth at this point. FFXIV has had 6 months. While it can be argued that in this day and age, it's hardly a good idea to release a game that's as barebones as FFXI was when it released(speaking about before it was released stateside a full year and an expansion after the Japanese release, which didn't even have chocobos or arrow stacking above 12), I'm willing to bet that once FFXIV is actually "finished", and there are plenty of rough edges in the game to indicate that this is the case, it'll probably surpass what a lot of people think of it now.

Naturally there are things in FFXI and other MMOs that work, but this is Final Fantasy we're talking about here. There are always going to be cosmetic and system changes with each iteration.

I want to believe that, yet the whole artistic direction is different. FFXIV tries to follow a more western style, unlike the peculiar classic FF atmosphere of FFXI. Perhaps, as you say, it just lacks in development time, but i'm pretty sure that was it not for overwhelming fan demand for a "more FFXI-like" style, they would have went with an even stronger "European Middle Ages" atmosphere.

I'm not sure *this* iteration is doing it in the right way. Final Fantasy should stay true to itself.

[Lomelindi]

I know there is a lot of discussion about originality . . but honestly I don't think you need to 'reinvent the wheel' to be original. It IS possible to take foundational ideas from things that /work/ and build upon a solid base to create something wholly new and exciting. I think FFXIV tried to change to much and created an unstable foundation that just can't be built upon. There are aspects of FFXI that worked well, like the basic interface, mail systems, search functions, even job classes. It would make sense to use these aspects and build something new and exciting. :/