Maybe it's just lag!

[Noni]

You are a piece of work. I am glad I am on another server. I agree with OP too many people like you make the communities on this game toxic.

[Rivienne]

I don't play this game to help people overcome their lack of understanding or their bad life choices. I play the game to have fun.

Not hold hands for people in a video game.

Not a personal attack, but I find it so strange that people play a game that is designed to require working well with others, and then complain they don't play to deal with other people. It boggles my mind. If you want to not deal with other people... Don't play a social game. Otherwise you are fighting a constant battle and ensuring you will always be irritated by other people. Because you will keep running into people who aren't perfect.

Social life, and by extension social gaming, is going to always involve some level of compromise and helping other people. Be it your own inner circle, or merely acquaintances. If you still want to play, but can't deal with people outside of your own circle, then don't play with people outside of your own circle.

Otherwise it would be kind of like going to play some sport with random people in a community park, and then yelling and screaming at them because they aren't good enough/professional.

There is a huge difference between playing with people and playing for people. I enjoy playing with the people in my LS and FC. They are two groups of very capable people that know what they are doing.

I think you missed my point. But okay, so you can play well with people in your own FC. So why does it matter? Why insert yourself into this discussion at all? If you only play with people you can trust, then how does this affect you?

I didn't miss your point. It's just simply invalid because not once did I say "I do not like playing with others in a MMO". I said "I do not like hand-holding". So lets not try and twist what I said into something it's not. Shall we?

You inserted yourself into this discussion, stating that people who have any form of handicap are toxic to this community because you don't want to play with them. I didn't twist your words. By virtue of you inserting yourself into this discussion you twisted them yourself. If you aren't willing to play with these people, but you knowingly insert yourself into a situation where you will have to deal with them, you are your own problem. If on the other hand as you appear to be saying now, you don't play with these people at all, and they don't affect you personally, then your opinion is equally invalid because it has no bearing on your own personal game play.

If you put yourself in a random social setting with other people who are just in this to have fun, then we are back to the community park example. These people don't come to play professionally, and if they do have a handicap, they aren't the ones being toxic to the environment if you don't want to play with them.

I'm sorry. I don't look at people who have a poor gaming machine as being handicapped. I see kids in wheelchairs as being handicapped. To say someone is handicapped because they have a bad PC is a pretty terrible choice of words.

When someone has a terrible setup it not only affects them, but the people they play with. So yes they do create a toxic environment for the people that get stuck with them. Bring someone that can't move out of AOE because of lag some time, or can't get cures off, or a stun off to anything that matters in the game without telling anyone in your group. Lets see how pissed they get.

I think you're mad because I have a valid point and I'm not afraid to say what I mean. You come across as a person that is not "personally" attacking someone yet that is exactly what you are doing. Assuming that I have no right to inject myself into a conversation that could very well effect me and other players some day is pretty egotistical.

Fact is. Some people want to enjoy the game without being bogged down having to deal with someones bullshit. There is nothing wrong with it. It's just not the way that you want to play.

I am not attacking you, and I am sorry if it comes across that way, I am trying to point out where your argument falls apart, but you seem to not want to listen.

If the systems are meeting the minimum requirements, then the person is not at fault for playing the game, even if it means they have a handicap vs a better machine. I used that word intentionally because it is effectively accurate here. Many people with lesser machines do have a handicap to overcome, even if said machine is in the specs (and it almost always is). What your argument comes across as is a personal attack of anyone who doesn't have a machine that meets your personal standards because you can't be bothered helping them learn to overcome said issues. Fine you have the right to not play with them, I never said you didn't, in fact I said if you can't deal with them, then don't try. I am pointing out these people are going to be out there and they aren't in fact at fault: if SE says they should be able to play you have no right to say they shouldn't play at all, even if you do have the right to not play with them because you don't want to.

The core of your argument seems to be that they shouldn't be allowed to play because you might come across them. That is the problem here. (Shout is a different issue: you have the right to set the standards for what you want in a group, and if someone joins who doesn't meet those requirements then yes, they are at fault for falsely portraying themselves.)

If SE lets them play, then the judgement call isn't on you. It is however up to you to know they will be there, so if you don't want to play with them don't go where they will be.

I am not attacking your choice to not play with them, but your wording of stating that players SE intentionally specified are allowed to play, are toxic to the community because you might run into them.

So no, not mad at you at all, you just are missing my point. I brought up the sports example intentionally because I thought it the clearest example of where your statement falls apart. But you seem to ignore the example entirely...

I deal with people with heavy lag every day I play on a JP server. We figure out the fight, they learn the to predict and adapt, and move on. It is just a fact of life, especially since most English speakers I deal with are oceanic players in AU/NZ and have countrywide lag issues they have to learn to overcome independent of the machine they play. Your argument carried to the logical conclusion says that no oceanic player should play because their sub-par internet might inconvenience other players until they learn a fight well enough to adapt. There are many types of technical handicaps in a game like this: you have every right to not play with someone who has one. Attacking them for playing the game at all however is where the problem comes in.

[Vivik]

snip

There is a huge difference between playing with people and playing for people. I enjoy playing with the people in my LS and FC. They are two groups of very capable people that know what they are doing.

[Vivik]

I think you missed my point. But okay, so you can play well with people in your own FC. So why does it matter? Why insert yourself into this discussion at all? If you only play with people you can trust, then how does this effect you?

I didn't miss your point. It's just simply invalid because not once did I say "I do not like playing with others in a MMO". I said "I do not like hand-holding". So lets try and not twist what I said into something I didn't say. Shall we?

[xwxmeowxvvx]

I'm sorry. -snip-

Haha. No, your not.

[Vivik]

Haha. No, you're not.

You're right. Poor choice of words on my part.

[Inferiae]

If your PC is so slow that it's stops you from being able to perform basic maneuvers in the game then you should either upgrade or not play. Period.

The requirements are there for a reason, but as I can see, OP has an "adequate" PC. If he shouldn't be playing with his config, then the minimum requirements must be changed.

[Kyant]

The requirements are there for a reason, but as I can see, OP has an "adequate" PC. If he shouldn't be playing with his config, then the minimum requirements must be changed.

If you are close to the minimum requirements that I'd expect the game to be a bit sluggish. I bought a computer for 1200 like 4 years ago, so today it would probably only be around 800 or so idk... but I have never had any issues with lag. I had my game set to the high performance for a Desktop, but I didn't notice much difference between the highest graphics settings on the game and the lowest, so I have my graphics set pretty low. It may be that everyone is trying to set their graphics as high as possible for their pc and that causes the lag (while they just assume its the internet lagging). I do not know where the data centers are or what my ping to the server is but there is nothing SE can do if you live super far from the data center and get a few milliseconds delay from the server. Actually I just pinged the lodestone japanese servers from ohio and got 175ms(thats a bit short of 1/5 of a second... and thats going across the world to the farthest server. When skills take 1~2 seconds to cast and people sometimes say the skill never even appeared on their screen due to lag... thats when you know for sure its your pc. I think the majority of the lag people get is from trying to crank out the best graphics from their PCs while forgetting about performance. If everyone gets the lag then its probably the server having a hiccup, but usually its just one person lagging. The minimum requirements are the minimum for the game to run, they are not for smooth gameplay.

[AlahnSiegrain]

If your PC is so slow that it's stops you from being able to perform basic maneuvers in the game then you should either upgrade or not play. Period.

Maybe the ones the lag shouldnt play either. And the bad ones. And the young ones. And the casuals.

Lets see if the game ever gets >1k subs like this

[Reiterpallasch]

Video lag =/= latency. If you have garbage fps it's likely not going to cause any problems with avoiding things, unless it's extremely bad. That said:

If your PC is so slow that it's stops you from being able to perform basic maneuvers in the game then you should either upgrade or not play. Period.

There is truth to this, and it makes me sad that people immediately attacked Vivik for this despite it being true. Simply put, if your PC is so terrible that you look like your character uses old school cactuar animations, you probably shouldn't be doing group events with random people. Friends sure, because they understand the problem. But random people? Please don't ruin 3-7 others' gameplay.

I get that not everyone can dish out the "less than a PS3" worth of money to make a PC that can play this game, but some are so bad that they really shouldn't be trying to play.