Skill Chains and Magic Bursts

[Combinatoric]

There's something missing from combat in FFXIV. As things are, interaction between players during combat is just like every other "holy trinity (tank/healer/dd)" MMO out there. Tanks worry about positioning and mitigation, DD worry about dealing damage without pulling hate, and healers worry about healing tanks and DD that take hits. All while everyone tries to stay out of puddles. You can find these kinds of challenges in tons of other games.

For those that don't know about skill chains and magic bursts: The previous FF MMO had a unique system that required groups to chain their skills in certain orders for maximum damage. These were called skill chains and magic bursts. Essentially, each player had their own "limit break", and when two players used them sequentially, it generated an extra spell that dealt damage to the mob - this is a skill chain.

[Combinatoric]

Furthermore, if a caster used a spell with the same elemental type as that skill chain and it hit within a few seconds afterwards, it dealt significantly more damage - this is a magic burst.

Skill chains and magic bursts were a way for coordinating attacks between players to deal massive damage. The difference between groups that consistently pulled off their skill chains and those that didn't was huge. This is exacerbated by using magic bursts with long cast spells (see ffxi ancient magic - 10+ second cast time) where the BLM begins casting their spell before the skill chain is even started. Coordination already exists in FFXIV combat, but it's only as deep as other MMOs (healers work with tanks, offtanks work with both, etc.). Bring back a concept that separates FF combat from other games. Honestly, I'd say go even further, add in some twists to the skill chain concept. Have each limit break use just take one limit break bar, and have players chain their limit breaks.

[Combinatoric]

Hopefully someone agrees with me. . . And, for the record, I'm not looking for FFXIV to be an FFXI clone - it's just that skill chains and magic bursts were such an awesome combat feature, it really set FFXI apart from other games, and I feel that's missing in FFXIV. What say you all?

[Leigaon]

They did make a good connection between players for them to work together on that kind of level. Hard thing would be to really implement it. Chaining limit breaks, you would have to find a balance, and that would require testing I'm sure. Only thing I can think of is making some sort of ability that has a decent cool down that lets the next weapon ability ignore self combo and chain to another player that has theirs active, creating a SC, little animation for extra overall damage and an icon on the mob that allows for magic bursting of some sort.

Long cool down on ability would prevent spam, let people go back to combos and since they could only create a SC with another person who has their ability activated no one could really mess it up.

But this is a fast paced game, do you think adding in something like SC's / MB's could really fit in? How would you balance it out so it's not so over powered it takes away from other mechanics half the time?

[Combinatoric]

I'm thinking the current Limit Break system could be co-opted somehow, so that this type of mechanic would only really be used once or twice per fight.

I agree with you though, the current game is too face paced to have SC's and MB's happening frequently. Nonetheless, I think there's a place for them if it's on a long cooldown.

[Fhqwghads]

They could always do what LOTRO does whenever a fellowship maneuver is triggered - the mob is basically stunned for a short window. This would allow for magic bursts, or maybe even something like a weapon skill burst. Lots of creative ways to implement it. I sure would like to see something like this in game. Limit break seems kinda... weak. 95% of the time it's pegged and only used as a last resort in my admittedly limited experience.

[Jubez187]

I actually felt that this game needed some "cross-class-combos" and this is pretty much what I would expect. I'm all for this feature..I'm for anything that makes battle more complex . However, if they added it into the game then they would have to rebalance a lot of group quests.

[ruinedmirage]

These are all good points.


First, Duty Finder would be almost completely useless for groups looking for specific skill chains. This would probably make some classes obsolete (because people will inevitably favor a certain playstyle, then adapt to its skill chains). When these specialized groups form, they have most likely found a way to min/max there DPS output, resulting in every end-game content having to be redesigned, not for your typical MMO random group, but for the hardcore content thrashers. Either the content would end up being too trivial for end-game multi-50's to care about keeping a subscription, or the content would be too hard for casual play. I don't really see an inbetween scenario for this.

I loved the Battle Regimen system in the early version, but chaining limit breaks might feel a little too much like FF12. Sometimes I'd omit the use of Quickenings because it made the game wayyyyy too easy. But skill chaining that results in stuns, extra damage, or disadvantages to boss mechanics without going overboard isn't a bad idea. The trick comes in balancing and making everyone compatible for group play, so as not to exclude certain classes or jobs. Hence why we have a simple trinity right now..........2/3 months after launch, by the way.

[misterrpg]

But that is just it... XIV would be a better game if it was a XI clone, because currently it is a WoW clone, and it really does show.

I can't speak for the development team, but with their attitude towards XI, (especially Yoshida) you won't ever see skill chains or magic bursts ever again.

They're too afraid of making the game too "complex" for new players (casuals). Did you ever wonder why there are no weaknesses, more ways to aggro, etc.? Because it is too difficult for "casuals" to understand. That's what they have been basically saying for years now.