Why You Shouldn't Use Fracture

[Coramac]

Going off of 950 TP, spamming Fracture would get you 31.67 GCDs so I'm not sure what you're even talking about.

I go off of 950 TP because it doesn't matter if you've got 59 TP or 0 TP: you're not using any of your attacks. As soon as your net loss reaches 950 (since TP costs are all in intervals of 10), you're at the point where you enter cost triage mode. Going off of 1000 ignores that.

950 / 14.44 = 72?

Mind blown. It really just looks like your altering the numbers to fit what you want to see at this point.

Additionally, this just makes no sense. 950 is a purely arbitrary number.

[Sapphidia]

Regardless of whether it's 950 or 1000, the basic facts are that you'll never overtake the damage of a fracture rotation for any length of fight (assuming fracture runs its full duration).

After X seconds in a fight, you'll have spent Y TP. Y is equal to (1000 + 20X). At any value of Y the amount of TP you have available to have used on skills is the same regardless of which rotation you're using. The amount of damage you'll have done at any point in time is 3.05Y for non fracture and 3.12Y for fracture rotations.

The only time this value isnt exactly on is when you consider rounding up to whole numbers of skills, which might mean having to wait an extra second or two at the end of the time comparison for full GCDs. But that's only going to create a variance in potency of less than 1 GCD over any length of time, as it only takes 2 GCDs for both rotations to regen enough for one skill.

And if starting with 950 (for whatever reason), the number of GCDs you have is 950/14.4 and 950/15.6, which is 65.97 GCDs to bottom out for non-fracture and 60.9 GCDs to bottom out for Fracture. 61 vs 66 is a LOT different to 60 vs 72.

Your math is wrong.

I don't disagree that fracture doesnt make a big difference. It's 3% increased damage if you use it. It's a threat loss if you use it. But it's still an increase. 3% is significant in situations where you're trying to minmax a rotation. It's fine to recommend that people don't use fracture much, but it's -wrong- to say that it's a DPS loss in any sense. It isnt. No matter how long a fight or how you manage your TP, including Fracture will always result in more DPS than a non-fracture rotation. Not by much, but not LESS.

The main use of fracture is the fact that it's frontloaded into one GCD. Take Berserk - 20 seconds lets you fit 8 GCDs of attacks in once you use it. You CANNOT fit in 3 full three-hit rotations. The optimal way to make use of berserk is to pop it after either a Maim or Skull Sunder, so the damage affects the Storms/Butchers, do two more 3-hit combos, and have a spare GCD. In this situation Fracture would be the obvious button to hit as you'd be boosting a single 300 potency GCD by 40% instead of a 150 potency heavy swing or 200 potency skull sunder.

[Kitru]

950 / 14.44 = 72?

Yeah, was misremembering a Berserk adjusted time that I did a while back rather than doing the math like I should have. If you Berserk adjust (only consuming for 16 out of 18 GCDs) the Non-Fracture rotation, you get a 7.28 net TP loss/GCD and 8.34 for the Fracture Rotation, which gives you 130.5 and 113.9 GCD until you run out. With those, Non-Frac won't ever actually overcome Fracture like you said, though the difference is nowhere *near* impressive or even remotely impressive (.27% increase in total damage). At 192 GCDs (8 minutes), the difference between GCD and non-GCD is .62% ((114 * 103.3 + (192 - 114) * 78.7) / (130 * 100 + (192 - 130) * 77.5)).

Of course, for all of this, we're ignoring the fact that it clashes with buff durations causing either itself or one of your other high damage attacks to not benefit from SE. I've been *inflating* the contributions of Fracture by a small margin for the entire course of this discussion. At the marginal improvements that we're getting to, that inflation is going to actually have an impact. The difference might not be as stark as I originally conceived it to be, but the fact remains that Fracture doesn't even get close to making a noticeable impact upon anything except for your TP costs (unless you're so good that you can notice differences of fractions of a percent). Rounding error on a parser, RNG variation, and lag variability are going to have a greater impact than Fracture on total DPS.

Additionally, this just makes no sense. 950 is a purely arbitrary number.

950 isn't arbitrary. As I explained before, it's the point wherein you absolutely have to start hitting empty GCDs because none of your abilities have enough TP. The actual number is slightly higher than that thanks to the average cost being in the 60s, but 950 is the point where your total net consumption prevents you from using *any* of your attacks and forces you to wait to get more TP. It's not arbitrary. You're almost never going to actually bottom out your TP when you've got empty GCDs; you're going to get empty GCDs when you've just got too little which is where the 950 comes from for the reasons previously mentioned.

[Kitru]

3% is significant in situations where you're trying to minmax a rotation.

I be curious how you could define *less than 3%* as a significant quantity in any way (remember, it's 2.3% when you factor in auto-attack diluting its contributions). Over time, it's not even that high of a percent thanks to increased TP burn and we're assuming a lot about Fracture being used perfectly and not impacting anything else in the process.

[Sapphidia]

I be curious how you could define *less than 3%* as a significant quantity in any way (remember, it's 2.3% when you factor in auto-attack diluting its contributions). Over time, it's not even that high of a percent thanks to increased TP burn and we're assuming a lot about Fracture being used perfectly and not impacting anything else in the process.

Oh it's not huge, but by significant I mean it's something you would do to crank the optimal state from your class. Why use High Quality buttons in a blanket as a dps food when you can use cheaper normal quality and the difference is minimal? Why Meld gear with maximum materia rather than just use cheap grade 2s? Players who care about their performance want to know how to max it out.

Fact is, hitting Fracture will never be a bad thing to hit when you care about damage, unless you clip a dot or it wont run its course. You can increase your dps on long fights by about two and a half percent by using Fracture. On fights where there's pauses or shorter fights where your tp doesnt bottom out (in this case, fights which are about 60 GCDs or less) Fracture will be a noticeable boost. A Fracture rotation has an average potency of 204.4 per global up to 60 GCDs (two and a half minutes). A non fracture rotation has 196.7 potency per GCD. Discounting auto attacks, that's about a 4% increase in damage. So the damage boost fluctuates between 2% and 4% depending on fight length.

It's not a huge optimisation, but it's an optimisation. You can't justify telling warriors not to use it, because it's always going to be a worthwhile button to hit if you know it'll tick the duration. Ask a warrior "do you want 6% more crit free of charge" and they'd all say yes. Using Fracture is a similar increase.

Players like to optimise their damage. Fracture in a rotation makes it optimal. It's up to the player if they feel 2-4% is significant.

The reason I'm being argumentative here is that your maths were incorrect. Fracture is NEVER A LOSS to use, regardless of how much you try to factor in TP loss. It's always more damage-per-TP than not using it. It's fine to recommend warriors to not use Fracture because "it only increases your total dps by 2-3% depending on fight length", but it's wrong to tell them it'll reduce their dps. It wont. Well, unless they use it at silly times so the dots dont tick properly.

[armandojc3]

Oh it's not huge, but by significant I mean it's something
The reason I'm being argumentative here is that your maths were incorrect. Fracture is NEVER A LOSS to use, regardless of how much you try to factor in TP loss. It's always more damage-per-TP than not using it. It's fine to recommend warriors to not use Fracture because "it only increases your total dps by 2-3% depending on fight length", but it's wrong to tell them it'll reduce their dps. It wont. Well, unless they use it at silly times so the dots dont tick properly.

pretty much the truth

[Kitru]

The reason I'm being argumentative here is that your maths were incorrect. Fracture is NEVER A LOSS to use, regardless of how much you try to factor in TP loss. It's always more damage-per-TP than not using it. It's fine to recommend warriors to not use Fracture because "it only increases your total dps by 2-3% depending on fight length", but it's wrong to tell them it'll reduce their dps. It wont. Well, unless they use it at silly times so the dots dont tick properly.

And I'll concede that point, but you're still inflating the contributions of Fracture. It provides less than 2.3% increased DPS in an optimal situation; over time, it provides so little in addition that it's effectively a wash.

[SwordCoheir]

(remember, it's 2.3% when you factor in auto-attack diluting its contributions)

If your gonna go that route you need to consider there are times you aren't doing AA/WS damage which work inversely to your argument. For example Titan jumps several times during a fight and thats roughly 10 seconds your not doing anything, same for Ifrit and Garuda who Jump/Warp the entire fight. If your gonna factor in the AA damage as a part of your argument you have to work the moments your not doing AA even if you have to develop the math for just that scenario.

[Coramac]

950 isn't arbitrary. As I explained before, it's the point wherein you absolutely have to start hitting empty GCDs because none of your abilities have enough TP. The actual number is slightly higher than that thanks to the average cost being in the 60s, but 950 is the point where your total net consumption prevents you from using *any* of your attacks and forces you to wait to get more TP. It's not arbitrary. You're almost never going to actually bottom out your TP when you've got empty GCDs; you're going to get empty GCDs when you've just got too little which is where the 950 comes from for the reasons previously mentioned.

It is completely arbitrary as you've been using averages for everything up to this point and suddenly don't want to use averages. Additionally, it doesn't necessarily stop at 50. You need to run out a cycle to determine where it does stop. If you have 60 TP and the last ability usage is a 60 TP ability, it stops at 0. If you have 60 TP left, and the ability costs 70, it stops there. Furthermore, there is no net consumption. It is a fictitious creation you've conjured up to make it easier to work with numbers. TP is 60 / 3 seconds. You can't net a real cost against an income that hasn't been realized.

Just stop, Fracture is worth using. Stop changing and twisting your reasoning to support the exclusion of Fracture.

[Kraze]

Just stop, Fracture is worth using. Stop changing and twisting your reasoning to support the exclusion of Fracture.

Thank you. Stop raiding the forums, and go raid the game. 332 insignificant posts is scary.