[dev1058] Battle Reform Blueprint General Discussion and Feedback

[Aldarin]

I'm of mixed feelings following this announcement. one one hand, almost all of the upcoming changes are necessary and benificial to the game. on the other hand, I feel that the announced class/job system is an inelegant solution to the class specialization problem. I like the idea of jobs, including the idea that they can be unlocked from class levels. I don't like the idea that classes will be rearranged or that jobs will be restricted to certain classes. I don't believe changing class respective skills will change much, and doing so might annoy player and reduce player flexability, which is one of the high points of the game. I also don't feel that placing classes in specific roles is necessary. Looking over the original intent, the current classes are simply what weapon is used, i don't see why a player with a certain weapon can't fill any role they wish in a more realistic setting. Associating jobs with specific weapons will siply agravate this problem. I have issues with a system that doesn't allow jobs with any weapon.

I would favor adding in jobs seperately like the ffxi, in addition to the current classes, with each indepedent of each other. Yes it might add to the amount of leveling necessary for current players, but i feel it would be more realistic and more fun overall. This way jobs could be played with any weapon. I would hate to see so much of the flexibility that makes this game enjoyable disappear.

[Roaran]

For as short as it was, I thought it was extremely revealing. All the information was there just in absence of all the boring statistics that real humans aren't interesting in...

I hope the job system doesn't become too complicated, but I do like it so far

[Sorel]

Quests to unlock each job will become available once you have reached a certain rank in the corresponding class.

If Jobs are implemented exactly as written above, it would be a BIG mistake. The logical flaw is the concept that a Job has a single "corresponding" Class. It should not be that Gladiator can ONLY unlock Paladin, or Conjurer can ONLY unlock White Mage. It should be that a set of Classes can unlock quests for a set of Jobs. Examples:

• Gladiator can unlock Soldier (aka Warrior), Paladin, Red Mage, or Dark Knight.
• Conjurer can unlock White Mage, Black Mage, or Red Mage.
• Conjurer and/or Gladiator can unlock Red Mage.

As long as it isn't a one-to-one Class-to-Job mechanic, I think this will work out very well.

[Velhart]

If Jobs are implemented exactly as written above, it would be a BIG mistake. The logical flaw is the concept that a Job has a single "corresponding" Class. It should not be that Gladiator can ONLY unlock Paladin, or Conjurer can ONLY unlock White Mage. It should be that a set of Classes can unlock quests for a set of Jobs. Examples:

• Gladiator can unlock Soldier (aka Warrior), Paladin, Red Mage, or Dark Knight.
• Conjurer can unlock White Mage, Black Mage, or Red Mage.
• Conjurer and/or Gladiator can unlock Red Mage.

As long as it isn't a one-to-one Class-to-Job mechanic, I think this will work out very well.

If you look at it from another perspective. This might be a way for you to get familiar with the class in general. Like I take GLA to 30, and I finish the quest and become a Dark Knight. Right from the get-go I have abilities from the previous class that would benefit DRK.

I see what you are saying, I am just trying to look at it from a positive perspective, haha.

[BlaiseLallaise]

I don't understand how people can say that it sounds like these changes are only in the planning phase. It has been established that dungeons will be introduced in patch 1.18, and that the first of many battle system adjustments will coincide with the introduction of dungeons. Since 1.18 is next month, logically they are way beyond the planning phase. But there are many pieces to this puzzle. At worst, some of the pieces are being planned, yet others are ready to place in the final product.

On to my thoughts on the topic. I agree with those who say, as Sorel did, that it's a bad idea to give classes and jobs a one-to-one relationship. As an example, I believe the Black Mage job should be able to be unlocked by either CON or THM. I'm also not too keen on pushing classes into certain roles. Isn't that why the Job system is being created? The fact that jobs and job abilities are to be gained via quests, that kinda implies to me a lack of job levels. It sounds more like a hat you wear as opposed to a profession you gain skill in. I can't wait to see how it is implemented.

I rather enjoyed reading the blueprint. I have faith that FFXIV will be the best it can be, even if it can't be perfect for everyone.

[Irondude]

posted my thoughts about the job system here http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...nt-a-job-later

Basically Feel like im spinning my wheels trying to guess which Job Thief will fall under. Is Dagger going to be its own class?

[Illy]

I'm somewhat confused about what to be thinking about all this. There is alot of words there but for the most part little is said. Alot of it is very vague and some is very confusing. For example the bit about attribute points now being part of the rank. Well that's nice and all but then what does Phys level do? Is it gonna be removed? Is it gonna be there for no reason and just take up space? Not really explained.

I also don't like the way they are going about the job system. Yes Myself and the majority of players wanted jobs back however they should not be throwing the job system into the game along with the horribly broken class system. As it stands it's will be like having 2 different class/job systems in the game and that will be massively confusing to new players when it doesn't need to be.

I was under the impression that the jobs would be evolutions of the classes or that they were going to scrap the classes and replace them with jobs. Both of which would have been a better system then having 2 completely different systems in the game. They also don't really explain at all how jobs will work. Is it a option you just switch to like in FFXI? Or is it the same Weapon=class except now will be Weapon=job?(I know they said more info coming but they should at least given us that much as it's part of how the jobs themselves will work and if they are adding them they should have a rough idea of how they work and if they don't they should not have mentioned then at all until they did have a rough idea of the system).

I also don't like how it's mentioned that much of this content isn't coming in the 1.18 patch and that it will be split up between numerous patches and yet no time frame is given for those patches or even how many it may take to complete this overhaul(small balancing tweaks not withstanding).

I like the info. I guess my problem is it isn't as clear as it should be and isn't as detailed as it should be. All I can hope is that the 1.18 patch does something really good because I know ALOT of people are treating this as the make or break moment. Alot of people have stopped playing until the patch comes out and if it doesn't do something great then those players won't be coming back and right now that's the last thing the game needs.

[SeraviEdalborez]

Physical levels will be removed.
Jobs are specializations. Not something brand new. What's confusing? IE: become specialized at nuking/healing, DD/tank, or whatever else.
Time frame depends on how quickly testing can be done, and it will be released in pieces that -are- done, like all patches.

It's as clear as it can be without inspiring false hope. Don't just read between lines. Read -the- lines.

(I don't mean to come across as rude, just that there's too much overthinking )

[Illy]

Physical levels will be removed.
Jobs are specializations. Not something brand new. What's confusing? IE: become specialized at nuking/healing, DD/tank, or whatever else.
Time frame depends on how quickly testing can be done, and it will be released in pieces that -are- done, like all patches.

It's as clear as it can be without inspiring false hope. Don't just read between lines. Read -the- lines.

(I don't mean to come across as rude, just that there's too much overthinking )

I'm aware jobs are not something 100% new and that wasn't what my issue was. It's that they don't really explain how they will work in terms of a system(not play style or role) IE will they too be Weapon=Job? Or will it be something you toggle on and off when you unlock them. I'm also somewhat worried about redundancies when it comes down to spells and abilities. Most if not all the spells and abilities one would need for functional party play are already in the game. Will those abilities be taken from the classes and added to the jobs(which would be OK except for mages as most everything would go bye bye) Or will they have new spells and abilties or just the same things with added effectiveness. Really alot of that is Valid stuff to want to know and it's stuff they should already have planned out or a rough idea about. Especially if they are telling us about jobs.

I also know that the content will make it's when into the game when it's done but a time line of sorts is helpful. Yoshi P always either gives us a rough date(which is how we know when 1.18 is coming btw) or some kind of outline of what is more important and when we might see what. We didn't get any of that in regards to the combat stuff. Just that some will be out in 1.18 and some won't. When the game is losing players very quickly they need to be more clear on what is happening when so players don't just give up and leave(which I have been seeing first hand left and right as friends are leaving the game rather quickly)

When reading the lines doesn't give enough info(or the info you SHOULD get) you kinda have no choice but to read between them(which btw I didn't do as I was simply asking for answers and not making rash assumptions based on what I read)

[Bigglesworth]

i'm excited that attributes from gear/magic will be more meaningful. That way when we get a that special piece of dungeon gear we have been working for, we will actually see the benefits.

Also please take this opportunity to make food useful too.