Endgame too challenging and teamwork based (Hear me out)!

[sasakusaku]

its not hard or challenging imo, its pretty fun and engaging. Get a FC or something and stop trying to force pugs to work when your talking about coils.

The problem with DF titan is people try and are severely under geared for it. That is why it should have a gear check at least

I am all for challenging content other wise people will steam roll through it without much thought or effort.

However, scaling here for certain things seems a bit off. Ifirt/Garuda (for example) is perfectly puggable and the mechanics are pretty straight forward and usually easy to learn.

However when it comes to titan, it changes drastically to an encounter that is best done with experience/geared players and on some sort of team speak program.

When many people have to resort to buying Titan runs and not anything else, this makes me scratch my head.

It also makes me wonder if such an 'raid' shouldn't even be in the DF in the first place considering the coordination/skill/raid comp/and closeness to where the server is being hosted to get a good enough ping to avoid all the one shot mechanics that is needed in order to beat it. If people die to the latter, it's almost always a gaurenteed wipe which is far different from any other encounter up to this point. As said, I think the scaling between ifirt/garuada -> titan is perhaps a bit to extreme. Each their own opinion on that.

Coil is not in the DF and perhaps Titan should not be either. /shrug

[DuferBloodmoon]

However when it comes to titan, it changes drastically to an encounter that is best done with experience/geared players and on some sort of team speak program.

When many people have to resort to buying Titan runs and not anything else, this makes me scratch my head.

It also makes me wonder if such an 'raid' shouldn't even be in the DF in the first place considering the coordination/skill/raid comp/and closeness to where the server is being hosted to get a good enough ping to avoid all the one shot mechanics that is needed in order to beat it. If people die to the latter, it's almost always a gaurenteed wipe which is far different from any other encounter up to this point. As said, I think the scaling between ifirt/garuada -> titan is perhaps a bit to extreme. Each their own opinion on that.

Coil is not in the DF and perhaps Titan should not be either. /shrug

thats why people are 5 manning titan right?

[sasakusaku]

thats why people are 5 manning titan right?

5 PuGs or AF+1/Allagan/relic+1 players on a voice chat program that have been playing together for a long time?

This is most certainly not a common thing and I suspect it might be legacy players that are doing it and or the types I just listed.

[Tyrial]

5 PuGs or AF+1/Allagan/relic+1 players on a voice chat program that have been playing together for a long time?

It really doesn't matter what their gear is, people have cleared Titan wearing bikinis. I'll agree that Titan is a big step up from the other two primals and could benefit from a slight alteration to account for all the supposed lag issues (I can't comment on that since I can spit on my data center from where I live and have never seen the mystical lag that hits so many in Titan).

Take into account that we're not even supposed to be in Coil yet. They designed it to be run AFTER clearing or getting some gear from Crystal Tower. I personally wish that they'd ramp up the difficulty on CT to match and/or surpass Coil since people are already steam rolling everything but Turn 5.

[Estellios]

Hardcore content that is designed to be difficult for even the best players probably should require good teamwork which is, surprise surprise, something that also takes practice and skill.

Also keep in mind that we are currently undergeared for Coil as we are missing the level 80 gear that would bridge the gap between DL and Coil/Relic armor.

Titan is mostly a gear, mindset, and lag issue really, and hopefully the latter will be eliminated with the coming server upgrades while the former will be fixed when gear requirements are added.

[jumpstreet]

Do not change the current content you have. You will ruin your game by making the game casual. The more the difficult the game is, the longer you keep the game going. Hardcore players attract more casual players, most of your audience is hardcore players. Casual players cannot be tended to via endgame difficulty lowering. Let's take a look at WoW's playerbase as of doing this lowering difficulty mentality. After WoTLK the player base declined SEVERLY and has continued to decline until it's eventual downfall. You cannot cater to players like this. It will simply ruin the game for the hardcore players (THE ONES WHO WILL BE YOUR REOCCURING SUBSCRIPTIONS) and introduce many casual (Play for a couple months the on to the next fad) players which will greatly decrease your playerbase. The game is fun because it's hard. Endgame cannot change. DO NOT CHANGE IT OR LOSE PLAYERS. The route to casual has been the games downfall and you need to check up on your history so you can see my point.

[Lirion12]

I rather enjoy the content the way it is. (Or was, we'll find out here shortly as I download the update) The endgame isn't difficult. The problem is that you and other's don't like an enviroment that requires you to be interactive. Having to "dodge" attacks is a concept mostly foreign to MMOs. And it does produce it's own challenge. But as with anything, practice makes perfect. You want people to learn the content. Get about 5 people that can clear it. And train say, a tank, a dps, and a healer. Thus increasing the number of people capable. The server (at least mine) shuns people inexperienced. Thus, my suggestion, to all the skilled players out there. Start an EG LS to teach people. Get a group of friends and invite a whole bunch of randoms. Make your server the elites. That's just my take on it. AND STOP CHARGING PEOPLE TO GET RELICS! (You wonder why some people are bad... instead of teaching them, you allow them to pay for a carry... Greedy ass mofo's.

My 2 cents... Deuces!

[Starcore]

Well, if it was easy it would not be fun.

That was one thing i enjoyed about RIFT's new expansion the raid bosses had AI. So they never did the same things in the same order. Everyone had to be on their toes.

As for this game, requiring to much, thats what most people expect for endgame. I can tell you from experience it can be extremely frustrating when failing. But after weeks of trial and error. when you finally defeat the boss, the win taste so sweet. The point when you scream out loud and go "fucking right". For myself though, in FF14 i am actually taking the time to enjoy the game. Not rushing one bit and to be honest it feels wonderful.

But not everyone will share this opinion, MMO's are like real life. You get what you put in. If you never raid or do dungeon's you should not expect to have the best gear. But if you put in time and dedication you will have things others do not.

If its a memory thing, then it should be alot easier then something that has AI

[Gilgamesh-Merodach]

PS 4 is coming out. There'll be tons of games for you to play in single player mode where you don't have to care about your team mates.

I prefer this over a walk in a park any day. The rewarding feeling of winning is well deserved. Unlike the grind to 1.3k tomes where you know it's coming but not sure how long.

[Bluetaro]

Wiggles you make a good point. I agree that the fights might have too many mechanics in them and that they are too punishing if even a few people make mistakes. If I think back to WOW hardmodes, encounters would usually employ a few mechanics, with only end bosses in a dungeon going for multiple mechanics to learn.

If we look at FF14, Titan himself has how many moves? 5 moves, on top of a heart phase? And if you miss any one of the 5 mechanics, it becomes very rapidly hard to recover from unless the rest of the team over gears the content.

From my perspective, I see it as poor design. Getting 1 shot by multiple mechanics does nothing for gameplay value, it just adds annoyances to the players partaking in the encounter. Also it encourages players to become annoyed with others who can't dodge mechanics, and further encourages a split between "elite" players and "non-elite/casual/mechanically poor" players. I don't think its healthy for a game to have players genuinely become frustrated with playing with other members in the player base. It hurts the social aspect of the game.

However, on the flip side of the argument, if these encounters were made even easier than they already are, what else would there be left for players to do? Hundreds if not thousands of players on my server have already cleared Titan, whether that be through their own skill or by being carried by others, I feel that the majority of the playerbase has already entered into the final stages of end game content in the current game. SE probably developed the encounters this way though to increase the lifespan of their game which already is stretched thin in terms of end game content. So in that regard, I can see why encounters are the way they are. Still don't like it though.

Only time can tell if SE will be able to improve the environment and content of their game. With their current design decisions however, they are going to have to churn out a lot of content to keep up with how fast players are consuming it. I have a bad feeling they will continue to employ encounters with 5+ mechanics, aggravating instant death mechanics, and the over use of red zone dodge mechanics which will only serve to frustrate players.