Endgame too challenging and teamwork based (Hear me out)!

[Tagihi]

The only i feel sad is about the melee's in coil turn 4, Dragoon and mnk class are atm not really welcome to those fights.
I test as drg igetting beat up by the knights so i hope fight can be more melee friendly aswell.

Fight is not hard just challange and alot focus on dps race.

[DuferBloodmoon]

The only i feel sad is about the melee's in coil turn 4, Dragoon and mnk class are atm not really welcome to those fights.
I test as drg igetting beat up by the knights so i hope fight can be more melee friendly aswell.

Fight is not hard just challange and alot focus on dps race.

lol no. They are preferred.

[Tagihi]

lol no. They are preferred.

ok explain turn 4 as drg melee.
Farming turn 1 and 2 is another story..

[DuferBloodmoon]

ok explain turn 4 as drg melee.
Farming turn 1 and 2 is another story..

They tank the knights, since they are more tanky than any other DPS. Their HP normally is around 4.5k at that point making them more favorable. They give a single LB which you use later on, on the 2 dreadnaughts, they provide +dmg for BRDs, which are in every group.

[MStowastiqVahlshdeh]

@OP maybe you can talk to everyone and figure out why the content is difficult for the FC group, develop strategies together and learn by trial and error. Doesn't everyone who you are working with want to complete the content and therefore would be eager to understand or learn how or do they just say nevermind I will level a craft/gather? Seems to me you have the perfect group of people to learn how to do the content with because there is one thing in common, your group is having probs completing the same thing, according to what you said in your post. I have it worse, everyone in my ls is done with the stuff I need to do because I take too long to level. lol

[Xikaz]

I'll toss myself on the fire, I somewhat agree with the OP.

I haven't done coil yet, but I have beaten titan so I believe I have a bit of perspective on how the challenging fights are going to be in this game.

I've raided since EQ1 and while there have always been challenging fights that felt amazing to finally beat, I appreciated that a lot of them were bosses or zones that were basically gate-keepers to the more rewarding loot.

For example in the planes of power expansion in eq1 you had to beat rallos zek to unlock access to the elemental planes. Rallos was an extremely challenging fight and required 72 people to be at the top of their game to beat it. Once you were able to beat him and got access to those zones there were a lot less mechanically challenging boss fights that you could kill for much better loot than you had access to in the previous zones. The difficulty didn't really ramp back up to extreme again until you were trying to do the progression fights to unlock the next tier of zones after that. In this system you were still beating the challenging content as intended, you just weren't farming it day in and day out.


I enjoy the challenge of finally beating a really tough encounter that you struggled against. It's just not something I want to fight again every single night or every single week. Those types of fights I like to struggle against, win, move on, and be rewarded for having been able to pass the roadblock.

[Chiramu]

A thread talking about how a game is too challenging now... And there were all those threads about how the game was boring... What will the next thread be like?

OP, games are suppose to be challenging. This is not MoP WoW, you will not receive any instant gratification here. Go back to WoW.

[Eliniell]

So.. basically what you want is for all content to be mind numbingly simple? Because that's exactly what would be needed in order for a group of random people to successfully pull it off in most situations. Bahamuts Coil was specifically designed for a team of highly skilled / coordinated players to be able to clear it. It was not designed to be casually completed without those aspects in place.

[CrstyCaptin]

Like, really? What you're complaining content is too hard when it's the hardest this game will see for 6 months +. You're complaining about content that people clear in under an hour after they've done it for a while(turn 1-4)?

I mean, this is just amazing! Biggest troll thread ever!

[Wingless_Seraph]

Perhaps if people put their egos away and toned their down judgmental response, this thread wouldn't turn into the typical push button responses that plagues these forums.

You're not going to convince the OP of anything and he's probably cleared more content consistently than most people in here responding to him. So try to look at it from his perspective and think about his angle.

First and foremost games should be about entertainment, and people talking about challenge are fooling themselves in the current state of MMOs. Your idea of overcoming the challenge is to go on youtube, watch some other guild complete the fight, and spoon feed you step-by-step instructions on how to beat the encounter. The sad part is that beyond group makeup, these boss fights in FF14 are generally so scripted there is next to no variance to how you beat them. So where does that put your difficulty? In your PT makeup and the human behind the keyboard/gamepad. Take 8 mediocre players and some of the fights (Like Titan) is nigh impossible to overcome. Take 8 players with low latency and ability to dodge and most every encounter in this game is a faceroll snooze. So I ask you? Where's the challenge?

The challenge comes in what the OP is talking about, getting 7 other people with him to complete this content, which he says has been frustrating. Anyone who has ever been a raid leader or guild leader knows that there will be times where the babysitting and human management shadows the entertainment.

MMOs don't have to be this way, they've changed a great deal and if anyone is using WoW in a bad light, well you're either biased against it with some hidden motive or not being realistic. WoW is an MMO that drastically changed its raid level content and gearing progression over the long years of success it has held onto. The reality is, challenge is a murky bog of water that scales greatly from player to player. One man's challenge is another man's faceroll, and one man's frustration is another man's goal to overcome.

Middle ground needs to be achieved. Risk versus Reward is probably what people are thinking about when they talk about challenge. In reality, I believe many more people would rather be able to log in, set a goal, and achieve it without the hassle of befriending skilled players, removing dead weight from their groups, and basically turning into someone who's more concerned with min/max than just having a decent time with random people. And that's really the jist of what I get from the OP.

Debates on the rate of content completion, subscription retention, and risk versus reward are different topics all together.

Do we make MMOs more accessible to the average player or do we make them more frustrating so that only a smaller % of the playerbase can complete it? WoW went the route of accessibility and it has earned Blizzard more money than any single game in gaming history.

Personally as someone who has a history of just generally being good at these games, I find that nothing is ever really difficult to me gameplay wise in these MMOs. It comes down to finding similar skilled players who sometimes aren't the nicest people or most engaging people to play with. I'd rather it be more casual so I can pick up and play with anyone, carry on a conversation, set an evening goal and set about completing it without giving out verbal hand jobs and cherry picking people I identify with as good players.

The bad news is that you can't please everyone without some serious finances and even then you'll have praisers and haters. And a very good developer can make challenging high risk vs reward encounters for the solo player. There is room to appease everyone, but most companies don't have those resources until after the game becomes successful and being successful generally means appeasing the majority, who, unfortunately for many of the people replying in this thread, are typically not going to be your first pick to Titan or Coil.