Summoner

[Warlyx]

Wait what?
The highest dps in game, that is semi mobile unlike BLM and has combat rez which only healers have besides you, needs an edge and is not wanted for Coil?

Not sure which game you playing, afaik the only reason someone'd want bard over SMN is the silence/songs and a BLM is just a sad 3rd.

qft

SMN : battle rez + virus + eye for eye + crappy heals (but hey! ) , dots (with debuffs included) and pet dmg , instant nuke (ruinII , fester (cd and need dots)) ,AOE LB

what that support class u are talking about? i only see tank dps healer as roles Oo?

[Crescent_Dusk]

qft

SMN : battle rez + virus + eye for eye + crappy heals (but hey! ) , dots (with debuffs included) and pet dmg , instant nuke (ruinII , fester (cd and need dots)) ,AOE LB

what that support class u are talking about? i only see tank dps healer as roles Oo?

Dot debuffs that bosses are immune to, and ruin II does half the damage of a scathe and costs a metric crapton of mana.

[glim]

Dot debuffs that bosses are immune to, and ruin II does half the damage of a scathe and costs a metric crapton of mana.

which bosses are immune to our dots? ifrit not, garuda not, titan not, turn 1 not, turn 2 not, turn 3 not, turn 4 not. I don't know what the hell you're talking about.

ruin is supposed to be low damage, imagine ruin II with double it's current damage, it'll be 380-400 per hit, while your dots tick 350-400, your pets hit 190-200. that's 1000 damage every 3 seconds (NON CRIT) and without fester, do you understand how OP that will be? even now when ruin II on it's current state, it's what, 750 or so damage every 3 seconds non crits and without fester, please.

[Crescent_Dusk]

which bosses are immune to our dots? ifrit not, garuda not, titan not, turn 1 not, turn 2 not, turn 3 not, turn 4 not. I don't know what the hell you're talking about.

ruin is supposed to be low damage, imagine ruin II with double it's current damage, it'll be 380-400 per hit, while your dots tick 350-400, your pets hit 190-200. that's 1000 damage every 3 seconds (NON CRIT) and without fester, do you understand how OP that will be? even now when ruin II on it's current state, it's what, 750 or so damage every 3 seconds non crits and without fester, please.

DEBUFFS. DEBUFFS. DEBUFFS. MIASMA HAS DEBUFFS THAT BOSSES ARE IMMUNE TO.

Even the ones you can inflict like blind have extremely harsh diminishing returns, making a second summoner obsolete in debuff application.

P.S. Spam Ruin II without bard popping mana song, please. Let's see how many festers instead of energy drains you can use then.

[glim]

DEBUFFS. DEBUFFS. DEBUFFS. MIASMA HAS DEBUFFS THAT BOSSES ARE IMMUNE TO.

Even the ones you can inflict like blind have extremely harsh diminishing returns, making a second summoner obsolete in debuff application.

P.S. Spam Ruin II without bard popping mana song, please. Let's see how many festers instead of energy drains you can use then.

first of all, I do not spam ruin II, and even when I do (on movement heavy phases) I still manage to not go oom enough to pop an energy drain, and where do you need the miasma debuff, you don't need it in the first 3 primals, you don't need it in the first three turns, it is useful for the fourth turn, oh guess what.. miasma debuff works on turn 4. cutting AoE bugs heal rate by 50%, resulting in faster aoe phases. and on turn 1, if everyone's dps is high enough, there is no need to pop more than 1 or 2 slimes.

edit/additional: I forgot about garuda's heal, but miasma debuff works on garuda, so does shadowflare's 'slow', that slows movement speed, weaponskill attack speed, spellspeed and auto attackspeed, this is a big buff for the tanks, even though it says 5% chance, it's not, shadowflare's slow debuff is always up.

I'm gonna check next week if miasma debuff works on t1 boss.

[Crescent_Dusk]

first of all, I do not spam ruin II, and even when I do (on movement heavy phases) I still manage to not go oom enough to pop an energy drain, and where do you need the miasma debuff, you don't need it in the first 3 primals, you don't need it in the first three turns, it is useful for the fourth turn, oh guess what.. miasma debuff works on turn 4. cutting AoE bugs heal rate by 50%, resulting in faster aoe phases. and on turn 1, if everyone's dps is high enough, there is no need to pop more than 1 or 2 slimes.edit/additional: I forgot about garuda's heal, but miasma debuff works on garuda, so does shadowflare's 'slow', that slows movement speed, weaponskill attack speed, spellspeed and auto attackspeed, this is a big buff for the tanks, even though it says 5% chance, it's not, shadowflare's slow debuff is always up.

I'm gonna check next week if miasma debuff works on t1 boss.

Read the thread. I was responding to the guy that retorted that the DoT debuffs were some big summoner advantage over the black mage, when in fact they're of extremely niche use. Their best use is on non-boss enemies.

Here we have a thread of black mage crying when I'm pretty sure for most of the coil groups people carry black mages. The sustained damage difference against summoner is small but the burst potential gap is pretty large in the black mage's favor, and for burst aoe nothing beats him.

Summoner DPS is how it should be. If we don't get burst and it takes 7.5 seconds to setup our damage to start going at full speed, we should get the perk of higher sustained damage.

If we need to switch targets and the targets are not close, I cannot bane. I must go through my 7.5 sec dot setup all over. Meanwhile the blackmage can switch at full astral fire potency.

Same case goes for Dragoon vs. Monk. Monk SHOULD do higher sustained because the dragoon gets the perks of burst. Being able to frontload damage is of great value and it should not come on top of the best/same DPS as the class that must slowly build its damage.

Ramp up must be rewarded, or there's no point to playing the class with all the ramp up when you can play the class that doesn't need to cycle through all these abilities to start doing damage.