INCAP love [DEV1027]

[Doho]

i love monster hunter. that's all i wanted to add to this convo lol

[Rydin]

i love monster hunter. that's all i wanted to add to this convo lol

You and me both, Doho... You and me both
It shows that incaps being visible doesnt mean they have to be over the top... sometimes just showing some subtle signs of incap are cool

[Rydin]

Ok, old topic but I'm wondering if anyone else feels the same about this.

Do you think the general art of incapacitating should be simplified a little? Looking at the chart, I find that it's odd that certain moves could incap say a right leg/side but at the same time would not work for the opposite. Head is easy enough, so is the back, but why in the world are the other parts so fickle with what side you have to hit it from with particular weapon skills?

I'd rather just see the breakdown of:
Head
Limbs (either side works), or broken up into arms and legs or front limb/back limb (separate each at this point, let the weaponskill focus on either side of one region)
Back
Tail
Anything that may have been missed.

Besides that, the general idea of using this feature isn't well used at this time.

I actually don't mind how they break down the parts... the way you suggested would be fine with me

Great Buffalo is one of the better examples. Not only is there a visual cue but it also affects drops. Taking a page out of the Monster Hunter book there. They gave us a reason to break the horns.

I can't remember the last time someone actually asked about incapacitation or we actually used it for anything. It's a great system that's just kind of sitting around not being used enough.

Hopefully this, as with most things, will be addressed in 2.0.

what are some possible incaps you'd like to see manifested physically?

Me... I'd love to see the tails on Draks and eyes come off... thats my biggest wish....
Also a leg incap should come with either "Bind" or at least "Heavy" status effect
Oh.. and Dodo's have a head incap... how funny would it be to see a mangled beak on a dodo?

[Arcell]

what are some possible incaps you'd like to see manifested physically?

Me... I'd love to see the tails on Draks and eyes come off... thats my biggest wish....
Also a leg incap should come with either "Bind" or at least "Heavy" status effect
Oh.. and Dodo's have a head incap... how funny would it be to see a mangled beak on a dodo?

Tails off, claws broken, weapons/armor damage or broken, limping if leg is incapped, arm gone limp if incapped, maybe arrows stuck in a monster for Archer/Bard specific incaps, stuff like that.

All of these should also affect the battle. Status effects, drop rates, damage/defense down, change how skills work, reduce AoE ranges, etc...

[Rydin]

Tails off, claws broken, weapons/armor damage or broken, limping if leg is incapped, arm gone limp if incapped, maybe arrows stuck in a monster for Archer/Bard specific incaps, stuff like that.

All of these should also affect the battle. Status effects, drop rates, damage/defense down, change how skills work, reduce AoE ranges, etc...

On that note... Archer's with Status effect arrows... and the arrow stays visible on the MOB until the status effect wears off
Reduced AOE range is something I've never heard suggested but I love that...

[Arcell]

On that note... Archer's with Status effect arrows... and the arrow stays visible on the MOB until the status effect wears off
Reduced AOE range is something I've never heard suggested but I love that...

Arrows with different effects were part of the original plan for the game, they were never included though. Hell I think you can even still see it on the official FFXIV site lol. Status arrows would be good, or any ranged class dealing status effects would be nice.

Reduction of AoE radius was kind of in Monster Hunter with the tail swipe. If you cut the tail off, the radius would be reduced due to the now smaller tail. It wasn't super noticable but in some cases you could tell it was definitely reduced.

[Rydin]

Gotta call BS SE...

こんばんは。
Good evening,

イフの角を折るとドロップ率が上がると聞いたことがあります。
I heard if you break Ifrit's horn the drop rate increases.

ドロップ率の変動は都市伝説じゃないですかねー
I think that was a myth about the drop rate change

ごめんなさい、都市伝説です…
Sorry, that's a myth...

部位損傷の効果は、
For incap effect,

敵を弱体化させる
Weakens the enemy
敵に特殊技を使えなくさせる
Stops the enemy from using special actions/attacks
倒した後に、手に入る素材を変える（損傷部位による）
When defeating the mob the material obtained changes (depends on part you break)


となり、ドロップ率を変動させる効果はありません。
And so it wont affect the drop rate.

What you are telling us is that Incaps on Ifrit mean nothing (Because they don't weaken him, stop any actions, or open up any special loot)
Seriously... incaps could be one of the most interesting parts of the game

[Answa]

Gotta call BS SE...



What you are telling us is that Incaps on Ifrit mean nothing (Because they don't weaken him, stop any actions, or open up any special loot)
Seriously... incaps could be one of the most interesting parts of the game

No, incapacitating Ifrit does perceivably weaken him.

[Scarface]

I really do enjoy incaps.... It's a great system....

How do incaps work?
It's easy really.... Stand in the appropriate place on the appropriate MOB and use the appropriate weaponskill to do the appropriate amount of damage and you will incapacitate that part.

That sounds complicated
It's not really... once you start doing it, it's pretty simple

OK, Mr Smug.... So what place, MOB and weaponskill are appropriate?
I'll let SE tell you that
http://lodestone.finalfantasyxiv.com.../battle02.html
Lodestone incap page, A good page to bookmark

There are 7 categories of breakable monster parts
The head Need to be standing in FRONT of MOB
Left Arm Standing on the MOB's LEFT
Right Arm Standing on the MOBs RIGHT
Lower (legs) Standing anywhere in range of the MOB
Left Other Standing on the MOB's LEFT
Right Other Standing on the MOBs RIGHT
Outer Other Standing at the REAR of the MOB... pervert

I'm still confused... I need an example
ok... Let's look at an Opo-Opo (Which means the Opo-Opo family, all monkey looking MOBs, so Lemur's and Galago also)
Let's use this on a Lemur near Treespeak in The Black Shroud
On the bottom table of the Lodestone incap page, we see Lemurs (Opo-Opo) have 2 incaps.... HEAD and LEGS

Let's aim for the head
To hit the head you have to stand in front of the Lemur. You 'll know you're in the front because your damage will say "Normal Attack hits Lemur from the front for 58 damage"

What weaponskill am I using again?
On the second to last table on that page, we see that 3 classes have head incap moves.... Pugilist has Concussive Blow, Marauder has Skull Sunder and Archers have Bloodletter

That doesn't sound too tough...
Its not... stand in front of a Lemur and use Concussive Blow. The text will say "Your Concussive Blow hits the Lemur's Head for 211 damage"

So his head should be incapped, right?
Maybe.... Each breakable part on each MOB has a different amount of damage that needs to be done to incap that part. So you may have to execute more than 1 Concussive Blow to break the head. The amount of damage needed to incap a certain part is now referred to as the "Damage threshold."

How do I know when it's done?
The text will say "Lemur's Head is incapacitated"

OK, that was fun but now I have a ton of questions for you
1.Does the incap increase Drop rates for certain or all loot?
2. Does it open up an entirely new loot pool, like a rare drop is ONLY OBTAINED with the right incap?
3. Does it limit certain weaponskills or abilities that the MOB could use?
4. Does it lower any of the MOB's stats, such as lowering defense or attack?

I'll be honest... in a perfect world, each incap should do any combination of those 4 things. I call these "The 4 possible results of Incaps"

That is one of the issues with incaps. This one might not be a flaw though. Every incap could definitely do at least one of those things... we just don't know...
From my experience, breaking the horns off of a goat (HEAD incap) definitely makes horns drop more often....
and breaking the ore cluster on a Doblyn (Outer Other incap) seems to make them weaker, but none of this is backed by empirical data
If all (or at least most) incaps don't have one of the 4 effects, then I think they really should
If all incaps already have one of the 4 results and we just have yet to prove it or figure it out, then I'd be fine.
SE, you don't have to give us specifics, I'd be fine if Yoshi-P just said "Yes, all incaps serve a purpose and fall into at least one of the 4 results"

Anything you'd change to make incaps better?
Yes, Incaps should be more visible.
When you break horns on goats or buffalo, head on skeletons, ore cluster on Doblyns and a few others, you can see the visual effects of the incap
But break the head on a Goblin, the legs on a Dodo, the shell of crab, all incaps for human and beast tribe... and MANY MANY MORE.... you see absolutely no physical difference... This is one I'd like to borrow from Monster Hunter. There is a dragon called "Rathalos" and when you break its head, the scales on it just look a little damaged or broken just on the actual head of the wyvern though.
I would love to break an Amalj'aa's right arm and just see lacerations and such to show that it has been broken.... Maybe a limp when the legs have been broken
Edit: as of 1.19 Beastman (Amalj'aa, Ixali, Goblin, Kobold, Sylph, Skeleton and Humanoid) can longer be incapped but the idea remains the same...

One last thing to keep in mind, I am unsure of how MOB's with regen work with incaps. This is mainly in regards to the NM's. I've killed all of them quite a few times and have received every rare drop. I've incapped every part possible on the big NM's.

With that being said, the following is supposition and not at all tested or proven so take it with a grain of salt... or call me an idiot for believing this, I don't mind...
It seems as if the amount of damage needed for an INCAP regens if the monsters HP regens.

What does that mean for us?
It just means for the big NM's, you want to do all the incap damage in rapid succession...
For instance, say the buffalo horn needs 1000 hp worth of damage to break, you do 800 damage to the right horn and then later in the fight do another 200 damage to the right horn, you may not break it because the horn's damage threshold has regened...

All in all I LOVE incaps, it gives us something to aim for in big battles... It's fun and it's just the right mix of simplicity and complexity
I would love to see how combos, battle regimen and incapacitation fit in with the new battle system...

Lastly, sorry this took so long... but LIKE THIS if you want SE to create more visual cues for incaps, and make it so all incaps result in one of the big 4 results

Nice post. +1 for this