Rage of Halone

[Heroe]

Got in to a discussion earlier with another paladin he was claiming that you do not need to use Rage of Halone in the combo manner in order to get the enmity generation. Can anyone confirm and or deny this?

If confirmed, how much enmity is generated by spamming Halone vs comboing?

[SwordCoheir]

It's true and the same is true about Savage Blade, but you're still better off doing a full combo since it's only a measly 100 potency outside of it, not to mention the -20% STR is a major boon to you as a tank.

[Faeon]

It's true and the same is true about Savage Blade, but you're still better off doing a full combo since it's only a measly 100 potency outside of it, not to mention the -20% STR is a major boon to you as a tank.

Yes true, but ROH enmity is small compared to SB. The debuff we get from the combo is good for tanks, and completing the combo is not that hard.

[Heroe]

Yes true, but ROH enmity is small compared to SB. The debuff we get from the combo is good for tanks, and completing the combo is not that hard.

For the sake of comparing enmity generation for RoH and SB, SB generates more enmity?

[Faeon]

For the sake of comparing enmity generation for RoH and SB, SB generates more enmity?

Let me put it this way, ROH is enmity build up over time, the longer you do it over time the better it gets. SL, Provoke or these are what I would call snap aggro abilities. and SB is a somewhere in between I guess, if any of the other PLD's can comment would be good too.

[Soylent]

It's true, the enmity part of the ability is not tied to it being used in a combo. But when you use it in a combo it generates 2.6x more enmity since the potency rises by 2.6x, which means using the combo is more beneficial.

[Sapphidia]

For the sake of comparing enmity generation for RoH and SB, SB generates more enmity?

You can easily compare the relative threat generation of Savage Blade, Rage of Halone, a full combo and spamming, by using the Potency x Enmity generation calc. Savage blade has a x3 enmity modifier, Rage a x5. Both get this when spammed out of combo, but it's a multiplier over damage done.

Fast Blade is 150 Potency and its enmity is x 1 of that. Savage Blade is 100 potency out of combo, 200 potency in combo, and enmity is x 3 of that. Rage of Halone is 100 potency out of combo and 260 in combo, and enmity is x 5 of that.

Therefore, -relative- enmity values for the moves (not counting any modifiers from Shield Oath etc) are:

Fast Blade = 150
Savage Blade = 300 out of combo, 600 in combo
Rage of Halone = 500 out of combo, 1300 in combo

So you can see that doing a full Fast/Savage/Halone combo = 150+600+1300 potency threat = 2050 enmity over 3 global cooldowns. It also applies the -10% strength debuff which is huge (Rage doesnt do this when not comboed).
Spamming Rage of Halone three times in the same time period gives 1500 potency of enmity over 3 global cooldowns.

A single Rage of Halone is okay for grabbing a bit of snap aggro at the start of the fight (Rage of Halone out of combo is the single highest threat move a paladin has that only takes one GCD, slightly more than a Shield Lob) but you're simply doing it wrong if you just spam Rage of Halone. You're generating 33% more threat AND applying a debuff if you do the full Fast/Savage/Halone combo.

TLDR - spamming Halone is bad.

[PiedPiper]

If you are in group with only single target dps (either no aoe casters or just people not aoe casting), un-combo'd ROH on off targets in trash can be a fast way to seal hate without having to spam flash.

Also, any time you need to hate bounce, you can voke -> ROH out of combo (ideally yo'd set it up to have it ready, but not always doable).

Course, that's pretty situational, and.. honestly flash is just a little snoze mode. It scales with weapon damage, so by the time you are actually doing particularly ambitious pulls (multiple groups in AK for example), your gear will back up just flash spamming and aoe dps wont' pull.

[RapBreon]

Enmity is related to the damage you do, the less you do, the worse your enmity. Do not EVER spam Rage of Halone, or you'll have DPS screaming at you (I had this one pug who kept losing a Dreadnought non-stop because he thought it was viable).

If you're losing mobs in the first few globals, either throw an extra shield lob in before you start your rotation, or tell your DPS to chill for one GCD. Also pop fight or flight at the start to give yourself a lead.

[Oriaet]

Yes true, but ROH enmity is small compared to SB. The debuff we get from the combo is good for tanks, and completing the combo is not that hard.

No, just no. X3 on an ability with less potency than an ability with X5 and higher potency. Your maths are bad.