WHM Questions/Feedback from a Warrior

[LiadansWhisper]

OP is arguing that SS is more useful compared to other WHM heals as the tank gears up and increases health pool. This is only true for the scenario of a poorly geared healer and a well geared tank. Because the same can be said for healers - as they get better gear, their base heals also increase. In other words:

Stoneskin scales with tank Vit/gear
Cure I/II/Regen scales with healer Mind/Gear

In the end, SS is still less mana efficient than Cure I/Regen and has a sufficiently long cast time to not be reliable in movement intense fights. Furthermore, a stoneskin/regen combo has a higher likelihood of regen ticks overhealing as opposed to a Cure I/Regen combo that the healer has more control over. And finally, there is no way to know how much of the current stoneskin has been 'used up' vs remaining. Because of its long cast time, it would be necessary to precast stoneskin as the previous SS is wearing off.

I feel like we're speaking a different language.

Your tank has 7000 health. You put Stoneskin on him. Now he has 8260 health.

That's actual health, even if you can only see the 7000 health on him.

That's huge. That's essentially like he gained a ton more vitality without sacrificing any other secondary stats. Damage prevented is damage never taken.

Stoneskin keeps people from being one-shot. It allows lower geared players to have higher survivability in a way that no other spell a WHM has can accomplish. And if you're really smart, you can figure out swing timers in almost any encounter and pre-plan when you will cast your Stoneskin, and when you will hold it back for later. When you're playing with effective health, you have to do pre-planning, but it is 100% worth it because the payoff far exceeds anything you can do with reactive healing.

[Fiosha_Maureiba]

re: dragonflyseksparade

I would say timing the gauging the Stoneskin comes with experience, as would the timing of most abilities. Overtime, if it factors into your playstyle, you will get a rhythm of how to apply Stoneskin or if it's even worth the time / MP.

I would say, Stoneskin is not worth the cast if:
a) No enmity issues with the healer.
b) Healer not using Cleric's Stance.
c) No Disease or heal debuffs in play.
d) High healing potency healer with a low HP tank (applies to both Warrior and Paladin).
e) Ally could benefit from the full amount of a Cure I and is not capable of self-healing.
f) Not needed to survive the next wallop.

I'm sure there are more scenarios. But I do use Cleric's Stance when there's a self-healing Warrior in the party. And pure healing would be wasted in that scenario.

[Koltik]

To add to this, I was speaking with another WHM that I group with regularly (heals me in my AK speed runs), and she also feels SS should always be used when the tank is full HP. Basically, if you're between waiting for damage to hit and then casting a heal, or just casting SS while you wait for that damage, you should always stoneskin and stay ahead of the damage intake (as long as MP permits).

In my experience this isn't usually the case and WHM's just wait for that next hit to come so that they can cast cure. Do other WHM's disagree with the above train of thought? If not, why is Stoneskin so rarely used?

[LiadansWhisper]

To add to this, I was speaking with another WHM that I group with regularly (heals me in my AK speed runs), and she also feels SS should always be used when the tank is full HP. Basically, if you're between waiting for damage to hit and then casting a heal, or just casting SS while you wait for that damage, you should always stoneskin and stay ahead of the damage intake (as long as MP permits).

In my experience this isn't usually the case and WHM's just wait for that next hit to come so that they can cast cure. Do other WHM's disagree with the above train of thought? If not, why is Stoneskin so rarely used?

Two reasons:

1) It has a longer cast time than Cure or Cure II
2) It doesn't show you pretty numbers of "omg, healing done!"

Because you can't see how much damage is being absorbed, many WHM don't understand that there's actual damage being prevented. :-\

[Al_Harrington]

Neither and both at same time for me, I'm with Rynessa Star. What WHM sits there topping the tank off or applying SS during a fight? I am in Cleric Stance more then I am not. Sure during downtime or between fights in dungeons I pass out SS. Mountain Buster... why my Cure 2 heals for more and takes less time to cast allowing me to move onto Medica II for Tumelts.

[Jarlax]

yea, as some described you can't see how much is left, but if you pay attention you can sort of gauge when it will be depleted, and time recasts in your head. The regen is to cover the damage taken inbetween SS and very seldomly overheals if you wait.

Of course if the battle is rather serious SS wont work and, you need raw burst. Of course we all know that cure's are more efficient than SS we can see that by looking at the MP cost and casting 2x cure 1 or a cure II. It may be "my perception" of the situation, but it seems like if I don't need to lay down some serious numbers this method saves some SERIOUS hate and makes the tanks job a little easier when fighting packs of trash, and keeping things off you.