Do you think taking up-skirt shots of peoples characters is creepy?

[MaraD_]

to take upskirt photos of your panties

Simplified: "looking at you".

The extra detail you added to the story makes it colorful, but doesnt change anything. At best, it tries to use forceful words, to try and establish intent/personality to your examples target. (The perpetrator)

For clarification, I still consider it a rude act. But Im explaining why the argument isnt actually being handled properly, nor can it really accomplish much.
The very fact its an emotional argument, by my logic, is why its ok to be upset at someone looking at you.
But by HIS logic, the part im saying is flawed, he would equally suggest its not rude. (as much as it also suggests it is rude)
By your logic, you followed my own logic, but you added another tactic, to try and gain favor, in which you indirectly attacked the personality/intent of the perpetrator, rather than explain the perspective of the perceived victim. By comparing the two ways to observe someone, with forceful methods compared to more passive methods. Which in this thread talked about just moving the camera upward, w/o having to move towards a person like you claim. Getting closer is just a step a portion of people need to do, to get the angle needed. Most people dont actually need to get close.

This comparison is pointless. The intent doesnt matter. Hypothetically, there would be people would still be upset if it kept happening by accident IRL. But they would have less support, as the ones who are only upset by intent would be less likely to support the "cause" of those trying to stop accidental upskirt pictures IRL. (If such a thing were possible.)

[Lunavi]

especially the whole "I'd rather stare at a female butt than a male butt" when guys justify playing female characters, as if such a thing even needs justification.

To be honest, about 90% of the times I hear this it is just an excuse people throw up as it is depressingly enough a more socially acceptable answer than "I play a female character because I want to play a female character"...

[MaraD_]

To be honest, about 90% of the times I hear this it is just an excuse people throw up as it is depressingly enough a more socially acceptable answer than "I play a female character because I want to play a female character"...

The part about "Socially accepted" is correct, but not explained in the best of ways, since you're saying;
A "Why do you want to?"
B "Because I want to."

There are different reasons people play the opposite gender, but the other people either;
Dont like to hear the answer why.
Think the person is intentionally lying.
or the answer goes against their own belief, so they deny it.

Sometimes someone lies about why, but its far too common for people to assume the reason someone has a different opinion, is due to negative reasons.
(This is usually because they themselves have reasons why they DONT do/like something, so when someone else does it, they must be ok with "bad things" tied to those actions/beliefs. Such as, "Why did this person defend a murderer? They must be ok with murder themselves!")

[Lunavi]

Simplified: "looking at you".

The extra detail you added to the story makes it colorful, but doesnt change anything. At best, it tries to use forceful words, to try and establish intent/personality to your examples target. (The perpetrator)

For clarification, I still consider it a rude act. But Im explaining why the argument isnt actually being handled properly, nor can it really accomplish much.
The very fact its an emotional argument, by my logic, is why its ok to be upset at someone looking at you.
But by HIS logic, the part im saying is flawed, he would equally suggest its not rude. (as much as it also suggests it is rude)
By your logic, you followed my own logic, but you added another tactic in which you attacked the personality/intent of the perpetrator, rather than explain the perspective of the perceived victim. By comparing the two ways to observe someone, with forceful methods compared to more passive methods. Which in this thread talked about just moving the camera upward, w/o having to move towards a person like you claim. Getting closer is just a step a portion of people need to do, to get the angle needed. Most people dont actually need to get close.

This comparison is pointless. The intent doesnt matter. Hypothetically, there would be people would still be upset if it kept happening by accident IRL. But they would have less support, as the ones who are only upset by intent would be less likely to support the "cause" of those trying to stop accidental upskirt pictures IRL. (If such a thing were possible.)

Of corse I am very much concerned about the intent on a topic of whenever or not a behavior is creepy. The intent is in my opinion a huge part of what makes this behavior creepy. I didn't go into the feelings of the victim as this varies too much, especially in an MMORPG, where everyone's attachment to their character are different, and some people themselves gladly take upskirt photos of their avatar to share while if I talked about real life this part would be much more focused on as almost no one would enjoy this. My main concern with your argument was in the comparasion of someone simply looking at you and going out of their way to take upskirt photos, which while not an everyday occurrence is still common enough to be creepy. Not by any necessity harmful as this is a game after all and anyone can see the model in their small clothes by just entering the character creation screen, but creepy and (as you said) rude, which is the topic.

[Lunavi]

The part about "Socially accepted" is correct, but not explained in the best of ways, since you're saying;
A "Why do you want to?"
B "Because I want to."

There are different reasons people play the opposite gender, but the other people either;
Dont like to hear the answer why.
Think the person is intentionally lying.
or the answer goes against their own belief, so they deny it.

Sometimes someone lies about why, but its far too common for people to assume the reason someone has a different opinion, is due to negative reasons.
(This is usually because they themselves have reasons why they DONT do/like something, so when someone else does it, they must be ok with "bad things" tied to those actions/beliefs. Such as, "Why did this person defend a murderer? They must be ok with murder themselves!")

Yes, 100% agree.

[SturmChurro]

To be honest, about 90% of the times I hear this it is just an excuse people throw up as it is depressingly enough a more socially acceptable answer than "I play a female character because I want to play a female character"...

I play both. If this was like any other MMORPG I'd have probably half and half M/F characters depending on the outfit options, creator, race options, etc.. Female characters look better in this game IMO. Males don't have a lot of cool options...

Staring at their butt is a real thing though, considering how they dress their characters. Granted in this game I think there are a bunch of weebs with cat girl anime fetishes or whatever.. kind of weird.. These people are probably the same ones taking upskirt shots too. Then there are those RPers.. and the Hrothgar (literal) catcallers.

[Lunavi]

I play both. If this was like any other MMORPG I'd have probably half and half M/F characters depending on the outfit options, creator, race options, etc.. Female characters look better in this game IMO. Males don't have a lot of cool options...

Staring at their butt is a real thing though, considering how they dress their characters. Granted in this game I think there are a bunch of weebs with cat girl anime fetishes or whatever.. kind of weird.. These people are probably the same ones taking upskirt shots too. Then there are those RPers.. and the Hrothgar (literal) catcallers.

RPers are often nice to be fair, but I think I know what RPers you are talking about... :/ But yes, females in general looking better in this game aesthetically speaking is undeniably a huge reason why they are favored to be fair. And yes, staring at the butt is a real thing, but rarely the primary reason for picking females from my experience, but rather a perk.

[Sei_Konsetsu]

ok but none of that doesnt make it creepy.

Eh? I dont think any of its creepy... I think its ridiculous that people gent thir panties in a bunch over a digital avatar having its digital panties stared at..

[Sei_Konsetsu]

Emotions don't care if somethings are 'pixels on a screen'. Don't stand idly by and accept things that make you uncomfortable. Voice out your displeasure, and if they still continue to bother you, then it becomes harassment, which should be reported.

The problem here is that to many people are so thinned skinned about literally everything that its ridiculous. If the person was taking panty shots, you honestly wouldn't know unless they explicitly said so, and guess what, if that bothered you, you could just move or go somewhere else. All you see and hear bow days is safe space this and that, and to be frank, its all just really dumb. It isn't harassment if someone is going around taking panty shot pics of characters in a video game.

[Agentile]

This thread is somehow both Kafkaesque and hilarious. Keep it up!