Why Titan, Why???!!!!

I tried for a whole freaking day yesterday, keep getting past the heart phase to have our healers die...I did everything right, I avoided like 95 percent of everything and I know the fight inside out....I know it so well it makes me sad that I know when he will use plumes or landslide....I was even in a group where the lead called out the moves on vent....But still I'm trying to beat this *MF* and still no dice....I'm ready to cry. T_T It depends way to much on no one messing up....One healer dies and it ruins it for everyone else. =/ I just want my relic weapon damn it. >_>

Tank needs to rotate mitigation abilities for mountain buster. Don't do DF. Do it through a shout group and do x2 whm, sch, x4 dps (one single target at least and a brd) and a pld. Tank needs to be topped off/shield every mountain buster. Brd needs to keep rain of death debuff up. Apply virus if you have it. Everyone needs to know the pattern of titan's abilities. Open a web page with them listed if you have to or write them down. The only damage anyone should take after the heart is from tumult and maybe a bury here and there. Post heart is all about dodging and not being a hero with dps. Once you have his pattern down and people can play their job decent the fight is very easy. For me, getting healers that could do their job was the hardest part. The brd doing rain of death is really important too. -10% damage on a 4k ability is huge. For plumes you should be moving before they pop, not as they pop.

Yeah, group I had was a shout group, I don't bother with DF, everything you said we had or did....It was the healers that keep dying that was the problem....Someone did call out rotations so they knew what was coming....It's just way to hard to do without a vent group, Everyone needs to be on the ball no mistakes. Anyway I got some people from the same group I had yesterday so things might go smoother today....I hope. =/

I didn't use vent and no one took a plume or burst or anything. You just need players that actually read up on the fight and can execute without mistakes. Honestly, if I can dodge the abilities after only really getting past heart(and actually fighting titan for a couple minutes to get used to rotations) 4-5 times then winning, anyone can do it. Everyone needs to get read up, youtube, learn to max their rotations.

1 Day? It took me 3 days non stop pretty much.
Even if you know the rotation it is hard to find a group that can get through it with you.

I have to say though that the most fun part(Sarcasm) was the elitist who said they already had a Relic which I had to raise/heal before Heart, of course everyone was crap but them :)

And in my opinion best groups were with 2 WHM 1 SCH, chances 1 healer gets stoned after heart is there and you need to be able to keep tank at max health on Mountain Buster and then the AoE healing after Stomps. It's pretty much impossible if you're the only healer standing.

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Originally Posted by Illusion

And in my opinion best groups were with 2 WHM 1 SCH, chances 1 healer gets stoned after heart is there and you need to be able to keep tank at max health on Mountain Buster and then the AoE healing after Stomps. It's pretty much impossible if you're the only healer standing.

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You have a good 10 seconds at least between that stone prison and a mountain buster, since there is a landslider after prison and before mountain buster everytime. The only reason to bring a third healer is if your healers arent boss enough to do die in plumes everytime and you just want to carry him to coils

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Originally Posted by Illusion

And in my opinion best groups were with 2 WHM 1 SCH, chances 1 healer gets stoned after heart is there and you need to be able to keep tank at max health on Mountain Buster and then the AoE healing after Stomps. It's pretty much impossible if you're the only healer standing.

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Disagree. I'm a healer and I did this last night with my FC. We went with 1 SCH 1 WHM (I was the SCH), and honestly - it wasn't that bad. I had to be ready with Lustrate and Aldo to help the tank mitigate Mountain Buster (thats the SCH's main job). The SCH is better at managing mitigation than a WHM, particularly when someone dies. I was able to keep someone up with 2.6k hp through the P2 to P3 transition.

However, most of the fight is about how the DPS plays. They really cannot take a single point of unnecessary damage. That means you have to dodge plumes, landslide, and bombs pretty much 100%.

Guys I was talking about a pug point of view sorry for not stating that clearly, and with a pug 3 healers is your best bet, yes with a static or your fc or with great healers its possible but your chances in a pug are slim.

Also after the heart is dead dps gets less important, if you have 2 healers and 1 dies raising him will be very hard as a single healer which renders the fight pretty much game over unless you have LB3 which I had in my win and used :).

I should have written most safe groups instead of best.

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Originally Posted by Illusion

Guys I was talking about a pug point of view and with a pug 3 healers is your best bet, yes with a static or your fc or with great healers its possible but your chances in a pug are slim.

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That doesn't change my answer. First off, if it's true pugging then you are forced into 2 healers / 2 tanks anyway. Second, let's take a look at what kill people

1) Stomps - A simple HP gear check, one WHM is pretty close to being able to heal it off with SCH mitigation mattering in the last phase.
2) Plumes - Basically a 1.8k spike on ranged. If one DPS screws up and hits two, they are dead. Heals won't even matter.
3) Landslide - Pretty much instant death.
4) Bombs - It's possible to eat one, most pugs can't do it. I'd call these an instant death in pugs.
5) Mountain Buster - Huge damage, relies on tank to cycle abilities properly, helps if SCH casts Aldo prior to hit.

The *only* thing bringing more healers will help is the stomps, which is incidentally the least deadly thing Titan does. Bring 3 healers if you have supreme discomfort with your healers. Otherwise get more DPS and just get it done faster. There's less possibility of error the less time you spend in the battle.

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Originally Posted by FinagleABagel

That doesn't change my answer. First off, if it's true pugging then you are forced into 2 healers / 2 tanks anyway. Second, let's take a look at what kill people

1) Stomps - A simple HP gear check, one WHM is pretty close to being able to heal it off with SCH mitigation mattering in the last phase.
2) Plumes - Basically a 1.8k spike on ranged. If one DPS screws up and hits two, they are dead. Heals won't even matter.
3) Landslide - Pretty much instant death.
4) Bombs - It's possible to eat one, most pugs can't do it. I'd call these an instant death in pugs.
5) Mountain Buster - Huge damage, relies on tank to cycle abilities properly, helps if SCH casts Aldo prior to hit.

The *only* thing bringing more healers will help is the stomps, which is incidentally the least deadly thing Titan does. Bring 3 healers if you have supreme discomfort with your healers.

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Pug is Pickup Group not Duty Finder...

We all know how its done, we all know with what setups its possible, what I am saying again is with a pickup group from my experience, the safest route is with 3 healers.
He states his Healers keep dying.

"Pug is Pickup Group not Duty Finder... "

I'd consider both "pickup groups". Just two different ways of going about it.

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Originally Posted by FinagleABagel

"Pug is Pickup Group not Duty Finder... "

I'd consider both "pickup groups". Just two different ways of going about it.

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"if it's true pugging then you are forced into 2 healers / 2 tanks anyway"

Can we stop this now and get back to topic or are we going to have a debate just to have a debate?

I've had the most success with 2 SCHs actually. One assigned to the tank as their dedicated healer and one to help heal/shield the raid. The reason to bring 3 healers is more incase one gets blocked when everything goes sideways. We had a ton a wipes to that situation when we tried to 2 heal it. Even if dps get the healer instantly there are still animation delays before they can get back in the fight.

Fights not a race better to be safe.

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Originally Posted by Veurr

I've had the most success with 2 SCHs actually. /snip

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One scholar shouldn't have any problems keeping the group alive during the rock prison phases. The key is to know when Stomps are coming and to cast Succor early. There is lag between shield creation and shield usage, so you have to be several seconds ahead of the Stomps for max mitigation.

The other side of the rocks is that you usually need the DPS. You also have to break out the 2nd rock prison player during the heart phase prior to the next phase, otherwise that rocked player automatically dies. I prefer not having to assist my DPS with this part so I can focus on stacking as much mitigation as possible because that phase change is the single highest HP check in the entire battle.

As for what a pug is - give me a freaking break. The randomness of the group has NOTHING to do with it. Why you'd even bother arguing with one of the people trying to help (who has actually done this) is beyond me.

Finished this last night 30 seconds before the server came down for maintenance. PUG group.

Good healer, good archer, good thm. Sure we died a few times, but once we got cooking, I moved him to the center of the rock. Faced away from everyone but me. DPS and heals at 90, 180 and 270.

I turned off all all but necessary sound, no music ambiance etc. I turned off all but basic graphics, I was hitting 129 fps, We killed him after the 4th wipe. Everyone understood their role and understood what he was doing.

It was a thrill. I am very happy to have been able to tank it.

ps Try as I might I could never get my Shield bashes to stun him or avert his directional attacks.

I got a really good group going now...Our only issue is the point he does 8 stomps. =/

Titan isn't a fight that can be carried by good players, it can only get sabotaged by bad players. This makes it far too easy/likely for the weakest link to just ruin it for everybody else. It's statistically almost guaranteed that one in eight players will be too slow, unskilled, or simply unlucky to live in an area where the ISP isn't friendly with the damned Montreal servers that they can't effectively do Titan. Basically, if you divide the playerbase into groups of eight and try to distribute the "baddies" evenly, there will be at least one in each group.

In most games, and in most fights in this game as well, one or two particularly good players can counteract the influence of a bad player. The content doesn't become completely impossible just because one guy is below par. On Titan it pretty much does because one death is a wipe 90% of the time, and the fight is designed in such a way that a below-average player will die. If a healer dies, it's a wipe. If a DPS dies, it's almost impossible to come back because the fight is designed in such a way that succesfully ressing someone is nearly impossible, and there's a very tight DPS race halfway through that all DPS must be alive for. If the tank dies, it's a wipe because it's a one-tank fight where you can't afford to bring an emergency off-tank who can take over.

What most of the game's "upper class" does is just ensure that they don't have any bad players. They can't be blamed for this. However, this means that the rest of the playerbase has even more bad players amongst them to ruin their Titan attempts. As I'm sure anyone who tried can confirm, the odds of getting a PUG/DF group for Titan where every single player is individually good enough to never make a mistake throughout the entire fight is basically zero. Coupled with the fact that people who succeed at killing Titan have no reason to ever do it again, the whole design is simply guaranteed to hinder and frustrate 90% of the playerbase.

Every aspect of the encounter and the surrounding circumstances are just so badly thought-out and implemented. A fight with ridiculously high emphasis on twitch-reaction AoE avoidance in a game notorious for poor client-to-server communication? Check. Requires only one tank and has a DPS race that makes a second tank a huge liability to the whole attempt, but the Duty Finder gives you two tanks? Check. The encounter's reward is obsolete, giving people no reason to ever do it more than once and thus removing experienced players from the system? Check.

Everything is just violently against anyone who isn't part of a tryhard guild that does everything by itself and can kick out every player who isn't excellent. Anyone who needs to work with the general population in order to get things done, or is part of a guild that doesn't have the rare privilege of being able to throw out every imperfect member, is just so resoundingly screwed by this Titan roadblock. You'd think these problems would have occurred to the developers at some point.

I see lots of posts suggesting three heals, I really don't think that's the way to go. I feel 1 tank, 2 heals (SCH + WHM), 5 DPS is the most optimal build. This is what I used to kill titan for the first time (no one in my group had relics) and this is what I use to sell Titan runs (minus 1 DPS for whatever the carry is).

I also disagree with the statement that one bad player can ruin it for 7 others, that's just simply not true, if it was there wouldn't be anyone selling titan runs.

The most important thing to worry about on Titan is the Mountain Buster, with no CD / Virus, it hits for around 3.5k - 4k damage, and there is usually a melee hit right before it too. In short there needs to be something on the tank for it everytime. If you hadn't figured it out, he always does a set rotation after the heart phase. Without going into too much details, the tank hit is ALWAYS right after Landslide, when you see landslide you know it's time to get a CD up. It also helps if the tank is very vocal about calling out CD usage and when he needs healer buffs (virus / sanc). Also, I'm not sure what the bench mark is for MRD, but your PLD should have over 5k health.

Other than that, the only things that will kill you is probably rock mines or weight of the land. For weight of the land we always lined up in a straight line behind the boss and then spread when weight came up, this seamed to work best for us. For mines learn the patterns, when he drops them in lines the middle is usually always the first, so just go to one of the sides and then go mid right after it blows up.

Hope this helps a little :), also it's crazy how much easier it is to kill after you kill it once.

@wangstrong

I have successfully carried several of the less fortunate ones, and my setup is always a 2 healer setup, one of them was a healer with SEVERE isp issues, and another one was a dragoon who was basically dead the entire fight.
Twitch reaction isnt even needed, titan is a anticipation fight, his rotation never changes, if you cant remember it, use voicechat and make your tank call out what is next
Landslide is comming next? finish up casts and get ready to move
Stomps are comming? DPS HARD!!!! HEAL EVERY1!
Pools are comming? finish up casts and stack behind titan so all the pools are in one spot and there is pleanty of room to dodge, and always run in the forward direction to get out of plumes, strafing or backpedeling can mean death
Tableflip comming? spamheal the tank to keep it topped off!
Prison comming? break the prison fast and we have 5 seconds of BURNTIME!!! YEA!!

His rotations are
1) Landslide, stomp, repeat
2) Pools, Landslide, stomp, repeat
3) Landslide, pools, bombs, landslide, pools, prison, stomp, repeat
heart) prison, landslide, pools, stomp, prison, landslide, pools, 1shot
4) tableflip, stomp, pools, bombs +landslide, tableflip, pools, prision, landslide, repeat

If you know the rotation, the only portion groups should have trouble with is in p4, because he will always landslide while bombs are out, and this really messes with people, but he never casts landslide until the first bombs are about to blow


Circle bomb formation, bait the landslide on the center bomb (because that bomb lands last), and then run into smoke of first bomb

X bomb formation, bait the landslide on a edge bomb, and then run into a clear side

Line bomb formation, the only time this one is even a problem is when the last set of bombs land on the tankside, bait the landslide on a corner bomb, then run behind the tank to dodge landslide and then to the middle when smoke appears, you have 5 seconds before he does tableflip which will kill any dps that is still behind the tank. (for this bomb formation and this one alone my groups actually want me to tank titan on the west side, because there is more room behind the tank in this bomb formation

Problem is, people with the visual latency bug just can't avoid the plumes if they're standing in the center of them.

got my relic from duty finder
1pld 1war 2brd 1blm 1smn 2whm.
no one died even once during the fight.

im the warrior

and they all are japanese players.

Just did this fight on Duty Finder, Just queue with the Japanese people they all know the fight, it was my second time and I don't even know the boss mechanics or rotation, but I dodged everything cause I'm constantly moving (bard) quite simple fight really.
We only died cause we didn't know u had to leave the person in the gaol or you will hit enrage for the heart. I'm not even in Full darklight, if you are finding it hard replace rings and earrings with tank ones cause it gives vit. It's a survival fight.

I can only imagine the whine threads once people move into coil.

Think titan is hard, try ads or turn 4.

I tried doing this for the past 3 days and I cannot get healers that can avoid shit. I'm just so frustrated with other people. I think that's everyone's biggest complaint with titan.