I was just thinking about how the interface was streamlined for the PS3 and that got me to thinking. I know someone who knows about the architecture of the PS3 and it can operate very fast under one condition; basically it can do 8 things at once but these things have a very small amount of memory available to them... 256k I think. This however makes the PS3 harder to program (small memory constraint plus you have to manage data handling well). As an OT, this is probably why the PS3 version had to be delayed (trouble working within constraints) and why that version was going to have slightly worse graphics than the PC version on a high end PC... and why PS3 graphics tend to be a hair worse overall despite a more powerful engine; it's more difficult to program for than a 360 and most programmers, at least in the US, are lazy.
Back to the main question, was the code for the PC version originally optimized more for the PS3, its requirements, and a "simple" port in mind or not? If SE optimized how the code is broken up and handled on the PC with a PS3 in mind (like the interface which should have been PC optimized from the beginning wasn't) it would be interesting to see if that is affecting performance of the PC version any.
Was the code in this game optimized for a PS3?
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04-07-2011, 02:41 PMWinterclawWas the code in this game optimized for a PS3?
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04-07-2011, 02:53 PMPeregrine
It wasn't optimized for anything. Intel was their CPU sponsor and it seems to hog 4 cores no matter what setting it's on. Nvidia was their GPU sponsor and it ended up running better on ATI product. The PS3 version initially couldn't even run due to RAM issues.
Its interface was designed with the PS3 primarily in mind, but not its guts it seems. -
04-07-2011, 02:55 PMCorrderio
Isn't there an interview floating around somewhere about the PS3 and PC codes being different from each other instead of being ports like XI was?
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04-07-2011, 02:59 PMKilta_Firelotusthey made both version at the same time. Just the ps3 had an issue with ram so they haulted it, then it was ready then the pc version... well... ya.Quote:
Originally Posted by Corrderio
if anything ffxi was ported to pc, since ps2 was the first lauch of ffxi. Funny oit was a reversal ever where else. -
04-07-2011, 03:03 PMJennestiaYep, the PS3 version was entirely different and more compressed due to the way the PS3 handles memory.Quote:
Originally Posted by Corrderio
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04-07-2011, 08:54 PMElkwoodNo idea since I don't even remember a quote from SE saying PS3 version was ready to go. Far as I know it is still in development. There was a rumor a while back that it went gold but i highly doubt it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Corrderio
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04-07-2011, 09:16 PMJinko
Crystal tool was developed for the PS3 and then ported as a multi-platform engine to both 360 and PC, its anyone's guess which system its most optimised, although seeing as the PC version of FF14 has been the main development platform I imagine it runs best on the PC.
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04-07-2011, 09:26 PMVackashkenIgnorant and full of irony seeing the abysmal programming in this game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterclaw
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04-07-2011, 09:43 PMJinko
I'd agree with that, JP developers especially seem caught in a time warp when it comes to programming, mainly because they are used to programming for consoles, which does several things.
They don't learn basic PC development skills and they don't learn basic user interface skills and mouse control.
Even basic features like full screen with the ability to tab out are missing in this game still.
I'm hoping when SE changed development teams over they made PC development skills a priority when selecting new people. -
04-07-2011, 09:45 PMEvangela
No, It's not
but the UI... yes, they are designed for PS3. -
04-07-2011, 09:46 PMBetelgeuzah
Western developers are engineers, Japanese developers are artists.
It really shows. -
04-07-2011, 10:12 PMVackashkenDing ding ding! Winner!Quote:
Originally Posted by Betelgeuzah
One thing which really isn't addressed here is the lack of communication. Every software Engineer understands communication is the most important part of a project. US "lazy" Americans excel in programming, engineering and understand the astronomical importance of communication.
A major reason this game is utterly fried is from a total lack of communication between costumers and more importantly in this aspect between the branches of designers making the game. Perhaps the new gen of people doing games in Japan nowadays are realizing this since Yoshi (shockingly for Japanese business practices) admitted there was a total lack of communication between departments. -
04-07-2011, 10:22 PMElexiaReally? Have you even played many Japanese PC games? Clearly you haven't.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jinko
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04-07-2011, 10:25 PMEvangelaI knew... you hurt?Quote:
Originally Posted by Elexia
cuz you're one of them LOL
you need 2 months to change a single value, you're one of the programmer who get caught in a time warp -
04-07-2011, 10:26 PMCairdeas
Ram is acutally a non-issue in most cases with the PS3 structure. Just ask Naughty dog they don't use very much of it but the entire game of Uncharted 2 loads up in less then seconds. Because If I understand it correctly they use one of the data channels in the Cell Processor to act as a memory buffer.
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04-07-2011, 10:26 PMBetelgeuzahHow many engineers do you see communicating with the customers? Yeah...Quote:
Originally Posted by Vackashken
This tells us nothing about their communication in-house nor outside it. -
04-07-2011, 10:29 PMCairdeasWell-well look. I already told you: I deal with the god damn customers so the engineers don't have to. I have people skills; I am good at dealing with people. Can't you understand that? What the hell is wrong with you people?Quote:
Originally Posted by Betelgeuzah
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04-07-2011, 10:31 PMVackashkenActually he (Yoshi) has commented several times on both (the lack of communication between departments AND the player base) aside from the notorious nature of Japanese companies. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Betelgeuzah
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04-07-2011, 10:35 PMJennestiaYou seem like the only person hurt here judging by how you decided to belittle her, which her point is accurate, Square Enix =/= all of Japan and it's a sweeping generalization to say we don't know how to make PC games because most of the indie scene in Japan is PC gaming.Quote:
Originally Posted by Evangela
Ram actually is an issue, it's not a stopping block type of issue but the setup is much different from working with say the PS2 or 360 which threw a lot of developers for a loop the early years on working with the PS3.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cairdeas
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04-07-2011, 10:37 PMBetelgeuzahWhat are you even talking about? Good for you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cairdeas
And you think this is because Japanese developers are artists instead of engineers? Goddamn.Quote:
Actually he (Yoshi) has commented several times on both (the lack of communication between departments AND the player base) aside from the notorious nature of Japanese companies.
As if it didn't have anything to do with the culture differences, nope. Artists are close minded, engineers are communicative. That's how it must be. "Japanese are not xenophobic and closed as a culture while Americans aren't good at PR". You can even see that this isn't the case with our community reps (who are engineers, no doubt!). The JP reps speak less and are more formal, the U.S reps communicate a lot more often. -
04-07-2011, 10:51 PMVackashkenYou're babbling. Stop bankrupting yourself with more nonsense. It's plain as day you have no idea what you're talking about.Quote:
Originally Posted by Betelgeuzah
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04-07-2011, 11:06 PMtrinta
To the OP: I have no idea. Wish I could "like" your sig, though, you get automatic points for the Hitchhiker's reference.
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04-07-2011, 11:13 PMCairdeasOffice Space....Quote:
Originally Posted by Betelgeuzah
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04-09-2011, 02:46 PMWinterclaw
Thanks for the replies guys.
I remember hearing about the crystal tool and seeing a little movie about it, but I haven't heard much since.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jinko
Ugh. The code monkeys at least need to be engineers as does at least one or two designers.Quote:
Originally Posted by Betel
If that is true, that would explain a lot. Like bad features/designs passing QA.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vack
Office space was good. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Cairdeas
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04-09-2011, 03:13 PMindira
well most likely gonna use heavy duty compression on everything. and max out the every on the ps3 that has a cache. more pop up with the graphics that they'll try to hide when fading in and out
ps3 has 512mb of ram, 7 core processor that atleast 5 years old by the time the game comes out. people who put a SSD in there ps3 will will get the best preformance since that will help the processor from having to bottle neck while searching the drive -
04-09-2011, 09:12 PMPeregrine
Lorda day did someone just get whooshed on an Office Space reference???
I hear a lot of people saying the JP programming talent doesn't have what it takes to compete in this generation of videogaming. It's certainly concerning to see the crystal engine give them so many problems. I think someone from square officially admitted that if they had to do it over again, they would have never made the crystal engine.
Cryengine 3 is ridiculous. -
04-09-2011, 11:57 PMAlhanelem
Why do so many people try to answer questions they really don/t know the answer to?
Please stop making wild statements without sourcing them. -
04-10-2011, 12:21 AMHippo
No point to speculate. Just wait till PS3 release
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04-10-2011, 12:35 AMWinterclawWhat problems did the crystal engine give them specifically?Quote:
Originally Posted by Peregrine
Also did they have one of their best programmers make it or one of the new guys? It makes a difference. -
04-10-2011, 12:41 AMAnathiel
alright I was interested in your post until I saw your signature, wtf is that? it looks like the alien from splice. seriously creepy, and it makes my stomach turn a little bit.
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04-10-2011, 12:55 AMBruceyBruceyBangBang
The thought was to have the UI best navigated with a controller with can really be seen as for the PS3, but also to accommodate the trend of PC goers as more people are using controllers than not. Still wish they'd make it more mouse/keyboard friendly in some ways by not locking keys and allowing you to bind them to something else.
The game is primarily developed for the PC and a port would actually be more difficult to the PS3 as it would be to any other system. It's not to say that when they get to the point in which they feel the game is mostly finished the bulk of it's changes and ready to port that they won't do a great job, but just answers the question on if it was optimized for easy porting. It isn't. There is no such thing as an easy port to PS3 in general. -
04-10-2011, 12:58 AMElexiaThe engine was more of a cinematic engine and to implement seamless transitions, akin to what Konami's engine does for Metal Gear Solid 4.Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterclaw
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04-10-2011, 01:15 AMSinzfeldtYour sig.........That is the ugliest thing i have ever seen.Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterclaw
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04-10-2011, 07:13 AMWinterclaw
Elexia... that would probably was good for 13, but MMOs tend to be light on the cinematics.
Sinz, unlike some other people, I don't need to stroke my epeen by filling my sig with stats. -
04-10-2011, 07:26 AMSinzfeldtDon't know where you got the idea that everyone that has a character sig is trying to "show off", insecure much? Your sig is still ugly as hell btw.Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterclaw
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04-10-2011, 08:17 AMElexia
I like the sig lol, but beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
@Winterclaw:
It was specifically designed with XIII in mind.