Alliance Raid Duty Finder Possible Exploits being used.

Since the update when the Dev team has disabled Matchmaking system that let us queue 4-8-24man content.
High level Alliance raid especially from level 70 to 100 seemingly has a group of bot that queue together in big group, They usually botting the queue and cancelling repeatedly.

For example in one of the other day, I queue with one of my healer friend and me as a DPS, the queue start looking like this for a minute which is normal 0/3 1/6 1/15

Then this specific Loop start
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1/3 2/6 2/15 for 50 seconds
0/3 1/6 1/15 for 10 seconds
0/3 2/6 3/15 for 50 seconds
0/3 1/6 1/15 for 10 seconds
loop repeat
1/3 2/6 2/15 for 50 seconds
0/3 1/6 1/15 for 10 seconds
0/3 2/6 3/15 for 50 seconds
0/3 1/6 1/15 for 10 seconds
loop repeat
1/3 2/6 2/15 for 50 seconds
0/3 1/6 1/15 for 10 seconds
0/3 2/6 3/15 for 50 seconds
0/3 1/6 1/15 for 10 seconds
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Most prominent one is the Nier raid series where there seems to be a group of bots queuing and canceling repeatedly, And they come in odd number as if they don't want to be queue into higher-level content.
And if they dutyfinder actually brute force through them. I usually see them either cancel the pop or leave the moment before the map even load so we can't even see the name.
As of now. I am playing in Elemental - Kujata, This problem is running quite rampant that one of my friend wanted to finish Myth of the Realm series. We can't even get the lobby at all near daily reset, The bot always come at this time.
I have already reported this finding to Special Task Group to look into it because as of now. This exploit literally preventing people from getting into the match.

One of the main pattern I see that, The content that does not have people queuing for that and hoping to pull people queuing in Duty roulette to fill in the slot. I do not know how backend work but i reckon that these bot are pretty much preventing people from duty roulette to be fill into the slot.

I have came into conclusion that. Instead of we got ilvl exploit to be pull into Crystal Tower, but that exploit only affect people who run for daily quest. This exploit seemingly prevent other people from getting into the content they want to play.

Does anyone have any sort of this experiences at all?

**Edit
As of my test in my area. 60 70 80 90 Are all affected by these botting queue loop.

It is quite normal for Duty Finder to shift you between multiple queues. For example, let's say you are a DPS, it might shift you between two parties to see if there's a match:

2/3, 2/6, 1/15 (party of 2 tanks and 2 healers queued)
2/3, 1/6, 2/15 (party of 2 tanks, 1 healer and 1 DPS queued)

Another possibility is it shifting between languages queued. Each of these parties may have a separate, inidividual language selected. One of them English, the other Japanese.

As for it affecting multiple raids, it's possible to queue for multiple of them at once.

Unless there is more substantial proof of botting than this, you are likely just observing how the matching system works.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

It is quite normal for Duty Finder to shift you between multiple queues. For example, let's say you are a DPS, it might shift you between two parties to see if there's a match:

2/3, 2/6, 1/15 (party of 2 tanks and 2 healers queued)
2/3, 1/6, 2/15 (party of 2 tanks, 1 healer and 1 DPS queued)

Another possibility is it shifting between languages queued. Each of these parties may have a separate, inidividual language selected. One of them English, the other Japanese.

As for it affecting multiple raids, it's possible to queue for multiple of them at once.

Unless there is more substantial proof of botting than this, you are likely just observing how the matching system works.

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Yea at current state I do not have the proof. But for sure I have test queuing each Alliance separately, The Nier series, especially in what I tested in my area that is. Copied Factory seemingly has the biggest "bot looking" group one. At one point there were like 7 people that queue switch in timing loop and I was alone too, I waited for 20 min, Nothing pop.

Its only up until last week where I start putting stuff into timer. Then the queue requeuing is in the exact same loop, its different each day and different timing. But the pattern remain the same, Constantly role switching.

For the raid that was not affected at all I have tested are as followed
-Crystal Tower series do not have this weird queue looping like at all. (It pop quite quickly too)
-The Void Ark

The rest almost always has at least 2 people constantly switching role in the exact same loop for a long time. but yea I get it that we don't actually know in detail how backend work or if it is really duty finder shift between queuing party. This is just from the observation of weeks in the queuing pattern.
(fyi, Me and my friend queue around 2 alliance raids apart from daily quest per day so 3 alliance raid per day usually. The pattern is quite obvious from our end. These day we rarely get any pop beyond 60)
So at this point there's no proof hence, asking if there anyone experiencing this weird looking queue.

Since this update, i have not gotten into an alliance roullete that isn’t a crystal tower series. Not once.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JerryBerrry

Since this update, i have not gotten into an alliance roullete that isn’t a crystal tower series. Not once.

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Pretty much, since update its almost always Orange, Blue or Purple. So we were like queuing into other raid instead to spice thing up. But now after a few weeks recently, Queuing for other raid is now even harder to pop. I once queue for Euphrosyne and it took 5 hours to pop and its not even dead time either. Its peak play time in my area. That is when I noticed anomalous role switching is in the loop / spam. The first few weeks after the update doesn't have these loop. I record videos of my daily play, There wasnt one. It only came up weeks ago and it correlate with the same time where we no longer get anything but Blue tower.

Almost every recent Alliance roulette I get is a Crystal Tower raid, but there's almost always a first timer bonus, so this is most likely a result of worlds on my datacenter being opened up to new characters.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

It is quite normal for Duty Finder to shift you between multiple queues. For example, let's say you are a DPS, it might shift you between two parties to see if there's a match:

2/3, 2/6, 1/15 (party of 2 tanks and 2 healers queued)
2/3, 1/6, 2/15 (party of 2 tanks, 1 healer and 1 DPS queued)

Another possibility is it shifting between languages queued. Each of these parties may have a separate, inidividual language selected. One of them English, the other Japanese.

As for it affecting multiple raids, it's possible to queue for multiple of them at once.

Unless there is more substantial proof of botting than this, you are likely just observing how the matching system works.

---

I honestly think the most likely explanation here is even simpler.
I'm assuming that the matchmaking works by checking if any combination of players inside duty roulette/direct queues can form a valid instance, that instance should be formed(which seems reasonable as that would get the most people into an instance the fastest).
That is why I think it's just people from the alliance raid roulette being matched to that direct queue, and when enough other people enter the roulette, they get pulled from that into a crystal tower instance, since that is likely to be the common denominator(only mandatory one + first one available).
This is working under the previously made assumption, but I do think that behaviour would explain why the later alliance raids can take exceptionally long to queue for. Because in order for that instance to be formed there have to be enough people in the queue that have that instance unlocked to form it, which probably only happens once several people queue for the alliance raid directly, because most people that join the roulette would likely get dragged into a crystal tower instance before a sufficient number of people with the later instance unlocked are present in the queue.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Torvalis

I honestly think the most likely explanation here is even simpler.
I'm assuming that the matchmaking works by checking if any combination of players inside duty roulette/direct queues can form a valid instance, that instance should be formed(which seems reasonable as that would get the most people into an instance the fastest).
That is why I think it's just people from the alliance raid roulette being matched to that direct queue, and when enough other people enter the roulette, they get pulled from that into a crystal tower instance, since that is likely to be the common denominator(only mandatory one + first one available).
This is working under the previously made assumption, but I do think that behaviour would explain why the later alliance raids can take exceptionally long to queue for. Because in order for that instance to be formed there have to be enough people in the queue that have that instance unlocked to form it, which probably only happens once several people queue for the alliance raid directly, because most people that join the roulette would likely get dragged into a crystal tower instance before a sufficient number of people with the later instance unlocked are present in the queue.

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Yes this is what my experience with current matchmaking system work.

First the system only check party or player that directly queue into an alliance raid. Lets say there's 5 dps and 2 healer. Then the system update we get 0/3 - 2/6 - 5/15. Now all the missing slot will be fill into the slot by any people who's currently queuing into Alliance raid roulette or Mentor roulette. From my experience with how it work. The queuing system give priority depend on the wait time. Lets say if my queue is average wait time at 10minute. My queue will be put into lower priority until the time has reach at set point where then the system will actively pulling viable player from roulette into my queue.
Now the problem is these botting I meant designed in a timer when that when the matchfinder finally update the queue so it starting to pull people in. They cancel the queue and reset the whole counter thing back to zero. The player whos currently queueing into roulette that were first in the list of the people who in my queue has to be redistributed elsewhere which led to the Crystal Tower raid.
In any EVENT that it pop at all. These bot also actively decline popped the queue and it goes back to the start. Slave to my Fate ever doomed to repeat this Again and Again and Again and Again (Oh no). I 3 times tried to record the video. These bot accept the queue and leave the match immediately before they even enter the instance. So there is no way I can get their name before they leave.
If you wanted the video on how this botting looks like. I can upload into youtube and post it here if you want to see. It was recorded on last Sunday Evening to get more evidence to report this exploit.

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As note. Since 2 days after I have reported to the Special Task force group. The matchmake exploit bot are now all gone from my area since Sunday Night Japan time. I've been testing ever since until today. All exploiting bots are all gone. And the queue is now back as normal and easily pop. If Developer/GM here is reading this. I'd like to extend my gratitude to you. We can finally play the game after many weeks of this problem.

https://eu.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodes...7630fa121d3c5c

Account Terminated and Suspended certainly rose here. So I guess how matchmaking work is very straightforward as is. At least the team now know that if they are going to do this from now on. They'll need a way to prevent this from happening.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FuturePastNow

Almost every recent Alliance roulette I get is a Crystal Tower raid, but there's almost always a first timer bonus, so this is most likely a result of worlds on my datacenter being opened up to new characters.

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I don't mind getting pull into Crystal Tower raid in a roulette, That is what I signed up for. It only take one player out of 23 with less than 59 level to get pull in. My main issue is the exploit here is also preventing people from directly queueing into Non Bluetower raid.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mercury2004

I don't mind getting pull into Crystal Tower raid in a roulette, That is what I signed up for. It only take one player out of 23 with less than 59 level to get pull in. My main issue is the exploit here is also preventing people from directly queueing into Non Bluetower raid.

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Sure, that's what you signed up for. But after literal years of it being the only thing that you can ever sign up for because nothing else ever comes up in the playlist, it wears a little thin.

It also takes hours to fill parties for the Lv. 70+ alliance raids because the roulette playlist simply doesn't work as intended.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mercury2004

I don't mind getting pull into Crystal Tower raid in a roulette, That is what I signed up for. It only take one player out of 23 with less than 59 level to get pull in. My main issue is the exploit here is also preventing people from directly queueing into Non Bluetower raid.

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I disagree. I signed up to do an alliance raid from a pool of dungeon, not just & Only a Crystal Tower Raid.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BigCheez

Sure, that's what you signed up for. But after literal years of it being the only thing that you can ever sign up for because nothing else ever comes up in the playlist, it wears a little thin.

It also takes hours to fill parties for the Lv. 70+ alliance raids because the roulette playlist simply doesn't work as intended.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by JerryBerrry

I disagree. I signed up to do an alliance raid from a pool of dungeon, not just & Only a Crystal Tower Raid.

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Yea I meant, We are expected to get Fanta Orange, Blue, Purple drink from the Alliance Roulette, There's nothing much we can do from our side, It just it is what it is. Even on this side 90%, We're also cursed to be Blind to the Dark and we had to Pay the price of our Hubris to never get Out of the Labyrinth. Oh boy, I love the smell of Ancient Flare in the morning.

That's why me and my friend opt to run other Alliance raid after or before our daily reset. At least there's something fun to be had in a day. And last few weeks these Bot queue exploits has been ruining it.