Concerning Calyx (end-scene spoilers)

Someone must have better in-game lore knowledge, but what exactly is the place where Calyx wakes up?

Isn't that the rift where only Ascians and other people with the power of the Echo can be in? Like WoL and WoD?

I know that when people die they go into the aetherial sea, but I did not know before then they get to go to the atherial rift to contemplate their mistakes?

How is Calyx really anything at that point? He was a brain in a jar, basically not even a brain, he was just the memories of Calyx and the transfer seemingly failed. The only other explanation would be that the transfer did not fail and he got into the Primal and thus has access to the power of the echo in some way?

Remind me if I'm wrong, but I don't remember seeing any normal human in the dark dimension place, which I assume is the same aetherial rft ascians use to body hop and such.

As far as my understanding goes:

Calyx just barely escaped with his (completely digital) life. He's literally a program. Very likely his entire 'folder', for lack of better terms just barely escaped when the terminal exploded. His soul has already rejoined the aetherial sea or been consumed, depending on how soul cells actually work. (I'm banking on soul cells literally consuming the soul and destroying it, hence its inevitable unsustainability, but that's a different discussion.)

Regardless, he just jumped data drives. The black void is either the 'digital world' of said data drive, or just the implication of 'an unknown space', likely the latter, somewhere within Alexandria where he manifests his faux body to converse with the unknown ascian.

The black void I believe is also used in a few cutscenes with Urianger and ascians during ARR/HW, but I could be wrong.

The aetherial rift we see in both The Chrysalis and the midfight cutscene of Seat of Sacrifice is not where the 7.3 cutscene takes place. Both we, and ARR Minfillia both traverse into this space.

However, he showed sweat and feelings there as if he had a body now, and seemed shocked that he was now flesh and blood. Perhaps then, the Ascian was able to help rescue his soul and memories into a body.

Emet-Selch explained it was possible to get any other person and transform their body's aether into a vessel for themselves, that looks like whatever they want. This is backed up by the concept of creation magic or Minfilia altering hair color.

And yes, clone vessels are made for Emet, but he explained this is not required and merely saves him effort/energy.

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Originally Posted by Seraph_Variel

As far as my understanding goes:

Calyx just barely escaped with his (completely digital) life. He's literally a program. Very likely his entire 'folder', for lack of better terms just barely escaped when the terminal exploded. His soul has already rejoined the aetherial sea or been consumed, depending on how soul cells actually work. (I'm banking on soul cells literally consuming the soul and destroying it, hence its inevitable unsustainability, but that's a different discussion.)

Regardless, he just jumped data drives. The black void is either the 'digital world' of said data drive, or just the implication of 'an unknown space', likely the latter, somewhere within Alexandria where he manifests his faux body to converse with the unknown ascian.

The black void I believe is also used in a few cutscenes with Urianger and ascians during ARR/HW, but I could be wrong.

The aetherial rift we see in both The Chrysalis and the midfight cutscene of Seat of Sacrifice is not where the 7.3 cutscene takes place. Both we, and ARR Minfillia both traverse into this space.

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From what I understood he was trying to upload himself into the Primal, not another drive somewhere. And if that connection was severed his entire folder would have been lost.
And even if he wuld have been able to transfer somewhere, how is an ascian inside some electrope harddrive saying "hi?" Granted electrope is very similar to crystals that ascians use in the first place, so there is some connection there.

I don't think I've seen Urianger, but I have seen all the other Warriors of Darkness in the space with Minfliadelyn when they stopped the flood. But Urianger was only a spy doring Heavensward portion, but in ShB it was the actual Nyelbert.

And yea I do know that the actual Eatherial Rift" is different from the dark dimension place, I just don't have a name for it. other than the rift, cause it is stated that the Ascians use the rift specifically when they bodyhop and in order to stay in the material learm.
And that place is only accessible with the power of the echo.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

However, he showed sweat and feelings

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Could be one way of doing it, but what would be the reasoning for an ascian to save someone like Calyx?
Ascians tend to operate by manpulating other people and possessing their bodies to wreck havoc in the material realm, so giving Calyx a body would be really odd of them when they generally would just posess Calyx instead, but I guess if Calyx didn't have a body there would be nothing to posess either.

But that seems awefull lot of work in the first place. all Calyx really has at this pint is the information on how to possibly beat the WoL. He has zero value to an Ascian really.
Generally speaking an Ascian would want to manipulate someone or posess someone who actually has power over the material world, like the Garlean people or the Pope, because by manipulating people with power you shift the world towards light or dark.
Now granted we don't know the true wants of this new Ascian really, they might not want anything to do with Zodiark etc.

I just fail to see a true villain be born out of these two, because neither really hold any power unless they get a hold of the Milallan relic.

I think the reason why he was sweaty, and out of breath was because he had a brush with death, and the first one in a long time. He's still terrified of death even as an immortal Endless, and the destruction of his memory terminal reminded him he can still die.

As to where he escaped to, and why an Acsian can interact with him is a mystery. They could be anywhere. A thing to note is that Calyx had audible footsteps in this space, and the Ascian did not.

I hope we end them before 7.5, its honestly very underwhelming

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Originally Posted by Kirutsuki

From what I understood he was trying to upload himself into the Primal, not another drive somewhere. And if that connection was severed his entire folder would have been lost.
And even if he wuld have been able to transfer somewhere, how is an ascian inside some electrope harddrive saying "hi?" Granted electrope is very similar to crystals that ascians use in the first place, so there is some connection there.

I don't think I've seen Urianger, but I have seen all the other Warriors of Darkness in the space with Minfliadelyn when they stopped the flood. But Urianger was only a spy doring Heavensward portion, but in ShB it was the actual Nyelbert.

And yea I do know that the actual Eatherial Rift" is different from the dark dimension place, I just don't have a name for it. other than the rift, cause it is stated that the Ascians use the rift specifically when they bodyhop and in order to stay in the material learm.
And that place is only accessible with the power of the echo.

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I do believe the Aetherial rift just requires a portal or the ascian equivalent of a teleport. Hence, we pass through (What we usually see as) a void portal to fight Nabriales in The Chrysalis. The only people present at the time was us, Minfillia, and the injured Moenbryda, so I don't think the echo was a necessity.

Necron was dead at the time of him trying to upload himself, additionally, Necron was not a digital being either, it was a full blown summoning through likely arcane (as in, arcanima, arcanist) means via electrope. The conceptual summoning being something only ancients/ascians were known to be able to do be damned.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

However, he showed sweat and feelings there as if he had a body now, and seemed shocked that he was now flesh and blood. Perhaps then, the Ascian was able to help rescue his soul and memories into a body.

Emet-Selch explained it was possible to get any other person and transform their body's aether into a vessel for themselves, that looks like whatever they want. This is backed up by the concept of creation magic or Minfilia altering hair color.

And yes, clone vessels are made for Emet, but he explained this is not required and merely saves him effort/energy.

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We see in the cutscene he digitally manifests. His first line of dialogue after remanifesting is "This is Absurd. I have neither heart nor lungs." in response to his heart pounding and sweating. Just because the endless are in pseudo-bodies and are only memories, doesn't exclude them from feeling the physical traits of a body while manifested. Given Calyx had his heart pounding and was sweating at the mere thought of the player character, I think it's more akin to the first time the mask he wears cracks and we see his frustration and fear pouring out.

Hence why I believe he transferred to a hidden drive of some kind, manifests knowing he won't be found by Shale, the WoL's crew, or anyone else besides those who are part of the Winterers. Without an interface (Monitor, Pseudo-body, Sentry), he has no means of communication. So by transferring to this space, he can make the Winterers aware of his failure and get the hell out of dodge by having the ascian members take him through the interdimensional rift to... wherever he's now going to be located.

We defeated the more senior Ascians, so it may be a more rogue one like Fandaniel.

Here's the thing: I don't think the Ascian/Ancient we saw is doing things the way we've learned to expect from that group. They and Calyx and are of an entirely new group we only know as the "Winterers." We don't even know if rejoining is the goal anymore.

Fandaniel already showed us a sundered Ascian can do whatever they want and are extremely powerful.

The entire time we dealt with the Endless, I kept thinking about how the Ascians even let that happen. Emet-Selch, in particular, would be DISGUSTED by Alexandria, as his seat was entirely about making sure the cycle of life and death and the energies involved kept working. Remember, dying in the Ancient world was considered a high honor and just a step in existence, and they lived incomprehensibly long lives and knew reincarnation was real.

But no, here we see Calyx is allied with another sundered, and so I have to wonder if the goal here is to make a form of immortality with the people that exist NOW. Even the term "Winterer" invokes ideas of enduring a harsh and unforgiving time.

I think something is coming and the Winterers are trying to create ways for people to survive, even at insanely high costs. Maybe something as intangible as entropy, maybe an incoming force from the sea of stars is approaching.

I guess it would be cool if one of the Ascians is a fragment of Azem from another shard, so we have to fight our own soul fragment.

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Originally Posted by RedLolly

The entire time we dealt with the Endless, I kept thinking about how the Ascians even let that happen. Emet-Selch, in particular, would be DISGUSTED by Alexandria, as his seat was entirely about making sure the cycle of life and death and the energies involved kept working. Remember, dying in the Ancient world was considered a high honor and just a step in existence, and they lived incomprehensibly long lives and knew reincarnation was real.

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I think a interesting theory could be that, with shards having a different time flow compared to the source, time in Alexandria was flowing much much faster than in the source, and that the events leading to Endless were overshadowed by events in other shards. There is also the posibility that the entirety of the Endless were put into action AFTER Emet's death because of time dilation shenanginans. But then again, we have to consider that Krile arrived as a baby in the source, and by the time she goes back there, 400~ish years have passed?

I dont know, they could either twist it into some way the Ascians were on it, or the Winteres were hiding it from Emet

Or it could be just sloppy writing, time will tell

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Originally Posted by mallleable

I think the reason why he was sweaty, and out of breath was because he had a brush with death, and the first one in a long time. He's still terrified of death even as an immortal Endless, and the destruction of his memory terminal reminded him he can still die.

As to where he escaped to, and why an Acsian can interact with him is a mystery. They could be anywhere. A thing to note is that Calyx had audible footsteps in this space, and the Ascian did not.

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Ascians do not have shadows either (outside of ARR due to engine limitations). just a cool little detail.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

We defeated the more senior Ascians, so it may be a more rogue one like Fandaniel.

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Well, only 2 or 3 ascians left outside of lesser ascians. But yea, don't much care who he is at this point.

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Originally Posted by RedLolly

I think something is coming and the Winterers are trying to create ways for people to survive, even at insanely high costs. Maybe something as intangible as entropy, maybe an incoming force from the sea of stars is approaching.

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Could be Ultima. Or they could be influenced by her.

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Originally Posted by Kirutsuki

Well, only 2 or 3 ascians left outside of lesser ascians. But yea, don't much care who he is at this point.

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Correct, There are only 4 named seats of the convocation missing, besides Azem who was not included within the ascians. I don't know exactly what they do on an individual scale, I just don't remember, but the four remaining are Altima, Pashtarot, Halmarut and Deudalaphon. This is also excluding Lohgrif, who we know exactly what she's up to. Until we have confirmation on if Gaius killed two of them entirely through means like white auracite, we either have 2 or 4 missing.

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Originally Posted by Seraph_Variel

Correct, There are only 4 named seats of the convocation missing, besides Azem who was not included within the ascians. I don't know exactly what they do on an individual scale, I just don't remember, but the four remaining are Altima, Pashtarot, Halmarut and Deudalaphon. This is also excluding Lohgrif, who we know exactly what she's up to. Until we have confirmation on if Gaius killed two of them entirely through means like white auracite, we either have 2 or 4 missing.

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Interesting thing about Pashtarot is that they are the "preserver of discipline and order". And we just dealt with an organization called Preservation.