Why is SE promoting Solo-Players so much??

first off english isnt my main language, so sorry for whatever :)

to me every FF, if off- or online, was always about friendship, helping each other and live your dreams together and i really love that concept.

so why is it that in this ff there seems to be no need of getting together to advance (except maybe NM fights?)?

i know avoiding that ppl cant play because they, for example, need other players to level up is a good thing, but ruining the good old party experience for everyone else is really the wrong way (if its not going to be fixed with the next patches anyways, u know the dungeon stuff...)

in ffxi they added level sync after a long time so there is no huge wait time for players to get partys and it worked (somewhat) and here i think they should really promote party play much MUCH MORE and find a good solution for everyone,
like eerm hmm how bout some sort of guild where ppl can make "party orders" everyone can see them in the menue or anything and everyone joining gets some sort of reward from the guild + increased party xp of course, or something like level sync (only better and different :P) or anything like that, sry im tired lol, anyways be creative!!!)

And only in addition to that there should be the option for people that really dont have that much time or whatever to just get some xp with for example leves here or ballista in ffxi!

In the perfect case i dont want standart party grinding if u might think that, more like some sort of story driven leveling (in good old FF manner), i know thats hard to be done and needs alot of work but hey if ure polishing a rough diamond (is it said like that?) be sure to make it awesome!

Well maybe my wish will be mostly granted with the new patches and this thread is totally useless, but hey i just wanted to hear some opinions and get this out of me :)

PS: why play a MMO alone anyways? go play something offline...

I still thinking the November SP nerf patch was a big suicide

yes, when you force people to solo C/Doblyns from r1 to r50 and get more sp than party grinding... it's suicide

The current state of FFXIV is not how they want it. They are trying to fix it.

we need more party play its just fun

I think they can see from FFXI that there was a large divide between the amount of content available, and the percentage of people that actually completed that content. By making soloing viable, they are trying to ensure more people actually experience the game instead of playing for a bit and then quitting because they couldn't get a group to get help for a certain mission.

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I think they can see from FFXI that there was a large divide between the amount of content available, and the percentage of people that actually completed that content. By making soloing viable, they are trying to ensure more people actually experience the game instead of playing for a bit and then quitting because they couldn't get a group to get help for a certain mission.

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thats totally what i mean with they should be creative with this and promote party play in a very different way than in ffxi in its beginning!

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Originally Posted by Fabijansven

thats totally what i mean with they should be creative with this and promote party play in a very different way than in ffxi in its beginning!

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HOW!!!!!???

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Originally Posted by DNO

HOW!!!!!???

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did u read my first post here?

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how bout some sort of guild where ppl can make "party orders" everyone can see them in the menue or anything and everyone joining gets some sort of reward from the guild + increased party xp of course, or something like level sync (only better and different :P) or anything like that, sry im tired lol, anyways be creative!!!)

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In the perfect case i dont want standart party grinding if u might think that, more like some sort of story driven leveling (in good old FF manner), i know thats hard to be done and needs alot of work but hey if ure polishing a rough diamond (is it said like that?) be sure to make it awesome!

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and being creative doesnt mean asking others how to do shit lol :P

Both solo and party play are important, some games get it right and some dont.

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Originally Posted by TonyMontana

Both solo and party play are important, some games get it right and some dont.

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sry that might sound weird but i think if u do it right there is no need for solo play...

Edit: but i dont think FFXIV will ever be that way :)

They need to have combined attacks, like in the intro video, where the Lalafell sets the Archer's arrow on fire to defeat the Malboro. Marlboro. Morbol. However they're spelling it this time. In my idea for a MMO, I pretty much envision a dual-tech and triple-tech system (like CT) where you obtain your abilities from equipment (like in FFIX and Tactics). I love how S-E strives to innovate but (to beat a dead analogy) always trying to reinvent the wheel isn't always a good thing.

Problem: People complain how it takes so long to do things in XI due to needing lots of people to play together
Old Team Solution: Make it all solo!
New Team Solution: Base content around 4 players, 4 is standard, most COOP games provide 4.

I think this is how events turned out lol new team thought it through, old team did not.

If you applied old teams solution to something like XI in its current stage, sure it works. But XIV was BRAND new, everyone is going to be on it and during the first couple months it was not hard to find people, hell you all remember the 15man raptor pt, when did you ever get 18 people on XI to "level" lol. Why SE didnt think about this I dont know but finding friends to play with is not hard in this game!!

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Originally Posted by Fabijansven

i know avoiding that ppl cant play because they, for example, need other players to level up is a good thing, but ruining the good old party experience for everyone else is really the wrong way (if its not going to be fixed with the next patches anyways, u know the dungeon stuff...)

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I dont know why people think that its magic, rainbows and unicorns for solo players, they're doing the same thing everyone else is doing. :V

and grouping= kill harder mobs faster=more sp, up to eight players.

As long as they give enough options for solo, duo, 4-man, and 8-man parties, then everything will be fine. The more playstyles they can cater to (WITHOUT detrimentally impacting the enjoyment of the game for people with other preferred playstyles), the better off we all are.

4 or 5 years ago i'll be up the "party only wagon" because i had a lot of free time and could play 5 hours/day or more, but now i can't play a game that need me for a long time. So i'm really nice to have this game on this way, anyways i think both, party and solo are very important, depend on the player want.

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Originally Posted by Nephera

I dont know why people think that its magic, rainbows and unicorns for solo players, they're doing the same thing everyone else is doing. :V

and grouping= kill harder mobs faster=more sp, up to eight players.

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thats what i ment, there is no everyone else atm for the most part... (anyway lets wait for patch 1.17 and the following ones)

and @vax, this is no party only wagon :) , same thing as above, at the moment i really miss party play thats all im up to... lol

You can't cater to a group dynamic without first understanding the individual. Shortcuts in this regard produce bad results. This goes both ways.

Also, I don't know if you get out in the virtual social scene much, but the layout of the world lends itself to group play. Its difficult to see if you're used to every other mmo out there, but the game only seems to focus on solo players, but in actuality, it is story based content that you are likely misjudging as 'solo' candy. And yet, in a way it really is solo appeasement... but, if you didn't like playing the game alone by your computer (aka solo) then you wouldn't like the game.

i played ffxi and only played 2 hrs a day, I still got parties and had fun. All you had to do was make sure the person you in advance. It also helps to log on and be ready to party. Like going to known party location for your level and asking leaders. It helps to have more time, and obviousely it will take you a bit longer. But I never cared about how much I got done. I was just happy to play the game.

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Originally Posted by Morphemes

You can't cater to a group dynamic without first understanding the individual. Shortcuts in this regard produce bad results. This goes both ways.

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guess youre right, even though i doubt SE planned that way lol

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Originally Posted by Fabijansven

sry that might sound weird but i think if u do it right there is no need for solo play...

Edit: but i dont think FFXIV will ever be that way :)

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Wrong there are many reasons for needing solo play.

Why should a solo player not have content designed for them if they are willing to pay the money? MMO developers need all the money they can get and supporting solo play is a smart for many reasons. The original generation of MMOers are getting older now, many have kids and more responsibilities nowadays and only can get in short play sessions. MMOs nowadays that do not support a wide range of play styles are destined for failure. Most people have lives and there needs to be quick in and out content as well as content to be done solo. There is nothing wrong with supporting solo content. The issue here is SE needs to get a proper balance going. There need to be more reasons to group, while making solo viable and rewarding as well.

Solo does not equate to "I never want to group". It's there because sometimes you don't have the time to commit to a party, believe me the vast majority of the population still playing would go find another game if you couldn't have content to solo when you were in need of it.

Solo Play, Group Play, Raid/NM, an MMO needs all these to survive in more than a small hardcore niche.

I guess people are completely ignoring the fact that you get bonus SP from being in a party. And you can get hella SP from doing leve-linking and behests.

Afterall, those aren't incentives to party at all. >.>

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Originally Posted by Morphemes

You can't cater to a group dynamic without first understanding the individual. Shortcuts in this regard produce bad results. This goes both ways.

Also, I don't know if you get out in the virtual social scene much, but the layout of the world lends itself to group play. Its difficult to see if you're used to every other mmo out there, but the game only seems to focus on solo players, but in actuality, it is story based content that you are likely misjudging as 'solo' candy. And yet, in a way it really is solo appeasement... but, if you didn't like playing the game alone by your computer (aka solo) then you wouldn't like the game.

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hmmm my english aint that good so i needed like 5 times reading this lol,
but first: i didnt judge any content (at least i think so :P ) i more likely said what content i miss and we all look forward to the next patches beeing this content ,
second: this is my 3rd mmo (first ffxi, later till now eve online)
and third: maybe i have 5 other ppl at my home playing ffxiv with me and thats the only reason i still play it? hahaha just kidding but seriously i would love (not only like) the game if there would be more motivation to play with other ppl, my opinion (thanks for respecting it :) )

@ Vesper: hmmm well with "if u make it right" i ment even please the ones that dont have that much time and still dont have solo play (thats why i wrote "sounds weird" infront :) ) fun idea isnt it? thats surely hardcore to accomplish but its success would only depend on how its carried out and how ppl like it not existing of the option in itself.

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Originally Posted by Fabijansven

hmmm my english aint that good so i needed like 5 times reading this lol,
but first: i didnt judge any content (at least i think so :P ) i more likely said what content i miss and we all look forward to the next patches beeing this content ,
second: this is my 3rd mmo (first ffxi, later till now eve online)
and third: maybe i have 5 other ppl at my home playing ffxiv with me and thats the only reason i still play it? hahaha just kidding but seriously i would love (not only like) the game if there would be more motivation to play with other ppl, my opinion (thanks for respecting it :) )

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What you failed to understand is that, there is a need of content for players like you that enjoy party play, and there is also a need for players who don't have the time, or will, to seek up for parties and would prefer soloing most part of the game. If both type of players can play along in the same game, the company that make such a game gets more money and it (could) also means more potential people for players that like to party to team up with.

Personally I do not find this game to be "too" solo friendly when it comes to battle classes. While you can solo grind or do leves by yourself, it is simply more efficient to gain SP in a leve/grind party, which makes a big difference at higher ranks. Heck, I'm R40+ and I can't make progress at a decent rate except in parties! Which, I might add, don't just magically appear whenever I feel like playing. >.<

Personally, I find the disparity between "solo-friendly-ness" at lower/mid ranks vs. higher ranks to be a bit much. Players might start out in the game and get used to not needing to party, then at higher ranks when they kinda need to they aren't used to it.

As for why solo players still like MMO's . . . maybe due to RL they just can't often do activities with other players, but still enjoy the less scheduled and time-intensive social aspects such as chatting? And I don't remember where I saw this said, but I agree that in an MMO, "other players are content"!

They need to focus on making content interesting, fun, and dynamic enough to play. Nerfing party SP wouldn't be so bad if the game was actually 'continuously fun' to play, solo or party.

Do not be confused: them nerfing party SP had nothing to do with favoring solo play over party play, and it sure didn't improve the experience of playing the game. (Hell, they probably did it to add a thicker gate for keeping people from too quickly hitting the level cap... but honestly, I wouldn't care about that at all if the content was fun enough and had a high replay value... and yes, I am using more than just 'WoW' as a benchmark for what is fun in a game)

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Originally Posted by Fleur

Personally I do not find this game to be "too" solo friendly when it comes to battle classes. While you can solo grind or do leves by yourself, it is simply more efficient to gain SP in a leve/grind party, which makes a big difference at higher ranks. Heck, I'm R40+ and I can't make progress at a decent rate except in parties! Which, I might add, don't just magically appear whenever I feel like playing. >.<

Personally, I find the disparity between "solo-friendly-ness" at lower/mid ranks vs. higher ranks to be a bit much. Players might start out in the game and get used to not needing to party, then at higher ranks when they kinda need to they aren't used to it.

As for why solo players still like MMO's . . . maybe due to RL they just can't often do activities with other players, but still enjoy the less scheduled and time-intensive social aspects such as chatting? And I don't remember where I saw this said, but I agree that in an MMO, "other players are content"!

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I know a few months ago before the sp adjustment, it was more efficient to solo grind on c/doblyns than it was to party, but then they upped party SP and nerfed coblyn HP. What do people solo grind on now? No one really talks about grinding on anything else except coblyns, and I assume they aren't doing that now.

Except for leves, I don't see a solo option for DoW/DoM (and really leves are better linked anyway). So even though solo is an option right now, it isn't really a good one.

lol guess ure right Fleur and like Vesper said theres much balancing to do...

@ PandaTaru well i understand what ure saying, but u have to understand that i never said delete all solo content. i ment more like please fokus on party a little more... (like they are obviously about to do)

anyways, im off to work... thanks for the fun guys, being bored at 2am often leads to weird threads, lol sry

The crafting classes put the final nail in the party-play coffin. Content needs to be accessible to people who play crafting classes.

Dobs nerf was needed.. it was a huge loophole in the sp/party system. Leves are a good solo content. Anything else past that shouldn't be as easy as Dobs were before they get nerfed as it open loopholes.

Don't forget that if you solo, you play the game with the some facts in mind. Like the one that you're not aiming for end-game anytime soon or you're out to get huge SP gain in a short time...

Indeed, crafting and gathering are solo activities. I was kind of disappointed that you can't form a gathering party and get some sort of bonus. ;_;

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Originally Posted by Iggy

I know a few months ago before the sp adjustment, it was more efficient to solo grind on c/doblyns than it was to party, but then they upped party SP and nerfed coblyn HP. What do people solo grind on now? No one really talks about grinding on anything else except coblyns, and I assume they aren't doing that now.

Except for leves, I don't see a solo option for DoW/DoM (and really leves are better linked anyway). So even though solo is an option right now, it isn't really a good one.

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I also find solo grinding to be pretty lousy. Kill yellow mob solo = 250 sp vs Kill raptor in party = 350 sp (with less time/effort). I've found that diremites, sphene doblyns, etc near the entrance to the ferries and around the Footfalls in Thanalan are ok, and the areas near Widow Cliffs in La Noscea looks like a nice spot for late R40's. But still, nowhere near as good as partying, and I have no idea what others grind on alone.