Occult Relic grind needs to change.

As it has been confirmed now, it is a one time grind, and as such it does not seem THAT bad.

so the relic grind
is grindy?

Generally as we get more patches, the drop rates will be increased
but starting out it's always been low
it's far better than a glorified tomestone weapon

I'm curious how the drop rate is for normal world fates in comparison. I'll give it a go in the next day or two and see how it goes.
But in topic here, I agree. The drop rate in ocult is stupidly low. I spent about 6 hours in there and only got 3.
I also wonder if the atmas always drop one that you need or can you end up with 6 of a certain one before getting the one you need?

huh I will correct you here (edit because like a dummy I sent post before finishing xx)) it is 6 per relic and only need 3, different color so 3 unique then the 3 other can be duplicate and will work tho the drop is shit I grinded all day to only get 3 atma and my friend is there having 4 relic -_-

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Originally Posted by Fieyaval

Aight after farming for about 6 hours and getting only 3 demi atmas, I'm not too terribly excited about the grind.
I'm gonna do a quick little calc here, lowballing it for demonstration purposes, and hope that CBU 3 sees it and acts:

You need 6 different colors of atma
Per color you need 3.
That leaves us with 6x3=18 atma PER relic.
For 21 relics that's 378 atmas
I got 3 atmas in 6 hours, but I'm gonna lowball it and say you got a massive group going for them, getting one every hour.
That leaves you with 378 hours divided by 24 = 15.75 DAYS.

This is just not feasable or fun. They don't look anywhere near good enough and the area isn't THAT good.
So the way to fix this is really easy for them tbh:
Option 1 = Buff the drop rate quite a bit.
Option 2 = Buff drop rate a bit and lower materials used.

None of that should be hard to implement for CBU3. I have no good idea why they'd make it this hard, other than "give us something to chew on". But we're chewing on rocks, which we do NOT like doing. So at the end of things I'm at a loss, and it just might cost them subs.

Sincerely,
A very concerned player

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Yeah but if they dont up the grind then the jobless Content Creators are gonna cry they have nothing to play 24/7 and to make a living out of FF14 again like in EW and the game is so dead circlejerk. So please think of the Children Streamers /s

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Originally Posted by Thurmnmurmn

I'm curious how the drop rate is for normal world fates in comparison. I'll give it a go in the next day or two and see how it goes.
But in topic here, I agree. The drop rate in ocult is stupidly low. I spent about 6 hours in there and only got 3.
I also wonder if the atmas always drop one that you need or can you end up with 6 of a certain one before getting the one you need?

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so to be fair it seem to rotate the atma but taking away the one you have so if it is the case it's good if it is random well I just got lucky

oh here we go, first people complained that tomestones weren't grindy, because a relic MUST be grindy, because farming the same fates over and over is a lot more epic than just gathering tomes, and now the grind is bad because it's not th exact type of grind that you or others wanted as if Yoshi has a crystal ball to look in your mind..... this playerbase doesn't know what they want.

or well, i know that the tomes respected my time and didn't have to waste time on fates, but yall complained so... now you get atma 2.0 so shut up and grind

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Originally Posted by SoleilAlphi

oh here we go, first people complained that tomestones weren't grindy, because a relic MUST be grindy, because farming the same fates over and over is a lot more epic than just gathering tomes, and now the grind is bad because it's not th exact type of grind that you or others wanted as if Yoshi has a crystal ball to look in your mind..... this playerbase doesn't know what they want.

or well, i know that the tomes respected my time and didn't have to waste time on fates, but yall complained so... now you get atma 2.0 so shut up and grind

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Someone's a bit salty. Calm down my friend.
For starters, the forums are not one entity. There are people here both for and against the old ew relic "grind".
Second, there is such a thing as a middle ground. It doesn't need to be one extreme or another.

I am not salty, but i have to laugh at how first no grind sucks, then the grind sucks, give it a week and folks will want the tomes back

There's a certain breed of player for whom the endgame is writing up complaints on the forum. New content isn't fun for them. It's complaining about new content. Not for them? They will let you know.

You're on the forums. The players are told to come complain here. So of course you'll see people complain. It's impossible to please everyone.
The difference of the 2 sides will be determined by how much traction their complaints get.

Huh...

So they went this route? LOL.

I've honestly been doing Eureka again with a friend over Occult Crescent.

Honestly sounds like I am not missing much.

Isn't this what people wanted though? :/
Everyone was complaining over Endwalker's relic being too easy, not involved enough, and not nearly as grindy as it should be. They took that feedback and brought us back to having a grindy relic weapon!
~16 days is nothing in the grand scheme of things considering we still got atleast 2 months until 7.3 drops, it's meant to be something you work at overtime as opposed to in the first day or to collect every single one of them before the next patch drops.

It's effing annoying to read SAME complaints. This whole situation lead to no open field exploration in Endwalker & tomestone relic.
I'm not saying OC has no flaws, but reading how people are literally entitled to own relics DAY 1 makes me facepalm.

Do you also scream at your shopkeeper whenever you don't get something?

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Originally Posted by XtremePrime

Isn't this what people wanted though? :/
Everyone was complaining over Endwalker's relic being too easy, not involved enough, and not nearly as grindy as it should be. They took that feedback and brought us back to having a grindy relic weapon!
~16 days is nothing in the grand scheme of things considering we still got atleast 2 months until 7.3 drops, it's meant to be something you work at overtime as opposed to in the first day or to collect every single one of them before the next patch drops.

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I don’t think the issue is that there is a grind, from what I can gather it seems like the issue is type of grind or how that grind is actually designed. I think most people would prefer a a very slow but guaranteed progress grind, over a grind that is a grind by virtue of random chance - even if they ultimately take the same length of time to reach the end destination

I generally dislike RNG drops for Relics, but considering what they used to be like (ARR Atma was a flat 2% per fate and you needed 12 of them, which could involve potential WEEKS of trying with no luck) this is downright merciful. I've gotten a handful of them just progressing Occult and from what I've seen, the drop rate for regular fates in DT zones isn't great, but I had 2 drop within a reasonable timeframe.

I actually like the idea of having a one-time long step and subsequent ones are much less of a hassle, I know people complain about tomes, but at least you can accrue those just by playing the game and not needing to run Crystal Tower 15 times to make one relic.

So, I'm just going to say this.

If you don't like the grind, then just don't do it. It's that simple.

Looking back, we've got the duality of man here where we first had people complaining about Tomestones being too easy(because they're farmable and grindable - and there wasn't anything to be gained other than more Hildibrand shenanigans in EW, let's be real). Then we now have people saying the grind is too hard. It's like me saying that ARR Atmas are a problem when I don't go out to do it myself and then complain when I don't get drops for 5 hours.

Like seriously, people: Get it in your head what you want and stick with it. Of course, I'd also like to blame consumerism but that's an entirely different topic...

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Originally Posted by SoleilAlphi

I am not salty, but i have to laugh at how first no grind sucks, then the grind sucks, give it a week and folks will want the tomes back

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honestly I would take just like a 10% or 5% more because it make me cry when my friend have four relic in 14 hours and me just half way doney first one ;-; and we both started at the sametime tho I just drop and still at three

People not realizing there's a middle ground between "Basically free" and "Mind numbing RNG grind that makes you want to jump off a cliff"

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Originally Posted by Thurmnmurmn

I'm curious how the drop rate is for normal world fates in comparison. I'll give it a go in the next day or two and see how it goes.
But in topic here, I agree. The drop rate in ocult is stupidly low. I spent about 6 hours in there and only got 3.
I also wonder if the atmas always drop one that you need or can you end up with 6 of a certain one before getting the one you need?

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The droprate for the normal world fates is horrible, I've done 20 and not a single drop, don't bother

Well, from 4 of these critical FATEs or what they are called, I participated I got 3 Atmas. I guess it's just luck in the end.

No. I love that it grindy and RNG based. I loved OSRS in large part because of the grinds, but hated the combat. Too much clicking. I like the combat in FFXIV, so gimme a big grind and I'll be happy.

Other than Ultimate weapons, Relic weapons are supposed to be the dopest and most prestigious weapons in the game. An extremely lengthy weapon grind of AT LEAST 70 hours is appropriate imo.

I'm glad we finally have a grind again but I also don't like how it feels like reliving ptsd of 2013 atma grind again farming fates for 10 hours for just 1 drop lol. I wouldn't mind a slight increase in drop rate but not make it too easy.

My hot take is that the current state is completely fine. Relics are supposed to be something you earn, not something you simply get, and most importantly, they are not something that should be commonly seen, the only problem I see is how wild the swing from EW to DT relics ended up being, but EW relics were dire.

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Originally Posted by Nebelheim

I also don't like how it feels like reliving ptsd of 2013 atma grind again farming fates for 10 hours for just 1 drop lol.

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I get your point, but I also found WoL recoiling at the word "atma" to be comedy gold, they know what they are doing and it tickled me so.

Haha, i knew it people will complain about it, every fucking relic besides the tomestone was the same "oh i need to do something i cant do disgusting eRP in Limsa so i complain" you know that is the exactly reason why we cant have good things in the game because people are starting to complain about everything, freaking crybabys

so no the grind shouldnt change, it should stay how it is and judging from the first step get ready to grind the special crescent dungeon in the future because that thing will be 100% involved.

You obviously weren't around for the actual atma grind in ARR.

It's called demiatma because it's a "nerfed" version of that grind. Get it? That's the joke and the reason for the name, and all those facial expressions were aimed at people who did it.

Also, it was meant to take that long for just 1 relic in ARR. You're saying it takes that long for all relics. That's pretty good then. Because most people are only going to do 1-3 relics. Doing all of them is just for completionists that love grinds and endlessly grinding every achievement in the game.

If you have ok RNG you might have one weapon by the end of the first day if you on the other hand have horrific rng Like i did today 15 CE, 30 fates zero atma. It's one thing to have a grind, it's another not to have any progress at all.
Now this ain't new Like OG ARR Atma, Like when both Eureka and Bozja launched the drop rates were horrific I expect them to up the drop rates in a hotfix if you don't like the grind it will improve. It would have been nice if they paid attention to what worked in the past, but they didn't. It's the first relic step and it shouldn't be more grindy at the start. As you progress through the steps, it will become more grindy.. IE Start off kinda easy then get more grindy as move along through it. That is why ShB and Boizja worked well.

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Originally Posted by Nebelheim

I'm glad we finally have a grind again but I also don't like how it feels like reliving ptsd of 2013 atma grind again farming fates for 10 hours for just 1 drop lol. I wouldn't mind a slight increase in drop rate but not make it too easy.

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It's a one-off step. For every relic after the first, this step is just giving the drunk some tomestones.

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Originally Posted by xbahax92

It's effing annoying to read SAME complaints. This whole situation lead to no open field exploration in Endwalker & tomestone relic.
I'm not saying OC has no flaws, but reading how people are literally entitled to own relics DAY 1 makes me facepalm.

Do you also scream at your shopkeeper whenever you don't get something?

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Honey, if Vons runs out Magnum Double Raspberry Ice Creams Bars, you can bet your sweet bippy I'm going full Karen.

I wanted a grind, but not an RNG grind.

I would prefer "gather 100 of this item" and each fate grants 1 item over "gather 18 of this item" and then play for 5 hours and get exactly 1, which is what I just did.

RNG grinds are the worst. I logged out wishing I had just spent those 5 hours playing a different video game.

Also, the bosses are hard enough to actually need you to focus, which means you can't just turn your brain off and listen to an audio book or youtube or something. So not only is it an extremely long grind where you do not make guaranteed progress, you have to pay attention during a lot of it.

Oh hell nah, you can't be saying that after the expansion we just had.


It's okay for content to last for more than a single day. Let us have this.

I was in there for about 8 hours tonight… granted the first couple were doing the first few quests, attuning to all the aetherytes and killing things for the challenge logs. But still NOT ONE drop for the relic. I thought the drop rate for in-zone was supposed to be higher than the outside regular fates, but from what I hear, it’s terrible for both. To be clear, I don’t mind the grind, it’s the RNG I hate. I should have something to show for 6 hours worth of Fates/CEs.

Btw after seeing now the complains about the grind, cant wait to see the first complains about forked towers (cresents version of BA and Delubrum) because judging from Xenos Boss1 clear, that is something which needs again a lot of team work and mech knowledge, so im already seeing complains in direction " thats on savage level nerf pls its not for casuals which want only do eRP"

The only thing that needs to change is people who don’t want to grind learning that they can just not do the content.
It’s a relic grind, it is supposed to be grindy and long.
I don’t want the tomestone approach back.
Leave those of us who actually always liked how it was those breadcrumbs.

I also have bad luck with the drops and I refuse to do it outside the isle but you know what?
I don’t mind.
I do the fates and CE’s anyway so when such a thing drops the better.
Just enjoy the content and you will get the atmas automatically.
If it takes days then so be it. Relic weapons should be something that takes time and investment instead of a login reward.

So no, don’t change anything and don’t listen to the crowd that was responsible for what EW gave us please.
I am tired of people destroying this game…

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Originally Posted by Zakon

I wanted a grind, but not an RNG grind.

I would prefer "gather 100 of this item" and each fate grants 1 item over "gather 18 of this item" and then play for 5 hours and get exactly 1, which is what I just did.

RNG grinds are the worst. I logged out wishing I had just spent those 5 hours playing a different video game.

Also, the bosses are hard enough to actually need you to focus, which means you can't just turn your brain off and listen to an audio book or youtube or something. So not only is it an extremely long grind where you do not make guaranteed progress, you have to pay attention during a lot of it.

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Seems like the smart idea would always be to spend time on a different game if you don't enjoy the one you're playing, no? Like do you play a game for the rewards or to have fun?

They seem to have taken the aspect of EW relics a lot of people hated and mashed it together with the aspect of older relics that a lot of other people hated. Bold move.

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Originally Posted by hydralus

Seems like the smart idea would always be to spend time on a different game if you don't enjoy the one you're playing, no? Like do you play a game for the rewards or to have fun?

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Lol lets be real. MMO players dont have the concept of playing something just for fun.

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Originally Posted by XtremePrime

Isn't this what people wanted though? :/
Everyone was complaining over Endwalker's relic being too easy, not involved enough, and not nearly as grindy as it should be. They took that feedback and brought us back to having a grindy relic weapon!
~16 days is nothing in the grand scheme of things considering we still got atleast 2 months until 7.3 drops, it's meant to be something you work at overtime as opposed to in the first day or to collect every single one of them before the next patch drops.

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There is one difference. with rng drop you don't see yourself progressing. With Eureka, every fate you did was a step toward your goal. here you can spend 4 hours and not progress at all. The feeling is totally different. I'm the kind of guy that like the farm (I mean I farmed all the Eureka relics), but honestly, this "1 random drop every 2 hours" is not enjoyable.

lmao I knew when people were complaining about the previous grind being too easy that they would turn around and complain that it's too hard the next time. People just love to complain.

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Originally Posted by hydralus

Seems like the smart idea would always be to spend time on a different game if you don't enjoy the one you're playing, no? Like do you play a game for the rewards or to have fun?

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I want both?

Fate grinding isn't exactly the most fun thing in the world, but it's enjoyable enough to do every so often in small chunks and it gives me something to do in a game I otherwise like.

Problem with RNG rewards is there's no guarantee that I'll actually make any progress towards the reward I want. So if I log on and get nothing for the time I just spent, I feel like the game just wasted my time. I made no progress towards anything.

Do you go spam dungeons when you've already hit the tomestone cap? What's wrong, don't you enjoy playing the game? Go play it even though you get nothing for it.

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Originally Posted by Daralii

It's a one-off step. For every relic after the first, this step is just giving the drunk some tomestones.

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if this is the case, then I don't see why people are complaining. This is the middle ground I wanted. First relic requires you to do stuff, then the rest can be tomestones