Everyone is praising the 5.5-month patch cycle!

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Originally Posted by TheMightyMollusk

More time to take a break in between patches.

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Originally Posted by AlyaNimfa

OMG two weeks! What will we do?!?!?!

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Originally Posted by Kolsykol

They're human beings not robots, Japan also has a really crazy work culture so I think this is a good thing.

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Originally Posted by YukinaErde

having come from wow myself a couple years back, the absolute entitlement of some people in this community astonishes me. Y'all really dont understand how good you have it with SE. boo hoo 2 more weeks, you'd think there was a new calamity with how much they are complaining.

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Originally Posted by Ranaku

Still better than WoW

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

They only increased it to 4, 4.5, 5 5.5 months (+ any holidays) as far as I know. I'm not sure where the rest is coming from.

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Oh wait what's that?

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Originally Posted by Oizen

I would expect this trend to continue, people will defend it until it gets painfully obvious.

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Originally Posted by Oizen

remember on the live letter before 6.1 when they cried what I presume to now be fake tears over increasing the patch time from 3.5 to 4?

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Nope, nothing to see here, move along now.

Look they're too busy losing money making games no one is buying like Forespoken, Foamstars, and apparently FF7R and FFXVI

Can we please let the rumour that rebirth and 16 were bad sellers die

Square enix has disgustingly high expectations for their sales then blames their games that actually do sell for not totally covering for games that didn’t

Like 16 sold at a rate that gave it an attach rate of about 15% to the PS5 playerbase at its release, which is incredibly high. But square enix wanted it to both make a profit and cover for the loss of forspoken which would require like a 30% attach rate which games never get

Any other company would have been over the moon with 16’s sale numbers

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

Can we please let the rumour that rebirth and 16 were bad sellers die

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Eh I don't even remember when was the last time a FF game manage to met SE's sale expectation since FFX.

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Originally Posted by Raven2014

Eh I don't even remember when was the last time a FF game manage to met SE's sale expectation since FFX.

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Correction: Since FFXII.
ffxvi was a boring disaster with a boring cast and boring rpg elements, if it had any to begin with.

Baldur's gate 3 was FFXII in a lot of interesting ways; ffxvi was more like your random god of war. We can see why ffxvi didn't do well.

Playing FF16 right now, since it came out on pc last week...and yeah, i agree. May look good and the story has some good points...but after 25 hours im just bored and want to finish it soon. There are no Rpg elements..sure you can choose different "talents" but there really is no depth. Gear is boring, It wants to be a devil may cry in a Final fantasy setting but doesnt reach both either. Since my sub runs out next month...will be my last game from Square for a while. Yoshi P is seriously overrated.

Wait what am I missing? 5.5 month? What?

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Originally Posted by Rueby

Wait what am I missing? 5.5 month? What?

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For the moment, just people making up numbers that are higher than previous numbers. Because the patch cycle went from 3 months to 4/4.5, the argument is that this is a trend that will surely go to 5.5 months soon. Or 6 or 7 months, depending on which of their threads you read. It only sounds credible because the increase was recent, so the change in patch cycle length feels like it moved on a steep slope in the recent past. It is really no different though than if, for example, you had your birthday last week, so this week you are one year older than you were a week ago, and now someone is extrapolating this as a trend that you are going to be another year older by next week, and two years older the week after that.

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Originally Posted by Eyrilona

For the moment, just people making up numbers that are higher than previous numbers. Because the patch cycle went from 3 months to 4/4.5, the argument is that this is a trend that will surely go to 5.5 months soon. Or 6 or 7 months, depending on which of their threads you read. It only sounds credible because the increase was recent, so the change in patch cycle length feels like it moved on a steep slope in the recent past. It is really no different though than if, for example, you had your birthday last week, so this week you are one year older than you were a week ago, and now someone is extrapolating this as a trend that you are going to be another year older by next week, and two years older the week after that.

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https://i.imgur.com/Lbh9ZLI.png

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Originally Posted by AnimalsALot

Nope, nothing to see here, move along now.

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Ok, moving on.

https://puu.sh/Kfx7w/abc1a7841d.jpg

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Originally Posted by Lyndina

Playing FF16 right now, since it came out on pc last week...and yeah, i agree. May look good and the story has some good points...but after 25 hours im just bored and want to finish it soon. There are no Rpg elements..sure you can choose different "talents" but there really is no depth. Gear is boring, It wants to be a devil may cry in a Final fantasy setting but doesnt reach both either. Since my sub runs out next month...will be my last game from Square for a while. Yoshi P is seriously overrated.

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He salvaged something from Tanaka's mess by copying elements of other MMOs he'd played, but now he wants a "legacy" all his own, and he doesn't have the talent and/or doesn't have the time. This is especially apparent when it comes to things like systems and quest structure where both XIV and XVI share several of the same issues.

16 from what I've gotten around to play isn't bad... But so far it's been Hold W, Cutscene, Hold W, Cutsecne, Hold W, Cutsecne and the loop occasionally gets broken by a fight.

each new project they are planning to work on 2 extra weeks for each update.

from 3 to 4.5 which is 3 projects other than FFXIV.. which is FF16, NFT project, Mobile game..

If my assumption is correct Mr. Yoshi mention that he will work on another project too.. so it means another 5 or 5.5 depends on how big it is.

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Originally Posted by Oizen

Look they're too busy losing money making games no one is buying like Forespoken, Foamstars, and apparently FF7R and FFXVI

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Only a NFT game can save them now!



Cheers

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Originally Posted by Raven2014

Eh I don't even remember when was the last time a FF game manage to met SE's sale expectation since FFX.

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FFX was a once-in-a-generation hit, and rightly so. SE treats their golden goose poorly. Which is ironic. They should be over the moon with 16's performance considering how badly the last team botched FFXV - (in spite of my bias for liking FFXV so much, they did botch it)

You could have just made this thread instead of necro-ing 60 other duplicate threads and flooding the forums out. Most mentally stable forum poster moment

was going to ask what the point of any of this was, but then noticed the nice combination of jobs you have leveled

get fisher to 100 at least

For anyone believing this idiocy, they haven't made any announcements of any further extensions to patch cycles. The one or two times in last expansion it was an extra week were instances where there were holidays. The first part of the LL is Saturday which may be a bit early but they try to always hit TGS when it's near. The second half will mostly likely be mid-October because that one is usually a couple of weeks before the patch and not too long after the first. Which means we should probably get 7.1 sometime in early November where it would be expected on a 4 month patch cycle. This LL should probably tell us when the moogle event is, and we can guess 7.1's date from that since it always runs for about a month before the patch.

No, not "everyone" is praising this. There are a lot of conversations already about things slowing down.

While I think resources need to be put back into XIV to speed this up, was it really necessary to also necro every topic you could find about this too? It's just annoying and unnecessary.

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Originally Posted by TaleraRistain

For anyone believing this idiocy, they haven't made any announcements of any further extensions to patch cycles. The one or two times in last expansion it was an extra week were instances where there were holidays. The first part of the LL is Saturday which may be a bit early but they try to always hit TGS when it's near. The second half will mostly likely be mid-October because that one is usually a couple of weeks before the patch and not too long after the first. Which means we should probably get 7.1 sometime in early November where it would be expected on a 4 month patch cycle. This LL should probably tell us when the moogle event is, and we can guess 7.1's date from that since it always runs for about a month before the patch.

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They don't announce because they just silently extend it now LMAO

When they first announced 3.5 -> 4 months, they instead gave us a bunch of 4.5 month patches.

Working on the basis of a "month" being 30 days, because if you assume 28 (aka 4 weeks) it creates a 13th month, although even on that basis the max you reach is 5 months not 5.5:

6.0-6.1: 18 weeks (4.2 months)
6.1-6.2: 19 weeks (4.4 months)
6.2-6.3: 20 weeks (4.6 months)
6.3-6.4: 19 weeks (4.4 months)
6.4-6.5: 20 weeks (4.6 months)
6.5-7.0: 39 weeks (9.1 months)

To replicate these results do: weeks x 7 divided by 30.

So it seems to vary between 4.4 and 4.6 months depending on holidays, while expansion launches I know have increased by 3 months for the last two expansion releases (which was explained for Endwalker due to covid but not for Dawntrail).

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Originally Posted by CVXIV

was going to ask what the point of any of this was, but then noticed the nice combination of jobs you have leveled

get fisher to 100 at least

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To each their own... But out of all things to do in XIV, I think that leveling jobs is one of the worst chore-like activities, especially to make up for "content drought".

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

Working on the basis of a "month" being 30 days, because if you assume 28 (aka 4 weeks) it creates a 13th month, although even on that basis the max you reach is 5 months not 5.5:

6.0-6.1: 18 weeks (4.2 months)
6.1-6.2: 19 weeks (4.4 months)
6.2-6.3: 20 weeks (4.6 months)
6.3-6.4: 19 weeks (4.4 months)
6.4-6.5: 20 weeks (4.6 months)
6.5-7.0: 39 weeks (9.1 months)

To replicate these results do: weeks x 7 divided by 30.

So it seems to vary between 4.4 and 4.6 months depending on holidays, while expansion launches I know have increased by 3 months for the last two expansion releases (which was explained for Endwalker due to covid but not for Dawntrail).

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If they didn't address this next LL I will take a long break and stop caring all together

As they like to do 4 content patches and a lite 5th, it would not surprise me to see them go ahead and move it to 6 months for each patch as the game is 2.5 years between major updates. They would say that they need more time to do quality assurance, etc. Then they would put the x.x5 patch at the halfway point so they can say that they returned to the 3 month patch cycle of content release.

Will this really happen? Not sure, but it would address the gap of 9 months of no content between major updates at the end of the patch cycle. This would really suck for raiders as each raid would come out every year and maintaining a static over such time periods would be difficult.

Hypothetical Calendar
7.0 - Releases in July 2024
7.05 - Releases in October 2024
7.1 - Releases in January 2025
7.15 - Releases in April 2025
7.2 - Releases in July 2025
7.25 - Releases in October 2025
7.3 - Releases in January 2026
7.35 - Releases in April 2026
7.4 - Releases in July 2026
7.45 - Releases in September 2026
7.5 - Releases November 2026
8.0 - Releases in January of 2027

The smaller gaps in the patches at the end is to hype up things to get things alive again prior to the major release.

I mean, would the time between patches matter as much if they tried to make content that lasts longer than 3 days lol? The fact pretty much all content is designed to be done in like, 1 hour, one day week, is what makes the time between patches feel so ‘dead’ in my opinion. And before anyone @‘s me lol I’m not saying they should make it ‘a 24/7 full time job’ but like the current model isn’t exactly working either I’d say

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Originally Posted by Connor

I mean, would the time between patches matter as much if they tried to make content that lasts longer than 3 days lol? The fact pretty much all content is designed to be done in like, 1 hour, one day week, is what makes the time between patches feel so ‘dead’ in my opinion. And before anyone @‘s me lol I’m not saying they should make it ‘a 24/7 full time job’ but like the current model isn’t exactly working either I’d say

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I think is more like what the content is.

High end fights, for example, some people get done with it in 1-2 weeks. While others, especially PF raiders (like myself), can take up the whole patch cycle to complete them, due to how inconsistent players can be. And even so, there's only so long before fun turns into frustration for not getting people that actually mean "Enrage to Clear".

Story content is consumed at a set pace for everybody (if you don't skip scenes)... Usually patches you'll end up with around 3-5 hours with MSQ and sidequests, if you don't account the wait time for queues. This is done with the minimal time spent in a game.

I honestly feel that XIV absolutely needs content that is a time investment but not just a mindless grind - it should have an engaging difficulty level. I don't wish any of WoW's features in XIV, but they do have things that checks those boxes, like Mythic +, Torghast (when it didn't have a FOMO aspect), or recently Delves. This is just an example that would appease PVE savvy players, like myself.

I don't think that Bozja was very successful in that. It did have some very interesting rewards behind time investment, but the truth is you spent most of your time in SF and Zadnor just mindlessly hopping from one FATE to the other with one of the half-dozen CE's in between while you waited for the big instances to pop. Eureka was a little more nuanced than that, but still not exactly where I'd consider a top tier design. I'm really hoping for Dawntrail's ones, but not just taking what was successful from its predecessors, but actually tackle what they lacked.

That being said, I wish the Field Operation was a 7.0.5 feature, and it had a new zone in even patches. I know we'll be getting that, but I feel a big problem is the right now. The base patch of 7.0 is literally too empty of new features. They want us to log out if we're bored, but I want to play engaging activities XIV and not just waiting for 2 hours every day to see if I can fill a party finder group to finish my M3S prog. It's the only game I'm interested in rignt now.

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Originally Posted by Connor

I mean, would the time between patches matter as much if they tried to make content that lasts longer than 3 days lol?

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No, but the problem with making it last longer than 3 days is most people play very casually.

Normal behaviour for modern gamers is to play a game that just had a patch/DLC/just released for about 3-5 days, then move on to the next game. This is something I observed on Steam since Steam was a thing, and SE is just designing around this reality.

For people who want to spend more than 3 days on the content, they add long-term grinds for mounts, glam, titles, achievements, etc.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

No, but the problem with making it last longer than 3 days is most people play very casually.

Normal behaviour for modern gamers is to play a game that just had a patch/DLC/just released for about 3-5 days, then move on to the next game. This is something I observed on Steam since Steam was a thing, and SE is just designing around this reality.

For people who want to spend more than 3 days on the content, they add long-term grinds for mounts, glam, titles, achievements, etc.

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I think casual players are the target audience for grinding.. current content cycle style is preferred by players who don't actually play the game and play other games along side FFXIV

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Originally Posted by Connor

I mean, would the time between patches matter as much if they tried to make content that lasts longer than 3 days lol? The fact pretty much all content is designed to be done in like, 1 hour, one day week, is what makes the time between patches feel so ‘dead’ in my opinion. And before anyone @‘s me lol I’m not saying they should make it ‘a 24/7 full time job’ but like the current model isn’t exactly working either I’d say

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Its unfortunate that most content in FF14 has an incredibly short shelf life, and is barely future proofed. After a very short while there already is no reason to run them anymore. And while I agree supergrinds that replace your day job in terms of required time commitment is the other extreme no one wants, a reason to log in when you have done your quickly finished weekly stuff would be nice.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

No, but the problem with making it last longer than 3 days is most people play very casually.

Normal behaviour for modern gamers is to play a game that just had a patch/DLC/just released for about 3-5 days, then move on to the next game. This is something I observed on Steam since Steam was a thing, and SE is just designing around this reality.

For people who want to spend more than 3 days on the content, they add long-term grinds for mounts, glam, titles, achievements, etc.

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Naaa man, people don't all bounce from game to game every few days. Way too many people have "their" game that they enjoy and play a lot. The issue is that the content in FF14 is drained of reasons to play very quickly because the main reward can be received rather fast, while those long term grinds are inhumane in its requirements. There is no middle ground.

7.1 please pull me out of this achievement hellhole

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Originally Posted by ovIm

Naaa man, people don't all bounce from game to game every few days. Way too many people have "their" game that they enjoy and play a lot.

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That may have often been true of "hardcore MMORPG players", but genuinely a simple glance at Steam over the years has always shown me that people are playing whatever the recent game release/DLC is, as if they are splashing money every few days on a new game/DLC. The design of the game sorta reinforces that SE sees this too.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

That may have often been true of "hardcore MMORPG players", but genuinely a simple glance at Steam over the years has always shown me that people are playing whatever the recent game release/DLC is, as if they are splashing money every few days on a new game/DLC. The design of the game sorta reinforces that SE sees this too.

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None of that has anything to do with hardcore MMORPG players. Its all over all kinds of genres. The player base for Helldivers 2, for example, is relatively stable (dropped due to bad patches, but thats a different topic). There is a rather sizeable bunch of people playing Fortnite regularily, and on a more personal anecdote, I have friends who spent weeks on end on city builders or their current survival game.

There is both kinds of players, really, not just the one you have experienced.

FFXIV is not designed with that kind of "Casual" player in mind that you describe, but with the average salaryman, who works a 9-5 job, and then plays a couple hours of their game each day. See for example the return time for your retainer missions, 17 hours. You send it out at midnight before going to bed and it returns just as your workday ends. To keep up with the weekly tomestone cap, you only need to invest like 20 minutes on 5 days a week (Expert Roulette), leaving your weekend completely free. All of these elements are made with the regular working man in mind.

is genshin hard core game?

it is the most casual game I have ever seen along that it has more grindy and content out of any mainsteam MMO

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Originally Posted by ovIm

There is both kinds of players, really, not just the one you have experienced.

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Ok, sure, there are both kinds of players. But from what I have seen from average gamers - not just my own friends list but just glancing at anyone else's, that's the sort of behaviour I've seen from at least the slight majority.

Often there is maybe a game they gravitate to when there is nothing else releasing. The question is whether SE believes the majority of players would gravitate to this one for more than 3 days whatever they do. I think they are just casting their net wider so the people who leave after 3 days can feel like they actually did what they returned for.

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FFXIV is not designed with that kind of "Casual" player in mind that you describe, but with the average salaryman, who works a 9-5 job, and then plays a couple hours of their game each day.

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That too. Yoshi-P must understand this really well since he's working himself and couldn't play it hardcore himself. :D

We can desire the content to last ages and consume our whole life but the reality is most people don't have that sort of time or want to play other games as well, so it's not entirely wrong, from a business standpoint, to cast the net wider to the casual audience.

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Originally Posted by AnimalsALot

Oh wait what's that?





Nope, nothing to see here, move along now.

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Exactly, nothing to see here but drivel. Thanks Skiros. Posting about another extended cycle, that isn't even a thing.

I wanted 6 months cycle. Awesomeness!

Really, the core problem is the same one all MMOs suffer from. Players are really good at optimizing the fun right out of a game. Content that was SUPPOSE to last months or years, gets burned through in days to weeks (at most).

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Originally Posted by Titania40

Really, the core problem is the same one all MMOs suffer from. Players are really good at optimizing the fun right out of a game. Content that was SUPPOSE to last months or years, gets burned through in days to weeks (at most).

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Can you explain to me a single piece of content that’s not savage or harder that was introduced in EW that was meant to take weeks or months

Ah yes. I too enjoyed "optimizing the fun" out of a mammet factoryworker foreman simulator in Island sanctuary. Another halfbaked unfinished product.

It wouldve been so easy to just upgrade it into instanced housing and getting rid of the mammets. But I guess you gotta keep those subs running.

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Originally Posted by Titania40

Really, the core problem is the same one all MMOs suffer from. Players are really good at optimizing the fun right out of a game. Content that was SUPPOSE to last months or years, gets burned through in days to weeks (at most).

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Good old "players are to blame" card. Can't optimize the fun out of the game, when the devs themselves made the decision to tailor the game pre-optimized. To please the "silent majority" that considers just logging into the game a worthy effort. As of right now - we have no content. Scrapping the barrel.

Open world is barren, hunt trains are boring, roulettes are insufferable thanks to bad job design and casual content being a toothless slop that gets further neutered by a very loose (or straight non-existing) Ilvl sync. Once in a blue moon you get a DF with some sprouts and the duty gets ever so slightly exciting, but this is an increasingly rare occurence.