FFXIV and the graphics trap hole

greetings, I am an artist, and though i have never worked for a company or made any concept art for a game, I have done it for my own Personal Projects. When i started playing XIV i noticed that it was lacking in a really definitive art style, and was instead going for the typical FFVII style high end graphics that make the game look like the people and world are real enough to compare to your own.

I personally think this is the wrong approach. looking at other Successful MMO i can see that they have a definitive artstyle that separates them from other games, where as ffxiv is only distinctive because it DOESNT have this art style. Because of this, they are going to be forced to constantly reevaluate there graphics to meet more demanding players and current day standards. in a way.. this is a trap hole they can never get out of.

I will show now, a small handful of games that have created player characters and unique artstyle-integrated graphics. to illustrate why the thing that matters more than anything, is not the graphics, but the artistic design.

Conton City - DBXV2
https://images-ext-1.discordapp.net/...00?format=webp

Grand Exchange - OSRS
https://images-ext-1.discordapp.net/...eg?format=webp

Ashenvale - World of Warcraft
https://i.ytimg.com/vi/78xB_GqLwPY/maxresdefault.jpg

in all 3 of these examples. the worlds look vastly different. and graphics can stay at a stable point that would never ever need updated, so as not to betray the original artstyle. For the Budget and Future of FFXIV. it would do well to take a lesson or 2 from those games, and focus on creating something stylistically beautiful, instead of realistic, because that very hyperrealism is actually lifting me out the immersive experience and making ffxiv feel like another part of life. The characters look like people, they are not high fantasy or distinct unique races, the forests look bland and boring, there's no feeling of being in a magical realm. (the only zone that broke this mold was IL Mheg and elpis)

Personally I quite like FF14's art direction but you do have a valid point. I think, if they wanted to change the art direction, that FF14 is fairly compatible with the art style seen in the Neptunia/Fairy Fencer games.

The realistic anime look is the final fantasy style. It always has been.
Just look at examples like FFX that came out in 2001 or the Advent Children movie in 2005. There's even examples prior to that but obvious graphic limitations kinda make it harder to see.
It's been said many times that this is a final fantasy game first and MMO second.

WoW's graphics were updated. Supposedly there was some outcry about how terrible some races where done to. And, yes, the graphics are part of the reason why I play FFXIV and not either of your examples.

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Originally Posted by sindriiisgaming

Ashenvale - World of Warcraft
https://i.ytimg.com/vi/78xB_GqLwPY/maxresdefault.jpg

in all 3 of these examples. the worlds look vastly different. and graphics can stay at a stable point that would never ever need updated, so as not to betray the original artstyle

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I'm not familiar with the first two but WoW famously had a graphical update that significantly changed the art style. The vanilla game and modern assets look very dissimilar.

https://digitalspyuk.cdnds.net/13/45...ed-dwarves.png

https://cdn.gracza.pl/gallery/galler...p718790734.jpg

https://wow.zamimg.com/uploads/scree...al/1073785.jpg

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Originally Posted by sindriiisgaming

For the Budget and Future of FFXIV. it would do well to take a lesson or 2 from those games, and focus on creating something stylistically beautiful, instead of realistic, because that very hyperrealism is actually lifting me out the immersive experience and making ffxiv feel like another part of life.

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You must live a very strange life.

https://gamepur.com/wp-content/uploa...rippy-boss.png

https://64.media.tumblr.com/7689db07...a50fc2e456.png

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/VvZNRYV3-2o/maxresdefault.jpg

https://media1.tenor.com/m/ZDKcLlC9N...ictomancer.gif


Just because something doesn't look like a cartoon doesn't mean it's not stylized. FFXIV is not lacking in stylistically beautiful models, dungeons, armor sets, etc. To try to argue that the game is too "hyperrealistic," the same game where you can ride a flying blue cactus alien on the moon and fight a giant haunted teapot, is pretty absurd.

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Originally Posted by Ilisidi

WoW's graphics were updated. Supposedly there was some outcry about how terrible some races where done to. And, yes, the graphics are part of the reason why I play FFXIV and not either of your examples.

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It very much did. Honestly, by comparison the FF community's response to the graphics update was practically overwhelmingly positive compared to when Blizzard updated the WoW models. The rage storm that prompted on the WoW forums puts our community's reaction to absolute shame.

FFXIV was absolutely beautiful until they decided to make it look like silent hill and to put fog everywhere with DT for some weird reasons in most areas.

Also no, the artstyle of this game is perfectly fine, stop trying to make FFXIV a different game than what it is.

FFXIV has more clear direction it is FF direction which is similar to other FF single player RPGs with few exceptions like FF7 and it is kinda similar in some ways but not always

FFXIV can be criticised for many things, but honestly I’d say the art style and direction have been one of the most consistent and least criticised things in the game. I mean, part of why they’re so obsessed with graphics is that ‘bringing the art style to life’ has been a big part of ffxiv’s success, along with other things like incorporating elements of previous ff art into the game to create an easily identifiable ‘final fantasy world’

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Originally Posted by sindriiisgaming

greetings, I am an artist, and though i have never worked for a company or made any concept art for a game, I have done it for my own Personal Projects. When i started playing XIV i noticed that it was lacking in a really definitive art style, and was instead going for the typical FFV style high end graphics that make the game look like the people and world are real enough to compare to your own.

I personally think this is the wrong approach. looking at other Successful MMO i can see that they have a definitive artstyle that separates them from other games, where as ffxiv is only distinctive because it DOESNT have this art style. Because of this, they are going to be forced to constantly reevaluate there graphics to meet more demanding players and current day standards. in a way.. this is a trap hole they can never get out of.

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Good. Nothing in this world lasts forever, nor is such a thing in any way desirable. I honestly think this engine and game has about run its course and they should be making the next version of the game, where they can start from scratch and use the knowledge they've attained during these soon to be 12 years to make something even better. Much like a person can attempt in vain to halt the passage of time with plastic surgery, I think it far preferable to simply age with grace and die when the time comes.

Is it good for a painter to desperately cling to their first ever work and try to improve it and smooth out the rough patches constantly as their skills improve? Is it not better to simply discard the old and start with a fresh canvas?

I have to disagree, the reason why I gave FFXIV a try in the first place is because back in ARR it distinctly reminded me of the FFXII art style and direction, which makes sense because to my understanding a lot of those artists from the Ivalice games were shuffled over to CBU3. The art of XII is very dark fantasy but there's tons of beauty and whimsy and the XIV models had this painted look that I adored before 7.0. I will say a lot of that style was lost to the models in DT, but there is still a lot of beautiful vibrant stuff in Tuliyollal that was pretty to look at when the new lighting wasn't making me ill.

as an artist.. have you played WoW since the start? because in the beginning.... being very cartoony kinda took me out of any kind of "immersion".

here is very little about FFXIV that I would remotely call "realistic" and I have yet to meet people or places that resemble what is in the game. the reasons I enjoy i aside from the game play, is everything you point out as being "wrong". I enjoy the fact that it isnt that cartoony.

so, if everything seems hyperrealistic and non-fantasy to you.... where is this place since it must have mi'quote, viera and hrothgar to make them seem... normal to you.

The only thing I find comically hilarious personally is how ridiculously overhyped the graphical update was by Yoshi-P and a lot of the community and genuinely if I didn't follow news and wasn't made aware of it through online media I legit probably would never have noticed they even did it. The amount of times I laughed myself to tears during Dawntrail cutscenes looking at some of the textures was truly something, I even screenshot the bed in the Tulliyolal inn to mock in my FC Discord because it legit looked like an N64 asset.

Ultimately I don't really care though. If the games graphics bothered me then I wouldn't have played it for 7 years now. They're fine.

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Originally Posted by sindriiisgaming

Grand Exchange - OSRS
https://images-ext-1.discordapp.net/...eg?format=webp

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You could at least post actual OSRS graphics and not this ugly puke mod

If a game can be identified from a random screenshot, it's safe to say it has a unique art style. If it wasn't unique, it would be difficult to identify the game.

Changing a game's art style in the middle of its lifespan is not a good idea. Even WoW's art style didn't actually change. It was just impacted by the graphics update allowing more detail. You could still tell it was WoW.

As an ex environment artist that worked in the industry, I must say that I am extremely puzzled by the OP...

It sounds to me that you're more attracted to very cartoony art styles or styles with extreme strokes, but that doesn't invalidate other types. Unless you specifically have in mind the huge mix and mash of random MMO elements like lvl1 glam gear, clown costumes and whatnot all clashing down in the middle of the game (which is another issue altogether)? If you want to see something that truly has no art style, just open Unreal Engine and start using the generic assets with the default lighting...

What some people call artstyle, I call outdated graphics.

I understand enjoying stylised graphics. I like them, too. There are games instantly recognizeable thanks to their art style like Darkest Dungeon. I even understand the argument that style is more important than realism now because Unreal Engine 5 makes it so anyone can have nigh-photorealistic characters. HOWEVER, FFXIV doesn't really look realistic. It's very anime-esque, especially some of the faces and emotes.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

What some people call artstyle, I call outdated graphics.

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With Runescape especially. All old games around that time period looked like that.

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Originally Posted by PercibelTheren

With Runescape especially. All old games around that time period looked like that.

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FFXI, of the same age, looks more like the art direction of FFXIV.

I think if you found a gamer who wasn't familiar with either game and showed them a screenshot with characters from XI, and a similar screenshot from XIV with no other information, they'd probably guess that the latter is a sequel to the former made ~10 years later. There is a clear lineage to the art direction and style.

If you can't tell XIV's style at a glace, you either don't actually play the game, or you're not very good at discerning art styles, and if you're an artist... that's concerning, OP.

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Originally Posted by DiaDeem

If you can't tell XIV's style at a glace, you either don't actually play the game, or you're not very good at discerning art styles, and if you're an artist... that's concerning, OP.

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not sure why throw the dig in lol. especially since this is entirely YOUR opinion. but i never said i couldn't see 1, just that the 1 this game has is bland and generic squex stuff.

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Originally Posted by sindriiisgaming

not sure why throw the dig in lol. especially since this is entirely YOUR opinion. but i never said i couldn't see 1, just that the 1 this game has is bland and generic squex stuff.

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So most of the art you see that's similar is actually copying Final Fantasy art style. Is it truly bland and generic if you are one of the main reasons that art style is so popular?

"Guys, this game is very bland and non fantastical https://cdn.betterttv.net/emote/5aca...5481ad/1x.webp"

https://imgur.com/MwHHhKA.png

OP you fail to realize that Final Fantasy dominates its art style so thoroughly and has done it for so long that you just see it as uninventive or plain. You can go back to Advent Children and even the pre-rendered cutscenes in Final Fantasy X from 21 years ago and see the same art style - realistic anime character rendering. Just because their art style is a paradigm now doesn't mean that it lacks any qualities or characteristics that less popular ("unique") art styles possess. There's a reason why only one of those games is more popular than Final Fantasy 14 and spoiler alert: It's not because of the graphics.

Also Miqo'te ears are thoroughly good and Miqo'te in general are a great (and unique to FF) spin on catgirls