Savage Loot System

Been working on progging the savage tier through PF and its just insanely upsetting to watch one person win 3 out of the 4 items that drop. When you play the normal version of the raids you can only win one item per fight, per week but in savage they dont have any loot rules ??? I feel like this system just screws over everyone that works hard to clear these fights and it needs to change. I ran M2S yesterday and one person won 3 items and the same thing happened in M3S today.......

That's what the books are for.

do you know about L>R loots?

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Originally Posted by Bellybell

do you know about L>R loots?

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Yep, definitely I’d suggest during reclears to put L to R loot rule.
Basically every players can roll only one item starting from left and going to right. Once the player got what they need, they leave the instance.

In EU servers it’s rarely used but I tried last tier and surprisingly the pf filled relatively fast.
Dunno within NA servers tho.

No thank you, im fine with the loot rules and your L-R may be work one or two times but not more because even with such a rule i wouldnt care and bid on everything why would i give up on loot?

They might win 3 this week, but next week you might be the one to win 3.

The RNG works out over time - actually, you get way more loot in PF than in a static, especially as a tank/healer, because there isn't any sort of rule like forcefully assigning it to the DPS first or distributing it evenly. Although PF might result in you getting no loot the first week, one of the next weeks you'll get most of it. That's been the case for me in every tier that I've pugged really.

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Originally Posted by AvoSturmfaust

No thank you, im fine with the loot rules and your L-R may be work one or two times but not more because even with such a rule i wouldnt care and bid on everything why would i give up on loot?

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Because by joining a PF you've agreed to the rules, so violating them becomes a reportable offense.

I defnitely had PF groups where people didn't follow the L>R loot etiquette, but back then one of the cases, the person said they "forgot about the rules" and logged quickly after leaving the instance, I presume to avoid confrontation. I didn't do anything because I wasn't aware back then that this would be a reportable offense, but ever since I no longer trust in players following the rule, but then I rarely see a group with that in the description anyway.

Now, for the OP, I really agree. They could at least implement an actual optional loot rule that only allows people to leave with just one loot win. This guarantees that half of the group at least gets something.

Pity books are a good consolation prize, but imagine going through your 4th week just with those?

PF is terrible in many ways including Loot rules, I suggest looking into joining a static and see if you can find one who do Loot rules differently.

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Originally Posted by Ramiee

PF is terrible in many ways including Loot rules, I suggest looking into joining a static and see if you can find one who do Loot rules differently.

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Unfortunately I can't due to logistic reasons... At least for now.

Speaking about the system itself, I don't see how this is fundamentally different from bosses not dropping every gear slot coffer or coffers at all, which were both versions we've had prior.

The difference is today you always have a chance to roll on loot where before none of the pieces you needed might have dropped, or nothing for the whole party dropped other than alternate jobs. Maybe that feels worse than your loot never dropping because you're more likely to lose a roll or see one person win big.

They could very easily solve this by adding a new party loot rule 'one item per player' or something, now that 'need>greed' is effectively useless in the 'all coffers all the time' world we live in. Could make this the norm for Raid Finder too, but I have no idea what the typical JP weekly clear group that uses it prefers for their loot system (perhaps an option could be added for queuing allowing for you to join other same-preferenced queuers).

That said, I personally don't care about loot in this game cuz it's so ephemeral and boring; my major gripe with the system is that I penalize a party's rewards if I've already cleared for the week. This results in me having less incentive to try other jobs, revisit content, and play with more people. Maybe this system made sense to limit progression in 3.05 when they implemented it, but today even non serious tryhards can easily, EASILY clear a tier within the first week with not even fully over melded crafted and normal raid gear.

I wish they'd just let me join folks and abstain from loot without hurting the party' rewards if we clear.

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Originally Posted by SnowVix

Because by joining a PF you've agreed to the rules, so violating them becomes a reportable offense.

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go ahead and report it, let me tell you a big secret, the chances that square enix cares are around 1% i got so many times reported in the past and nothing happend, sorry to tell you but your big safe space isnt so safe.

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Originally Posted by Post

Speaking about the system itself, I don't see how this is fundamentally different from bosses not dropping every gear slot coffer or coffers at all, which were both versions we've had prior.

The difference is today you always have a chance to roll on loot where before none of the pieces you needed might have dropped, or nothing for the whole party dropped other than alternate jobs. Maybe that feels worse than your loot never dropping because you're more likely to lose a roll or see one person win big.

They could very easily solve this by adding a new party loot rule 'one item per player' or something, now that 'need>greed' is effectively useless in the 'all coffers all the time' world we live in. Could make this the norm for Raid Finder too, but I have no idea what the typical JP weekly clear group that uses it prefers for their loot system (perhaps an option could be added for queuing allowing for you to join other same-preferenced queuers).

That said, I personally don't care about loot in this game cuz it's so ephemeral and boring; my major gripe with the system is that I penalize a party's rewards if I've already cleared for the week. This results in me having less incentive to try other jobs, revisit content, and play with more people. Maybe this system made sense to limit progression in 3.05 when they implemented it, but today even non serious tryhards can easily, EASILY clear a tier within the first week with not even fully over melded crafted and normal raid gear.

I wish they'd just let me join folks and abstain from loot without hurting the party' rewards if we clear.

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Agree... sometimes I just want to practice a new job while helping out a party eternally waiting for a last dps spot in off-raid hours, and I can't.

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Originally Posted by Post

That said, I personally don't care about loot in this game cuz it's so ephemeral and boring; my major gripe with the system is that I penalize a party's rewards if I've already cleared for the week. This results in me having less incentive to try other jobs, revisit content, and play with more people. Maybe this system made sense to limit progression in 3.05 when they implemented it, but today even non serious tryhards can easily, EASILY clear a tier within the first week with not even fully over melded crafted and normal raid gear.

I wish they'd just let me join folks and abstain from loot without hurting the party' rewards if we clear.

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THIS. I wish I could run more to get more practice in so I'm better for reclears the next week but you're discouraged from doing that because you'll geek up loot. I know there is probably potential some sort of merc thing with 7 people who go and get one person all their gear but I think the effect of that would be less than the benefit of letting people get more practice and help others clear without those others having to settle for a book run.

To the OP, I agree it can suck. But like Jeeq said, the RNG does tend to even itself out. And my personal thoughts are that everyone contributed so everyone deserves an equal chance at testing the RNG. I think it would be fine if parties on NA wanted to either do the L > R thing or established rules for loot in some other manner. PF creators should have the freedom to establish certain things for the parties they put together. One thing that I enjoy about NA (which can also get annoying with eleventy million strats in PF) is that we have a variety of ways of doing things sometimes.

Quick brag because RNGesus has smiled upon me this tier and I'm fully geared already and I gotta say when it *does* happen to you it feels really good! But!! Something definitely needs to change - It's frustrating not being able to keep trying for loot and it's frustrating getting the loot and then being locked out of most PF groups and have no incentive to play with whatever shiny gear you get! I'd prefer it if savage loot system worked more like 24 man raids - where you get a guaranteed weekly token and you also get to win 1 piece of loot for each fight. If you don't win a coffer you can reclear it and try again - no duplicate weekly drop obviously. The only problem I can see with this is that it would make people in statics feel obligated to do multiple clears for everyone - but that's not much different from split clears - but still it might be too unreasonable a time sink for some people. I think it would make PF a lot healthier overall with a less dramatic die-off as capable people get their one and only clear for the week and remove themselves from the pool.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

They might win 3 this week, but next week you might be the one to win 3.

The RNG works out over time - actually, you get way more loot in PF than in a static, especially as a tank/healer, because there isn't any sort of rule like forcefully assigning it to the DPS first or distributing it evenly. Although PF might result in you getting no loot the first week, one of the next weeks you'll get most of it. That's been the case for me in every tier that I've pugged really.

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Week 4 in my static and healer and tanks are almost decked out except some miss weapons. We talk 727 ilvl. If you static is decent you get through the fights in like 2 hours and people will be only struggling with weapons just because its rng if you get a 2 good weapon.

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Originally Posted by Mortex

Week 4 in my static and healer and tanks are almost decked out except some miss weapons. We talk 727 ilvl. If you static is decent you get through the fights in like 2 hours and people will be only struggling with weapons just because its rng if you get a 2 good weapon.

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And then if you want BiS for Ultimates, you still need to stay subbed for weeks and weeks if your job role drew the short straw this raid cycle and most of your best gear is from tomes.

"YoshiP, now that there's 21 jobs and fewer tokens needed to get savage gear, can we maybe have an increase in weekly tome cap or a reduction in tome gear prices?"

"Nope, can't be done. SE board says it lowers engagement"

That's the other half of this coin, the blatant paywalling. I guess every aspect of the game has their version of this somewhere, from Housing Demolition to Custom Deliveries to Tribes Societies, but I do think I'd feel like my time with the game was better spent if I did get to wholly take breaks sooner when I'm only playing to reclear, or worse, cap tomes.

They've done plenty to the raid system to make it player friendly. I don't think they should force a "one piece per player per week" for savage. But maybe make it an option in PF to set the loot rule as such.

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Originally Posted by dspguy

maybe make it an option in PF to set the loot rule as such.

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Loot master.