PLD - Why is it consistently the lowest dps of the tanks?

Back in the day people speculated the rationale for PLD's DPS output being lower was because of Hallowed and Clemency.

Well, now every tank has enough healing (except DRK) to self-sustain a dungeon boss from start to finish if they wanted and all of them have Hallowed Ground equivalents that work well but with a lower CD. Both of those things means the PLD's clemency and HG do not stand out like they used to meaning there's no reason for a DPS tax on them.

Sword and board is awesome, so why is it that PLD's DPS is still so low compared to the other tanks?

Didn't PLD flip flop between 2nd and 3rd highest DPS tank in Anabaseios, with GNB having the highest?

Fair point but that was mid-late xpac and there wasn't much variance with tank dps (which is ideal).

We're at the start of new xpac now and again, they're back to absolute dead last.

PLD has an entire extra raidwide mitigation skill that the other tanks have no match for.

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Originally Posted by Launched

PLD has an entire extra raidwide mitigation skill that the other tanks have no match for.

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I mean WAR has broken levels of healing that no other tank has an answer for but still second most DPS

Passage of Arms tax I guess.

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Originally Posted by aodhan_ofinnegain

I mean WAR has broken levels of healing that no other tank has an answer for but still second most DPS

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This and Holmgang honestly deserves to also be taxed.

Probably going to see some slight potency increases on PLD in the upcoming raid or savage patch. Either way the difference in tank dps is so low that it doesn't really matter for 99% of content.

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Originally Posted by Launched

PLD has an entire extra raidwide mitigation skill that the other tanks have no match for.

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yay a annoying raid wide that only works under certain situations because everyone has to be behind you, Not like we already have the longest invul to make up for it anyway, which im fine with having the longest Invul but it should be the reason why we can have a extra raid wide instead of our damage being taxxed.

but I guess its fine that warrior has the best sustain in the game and shortest invul at no cost, while having the 2nd biggest damage, I can tell you now shortest invul is generally more important then having a extra situational raid wide.

Tank order should be DRK/GNB > PLD > War

To be fair tank dps is very much not what threads like this make it out to be. Gunbreaker is the best, by a wide margin. Right now Warrior is second, Dark is third, and Paladin is last. HOWEVER, the gap between Warrior and Paladin is smaller than the gap between Gunbreaker and Warrior. In reality Paladin dps is really not much lower than two of the other tanks, it is very marginal. Just all of them not named Gunbreaker suck compared to Gunbreaker. Breaker has the harder rotation though so I guess that's how Squeenix justifies it.

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Originally Posted by Karkarov

To be fair tank dps is very much not what threads like this make it out to be. Gunbreaker is the best, by a wide margin. Right now Warrior is second, Dark is third, and Paladin is last. HOWEVER, the gap between Warrior and Paladin is smaller than the gap between Gunbreaker and Warrior. In reality Paladin dps is really not much lower than two of the other tanks, it is very marginal. Just all of them not named Gunbreaker suck compared to Gunbreaker. Breaker has the harder rotation though so I guess that's how Squeenix justifies it.

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it doesn't have a harder rotation all tanks do is spam 1, 2, 3 then gauge spender.
They even removed some of its business on bursts, I don't think any tank is "busy enough" now to justify large gaps, the APM gap is way more closer then it has been.

I don't get how any tank rotation can be considered difficult at this point to justify more damage

I find GNB to be a lot easier now that the new combo esentially allows you to use bloodfest to fix any missing bullets rather than drifting double down into the sun.

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Originally Posted by Rithy255

it doesn't have a harder rotation all tanks do is spam 1, 2, 3 then gauge spender.
They even removed some of its business on bursts, I don't think any tank is "busy enough" now to justify large gaps, the APM gap is way more closer then it has been.

I don't get how any tank rotation can be considered difficult at this point to justify more damage

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Lol I said "breaker has the harder rotation..." specifically I mean compared to the other tanks. I didn't say "breaker has a hard rotation", cause I agree, it doesn't. Breaker DOES have a very slightly harder rotation than the other tanks though. I do mean slight. I also said "... I guess that's how Squeenix justifies it." When someone uses a word like "justifies" it normally means there is no good reason and someone was just using something as an excuse. AKA: Gunbreaker has better dps because their rotation is slightly harder.

In reality tanks are probably the easiest classes to play in this game from an actual rotation/moment to moment what button do I use standpoint.

PLD had the hardest rotation at the beginning of EW, and still it's damage was shit. DRK and GNB were busy, but even then not difficult and have been made even easier since.

Honestly equalise the damage across the board and call it a day. Let crit and DH variance decide who does more, it keeps everyone happy then. People can just pick their favourite tank to play to bring to raid.

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Originally Posted by Morphiana

Back in the day people speculated the rationale for PLD's DPS output being lower was because of Hallowed and Clemency.

Well, now every tank has enough healing (except DRK) to self-sustain a dungeon boss from start to finish if they wanted and all of them have Hallowed Ground equivalents that work well but with a lower CD. Both of those things means the PLD's clemency and HG do not stand out like they used to meaning there's no reason for a DPS tax on them.

Sword and board is awesome, so why is it that PLD's DPS is still so low compared to the other tanks?

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Well it should be above Warrior, but Warrior players are allergic to fair balance and despise everyone who does not want to play Warrior. They're the teacher's favourite boy in class too.
Dark knight and Gun breaker have weaker sustain and mit, so they kinda need to do more dps than Paladin. And unlike Warrior players and the poster above me, Paladin players understand that it needs to be slightly (Keyword:Slightly) worse at dps so that other tanks have a place in the game. Warrior outdpssing Paladin and Dark knight iis an absolute clownshow and hillarious display of blatant developer favouritism though.
Both Dark knight and Paladin should be bumped a little above Warrior.

Utility should be taxed. Not even debatable. We can have a talk about how much though.

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Originally Posted by Launched

PLD has an entire extra raidwide mitigation skill that the other tanks have no match for.

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Warrior has the strongest sustain, the best partywide and the strongest invuln that no other tank has a match for.
Why isn't Warrior bottom dps? Just because it's your favourite, or?
It is time Warrior mains acknowledged the job's strengths over other tanks.

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Originally Posted by aodhan_ofinnegain

Honestly equalise the damage across the board and call it a day. Let crit and DH variance decide who does more, it keeps everyone happy then. People can just pick their favourite tank to play to bring to raid.

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Realistically, this is probably the idea with tank balance, but as long as the rotations aren't literally identical, there is going to be some level of variance from class to class. The balance is close enough that you can just play whichever tank and be fine.

...but also WAR should be dead last and I'm not taking any questions.

Mostly because of it's utility.
Mind you back when boss hitboxes weren't absurdly big so keeping uptime wasn't always easy, PLD sometimes did a good chunk of damage than the other tanks due to it's magic combo. So I'm guessing why it's damage is lowers is due to a soft range tax and a utility tax.

PLD shouldn't be taxed, its utility should be a strength, not a taxed comfort.

Utility tax at its finest. Will have to wait for encounter design to change to really see if PLD deserves to be that low in the damage pole.

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Originally Posted by Derio

Utility tax at its finest. Will have to wait for encounter design to change to really see if PLD deserves to be that low in the damage pole.

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It doesn't.
Drk and War should be behind Gnb by 200-300 dps and War should be below them by another 200-300.