Bard as a healer?

Do you agree that Bard fantasy lean more into healer + support than DPS support?

what if SE just release a new Job that fit into bow DPS like ranger and turn Bard more into support healer like astro

In general it would fit the Final Fantasy Bard better than the strange mix of archer + bard.
Bard in most incarnations in this Franchise have been Party Support or condition dealer.

When i began the game i didnt even considered that the upgrade to Archer would be Bard well knowlingly that Bard was in the game because "Bow and Arrow" was so far removed from it that i didnt occour to me that this would be the case.

Mind you Archers are rather rare in Final Fantasy and those that exist wouldnt lend itself to FF14 super streamlined style as they are also condition heavy.
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So short answer yes.
A spellcaster/Supporter would be way way closer to what the class is in Final Fantasy.

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Originally Posted by Ayalu

In general it would fit the Final Fantasy Bard better than the strange mix of archer + bard.
Bard in most incarnations in this Franchise have been Party Support or condition dealer.

When i began the game i didnt even considered that the upgrade to Archer would be Bard well knowlingly that Bard was in the game because "Bow and Arrow" was so far removed from it that i didnt occour to me that this would be the case.

Mind you Archers are rather rare in Final Fantasy and those that exist wouldnt lend itself to FF14 super streamlined style as they are also condition heavy.
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So short answer yes.
A spellcaster/Supporter would be way way closer to what the class is in Final Fantasy.

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I agree 100%, even better if Bard would share EXP with DPS version of Bard same as Summoner and Scholar

I think if we'd get a more "physical" type of healers, Bard could join that group alongside something like a Chemist/Apothecary.

The prime example being FF4's Rosa, despite being a White Mage primarily, has her signature skill Aim instead of something like Pray. They could merge her and Edward as inspiration since they do tend to do that as of late (see Edgar's Machinist, Squall's Gunbreaker, Zidane's Viper and Relm's Pictomancer)

As someone who plays BRD mostly for the archer/ranger aspects, I think that the way to improve on the job's fantasy is to find the overlaps between archery, and music. On a mechanical level, both involve plucking string be it a bow string or a stringed instrument which it does a mostly good job with its oGCD gameplay. On a more 'vibes' level, the overlap to me is 'rock star.' Robin Hood splitting an arrow in an archery competition could be seen as a rock star move -- really any impressive feats of archery could be seen as a rock star moves. And 'rock star's' association with music should go without saying. Which is to say, I lean more toward BRD being more of a DPS than a 'support' -- despite the history of bard as a class. Also as a musician outside of game, I feel like one should making music for themselves first and foremost -- if you are making music solely for other people, your art will suffer.

Bard used to have a healer Limit Break even though it was a DPS.

Bard healer will forever live in my heart (but probably not ffxiv lol)

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Originally Posted by Connor

Bard healer will forever live in my heart (but probably not ffxiv lol)

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to be honest it was a bit weird when i started the game and playing as archer to 30 then switch to bard and still DPS.. I wasn't a fan so I change to arcanist(for scholar)

I like the idea of bard as a healer and enchanter, I wish next expansion square enix focus more into reworking some old stuff improving the classes

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Originally Posted by mallleable

As someone who plays BRD mostly for the archer/ranger aspects, I think that the way to improve on the job's fantasy is to find the overlaps between archery, and music. On a mechanical level, both involve plucking string be it a bow string or a stringed instrument which it does a mostly good job with its oGCD gameplay. On a more 'vibes' level, the overlap to me is 'rock star.' Robin Hood splitting an arrow in an archery competition could be seen as a rock star move -- really any impressive feats of archery could be seen as a rock star moves. And 'rock star's' association with music should go without saying. Which is to say, I lean more toward BRD being more of a DPS than a 'support' -- despite the history of bard as a class. Also as a musician outside of game, I feel like one should making music for themselves first and foremost -- if you are making music solely for other people, your art will suffer.

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Bard is a case were i feel splitting the music and archer aspect would have yieldet better results at the end.
Its a unhappy union atleast thats why i hear often....not exactly that mind you but in spirit.
As you say yourself you care mostly for one aspect.

While i agree making art exclusivly for other isnt good for one self, those art pieces still have an affect on others. So it could work either way. :)

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in theory they could add a second musician job based on Songstress from FFX-2 and well the general thing that Bards to have the "Sing" Command in other games.
Which would basicly act as Caster/Healer Musician.

No, I do like the current bard using martially inclined archer feats, and I don't understand what's the problem. I even find the bow-harps weapons kind of unique and interesting creatively speaking.

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Originally Posted by Valence

No, I do like the current bard using martially inclined archer feats, and I don't understand what's the problem. I even find the bow-harps weapons kind of unique and interesting creatively speaking.

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Its not a problem talk, its just a friendly conversation about if the "Bard" Fantasy would be suit a different execution. :)
There are no demands or anything.

I do think instruments and songs could fit as a healer theme.
You have something called "Sound Healing".

I feel as if ff14 healers kind of bland where they all have to be "mages"

Personally I would have loved a sort of ninja like healer or a holy knight healer (green paladin lol).

Not against the "mage" look (i play a lot of black mage lol) but all 4 healers somewhat play into that, leaves little room for more interesting designs.

I think part of that is that the only "mundane" healer in FF is the Chemist AKA Doctor, Salvemaker or Item Master. Otherwise it just White Magic used for healing or Summons.

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Originally Posted by Tunda

I agree 100%, even better if Bard would share EXP with DPS version of Bard same as Summoner and Scholar

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If that system worked well I would be on board with it, maybe it was the plan if SCH and SMN worked out well. But yeah not a fan of that happening.

Also the Devs ignore already that the Stories of the Class and the CLass that exist are so far distance from each other that these stories can become confusing.
Astrologian would be a good example for that as they speak about the different signs and effects or when the Scholar unlock quest told me about the different abilities of fairies.
Summoner faces similar problems....they realy would need to adjust them at some point.

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Originally Posted by Zeastria

I do think instruments and songs could fit as a healer theme.
You have something called "Sound Healing".

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LOTRO actually has this as a class, named Minstrel. It fits more with their "Morale instead of health," system, but it was also an extremely fun fantasy back in the day.

If at all possible, I'd definitely like it if Archer were forked, with modern Bard going over to ranger and Bard bard turning into support. However, the devs need to fix their encounter design philosophy to even allow for this. Healer and tank design is a joke, and the joke is so bad that even DPS are starting to get wrapped up in the awful encounter design problems. Though if they do this, they need to also make Bard bard no longer use bows. Summoners using books has caused annoyances to say the least, and it would be nice to fork the classes in such a way as to make the 2 classes use different weapons.

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Originally Posted by Valence

No, I do like the current bard using martially inclined archer feats, and I don't understand what's the problem. I even find the bow-harps weapons kind of unique and interesting creatively speaking.

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The problem is that the idea of Bards using music in a magical way is what people are used to in the FF franchise... And the mix between a martial archer and a bard doesn't sit well with some folks, myself included.

It's a matter of personal taste, honestly. I also think the BRD fantasy would be better realized as a DoM than a DoW, and the archer could benefit much more evolving into something like Ranger, adding archery to nature survival skills.

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Originally Posted by Taranok

LOTRO actually has this as a class, named Minstrel. It fits more with their "Morale instead of health," system, but it was also an extremely fun fantasy back in the day.

If at all possible, I'd definitely like it if Archer were forked, with modern Bard going over to ranger and Bard bard turning into support. However, the devs need to fix their encounter design philosophy to even allow for this. Healer and tank design is a joke, and the joke is so bad that even DPS are starting to get wrapped up in the awful encounter design problems. Though if they do this, they need to also make Bard bard no longer use bows. Summoners using books has caused annoyances to say the least, and it would be nice to fork the classes in such a way as to make the 2 classes use different weapons.

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Let them use the same weapon like summoner and scholar but with different stats.

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Originally Posted by Raikai

The problem is that the idea of Bards using music in a magical way is what people are used to in the FF franchise... And the mix between a martial archer and a bard doesn't sit well with some folks, myself included.

It's a matter of personal taste, honestly. I also think the BRD fantasy would be better realized as a DoM than a DoW, and the archer could benefit much more evolving into something like Ranger, adding archery to nature survival skills.

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This; Bard is practically the only existing job in Final Fantasy XIV with absolutely no resemblance to the traditional job in Final Fantasy. Even Sage you could reduce to ‘uses attack and healing magic equally’ which in theory is true of XIV’s version as well. But taking a traditional support/healer mage job and turning it into a physical damage dealer with no remnants whatsoever of what it’s actually based on, doesn’t seem like the vibe to me.
Doubly so when they then pair it with an entirely separate class it’s literally never been associated with in any Final Fantasy bar this one. Like, yes Edward can equip bows in FFIV, but I highly doubt anyone is going to associate him with a bow and arrow because he’s a Bard. So can Rosa, but they aren’t exactly smashing Ranger and White Mage into one job, so why is it ok to do that to Bard?

As a note, I’m well aware it’s far, far, faaaar too late for Bard to change to ever actually be a Final Fantasy Bard, and not a hideous Yoshida (tm) Bard, but I can still dream!

I always thought during ARR that Bard being a DPS class felt weird. A missed opportunity for a unique style of healer, in my opinion. Then Dancer was revealed for Shadowbringers! Finally, they could make amends! An interesting, colorful, non-magical healer! Aaaand RANGED DPS!

YoshiP, I am begging you, please give us Chemist as a non-magical healer. Please?

I don't know about Bard, I think it's fine as a semi-support ranged dps but a healer that is completely music themed would go hard

Kind of weird they'd let there be a painter who's paintings do damage, but wouldn't make Bard a musician who's music does damage/buffs team mates.

Current bard is an archer with party buffs. I would rather see a more buff/debuff music option, but that would break the homogenized class design.

If you look at other DnD games a bard is a distinct idea instead of "archer with some stuff bolted on top."