Please revert Monk back to its Shadowbringers state

It was cool to have a class that just focused on uptime and positionals. Please remove the new version of Perfect Balance that is essentially just copying Ninjutsu. It feels like its lost so much of its identity this expansion. And add back all the positionals.

Also, please don't remove the damage buff from Twin Snakes or the Damage-Over-Time from Demolish as shown in the Job Actions Live Letter.

I don't understand why these things couldn't have been added to a new job. Why does a job I liked have to be deprecated and changed completely? The class was fine in Shadowbringers after Anatman was fixed.

With apologies, I really like the current MNK and am looking forward to the new MNK as I'm really curious what the new meter does. Also, I do think the calling the chakra/nadi system "copying Ninjutsu" feels incorrect or at least like a stretch.

The summoning of MNK continues but nobody talks about it because its playerbase can be counted on one hand. What the fuck is there even left to do on the job once Twin and Demo are gone?

All GCDs with barely any positionals or timers sounds like riveting gameplay.

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Originally Posted by Sjol

With apologies, I really like the current MNK and am looking forward to the new MNK as I'm really curious what the new meter does. Also, I do think the calling the chakra/nadi system "copying Ninjutsu" feels incorrect or at least like a stretch.

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lol I play both NIN & MNK and yea its definitely a stretch. Also the new MNK is not bad at all actually, even better now that you dont have to stare at your 3 buff/debuff timers 80% of the encounter.

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Originally Posted by velswen

Also, please don't remove the damage buff from Twin Snakes or the Damage-Over-Time from Demolish as shown in the Job Actions Live Letter.

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Might be removed to combat the Dragon Kick meme spec. Although I kinda hope I can just spam Dragon Kick and the Riddle followups are just bonus attacks.

So Dragon Kick spam, Chakra Attack Spam, Riddle Spam.

Again, identify.
What is mean with that?

First on:
Wich Shb monk did you mean? Pre or after rework?

Its true, that i liked the after-rework Version more as the current one. But the reason for that was, that he became so simple and streamlined, that i was able to punch everything before me, while i shutted down my brain.
He was fast. Had movement and a easy looking moveset (1,2,3, 4,5,6, 1,2,3 ... and switching sides, if i reached 3 or 6).
And, it was fun to shot Kamehameha at the ground, while walking.

The current monk to the other hand included the missing system for the monk. I was sad, to not be able to shot Kame-ha at a free point. But the new gauge maked it a little more fun. You need at last minimal brain activity, with the "same color" combo. And that was the only downside i have with the current monk.
The same color System was hindering my skill flow a litte.

But, even with that do i not see any reason, to go back to the shb monk. The DT monk by other hand looks to expande the current monk even more. What looks even better for this questionable "identity" of the job.

The new monk and nadi system is fun imo, I miss the positionals but I understand what they meant when they said it might be a bit much for some players to manage the new system and all the old positionals all at once.
I look forward to the changes for DT monk too!

For me, the bottom line is this: I don't enjoy current buff/DOT-tracking MNK, but I'm really looking forward to leveling DT MNK.

There's a lot that I like about the MNK, from the aesthetics to the abilities, but I really don't enjoy the short-DOT/short buff track at all. With the DT changes, I plan to level MNK (I stopped at 50 because of the DOT/buff tracking) as soon as I finish the MSQ.

The main thing I'm looking forward to is the new 2,3,4 rotation as opposed to 2,2,3 and seeing how that affects the feel.

Currently, between PB windows, Bootshine will always be followed by either Twin Snakes or True Strike, with the only thing changing being whether you use Snap Punch or Demolish. However, that rhythm is going to change, so hopefully, t makes things more interesting. Only time will tell.

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Originally Posted by Keichi

Again, identify.
What is mean with that?

First on:
Wich Shb monk did you mean? Pre or after rework?

Its true, that i liked the after-rework Version more as the current one. But the reason for that was, that he became so simple and streamlined, that i was able to punch everything before me, while i shutted down my brain.
He was fast. Had movement and a easy looking moveset (1,2,3, 4,5,6, 1,2,3 ... and switching sides, if i reached 3 or 6).
And, it was fun to shot Kamehameha at the ground, while walking.

The current monk to the other hand included the missing system for the monk. I was sad, to not be able to shot Kame-ha at a free point. But the new gauge maked it a little more fun. You need at last minimal brain activity, with the "same color" combo. And that was the only downside i have with the current monk.
The same color System was hindering my skill flow a litte.

But, even with that do i not see any reason, to go back to the shb monk. The DT monk by other hand looks to expande the current monk even more. What looks even better for this questionable "identity" of the job.

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When people complain about identity, there rarely is an explanation of what they meant. Aesthetics? Playstyle? Since ARR, or dare I say 1.0 most jobs feel the same just some had unique skills and animations that change with every expansion. So I'm not getting where these people are coming from, unless they just want what said job was in a specific expansion -- in which the job will then become stale since there wasn't much done with it in years. So if they change a job, people get upset. If they keep it the same people get upset.

The only change I really want to see is Gill toss as a low leveled Pugilist ranged attack. Why Gil toss?
Because Monk has been in need of a low-level spamable ranged option. Plus, one of the Pugilist quests had us picking up Gil anyway so it would fit.

Just make the ranged attack a role action at that point.

Or better yet don't homogenize the jobs any further, when MNK has different tools for dealing with movement downtime already.

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Originally Posted by Equitable_Remedy

For me, the bottom line is this: I don't enjoy current buff/DOT-tracking MNK, but I'm really looking forward to leveling DT MNK.

There's a lot that I like about the MNK, from the aesthetics to the abilities, but I really don't enjoy the short-DOT/short buff track at all. With the DT changes, I plan to level MNK (I stopped at 50 because of the DOT/buff tracking) as soon as I finish the MSQ.

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Then don't play current Monk. There's no reason that every job has to be changed to fit your playstyle. People who enjoy buff-tracking and DoT skills have had nearly every single class in the game taken away from them. And people who enjoyed moving around constantly for positionals have lost that too. I just wish SE would stop taking away jobs that some people enjoy just to replace them with something that appeals more to the lowest common denominator (not referring to you, just the general trends for all jobs losing gauge/buff management and whatnot in the past few years.)

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Originally Posted by ThorneDynasty

Just make the ranged attack a role action at that point.

Or better yet don't homogenize the jobs any further, when MNK has different tools for dealing with movement downtime already.

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This is another thing I agree with, Monk doesn't need any ranged skills they already had tons to do during periods where they step away from the boss. But players who are very bad and don't understand that blame the game instead of taking advantage of the tools we currently have.

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Originally Posted by velswen

Then don't play current Monk.

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I don't - as the post that you quoted said.

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Originally Posted by velswen

There's no reason that every job has to be changed to fit your playstyle.

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This is a strawman - no one is arguing this position. I neither asked for MNK to be changed nor said that it needs to be. What I actually said was that the changes that are coming make the class more appealing to me.

I'm somewhat apprehensive but also excited for the monk changes, Mainly I hope that the new system (replacing your DOT/Damage buff) doesn't feel too different from current monk... I don't know why they needed to change it honestly it feels like a weird excuse for another gauge... I didn't really need to look at the DOT timer or my buff timer after playing it for a while.

I'm also not sure how I feel about it having "ranged attack" (I think with the fire ball attack),I don't understand why people complained about "no ranged attack when Six sided star exists (although i'd like it to be learnt eariler), I guess we will have to actually see the changes..

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Originally Posted by Tracewood

When people complain about identity, there rarely is an explanation of what they meant. Aesthetics? Playstyle? Since ARR, or dare I say 1.0 most jobs feel the same just some had unique skills and animations that change with every expansion. So I'm not getting where these people are coming from, unless they just want what said job was in a specific expansion -- in which the job will then become stale since there wasn't much done with it in years. So if they change a job, people get upset. If they keep it the same people get upset.

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Funnily enough, most of the DPS jobs feel very different to me compared to, say, WoW. I can't find a single class that isn't variations on: "press 1 until proc/short cooldown/buff/debuff tells you it's time to press something else." That gameplay is beyond tedious to me, while the DPS jobs of FFXIV are rather varied and I can appreciate the differences even between 2 otherwise similar classes, like the trio of MNK/SAM/NIN, known for their fast GCDs and typically single weaving (now.)

On that final point, it's not "If they keep it the same people get upset." It's "If they keep it the same, people leave the class." Which is exactly what happened to Monk. The EW changes made the class more popular, and hopefully moving away from DoT/timer based rotations will make it more popular still, since it still is a bottom 5 class.

Speaking of bottom 5, however, we see 2 examples of stagnating classes in bard and BLM. Also, a new entry slowly moving into this point of stagnation, RDM. These 3 classes are most likely in need of updating moving into DT past the initial launch.

Personally, I'm fine with classes updating. I hate the ninja changes, but the class is demonstrably still popular. Old mains leave, new ones come in. That's fine. The problem is mostly when the devs destroy entire playstyles. That's when people not only quit classes, but quit the game as a whole. Which, well, EW has been doing, but for the cdps role, not mdps.