AI generated Armor Assets

I would prefer this than more reskinned stuff in dungeons or anywhere else please. Consider if there is ever instances where there is no time or budget to hand make them, just use the AI instead of making a reskin of an existing asset. And worse yet, an undyeable reskin.

https://media.tenor.com/wyr6octeS9IA...sunny-nope.gif

No. No you would not.

In fact, I bet because AI doesn't tire and is infinitely faster it can make armor sets that do take into account anatomical differences in races, so tailed races could have sets that don't clip, ears show, etc... I don't want to stick to the "old ways" because AI is new and people are afraid of it. Better is better.

That's like having a tool that could help cure cancer by running thousands of simulations per second because people have some sort of attachment to doing things the traditional way by regular trials. And while I encourage traditionally designed assets, there is no point in getting a copy/paste of an old asset if we could get something new even if done by AI.

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

No. No you would not.

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I absolutely 100% would, in fact if AI could make all armor fit all races with all their features I would be in favor of that full time than ppl cutting my tail off manually TBH.

AI have "tragedy of the commons" written all over it. Here's a number of things that can and will happen medium to long term:

- people gradually stopping to study art, because it will become impossible to find jobs
- AI regurgitating the same stuff over and over, because of a lack of new material produced by actual human artists to train the AIs from (they're regurgitating engines and incapable of true creation because they don't have any actual "understanding" of human culture). Expect a great stagnation in the themes and art styles of games (and other things) in the medium to long term as everyone turns to AI to crank up "new" concepts that will constantly recycle the same crap.
- Oh and another fun thing, AIs will become increasingly trained on crap that was produced by other AIs, resulting in gradual degradation of the results as they will reproduce and amplify the mistakes made by the previous AIs.

And yet people will rush to use it for easy short term gains like "getting more armors in the final fantasy 14 video game" or "not having to pay employees that have ludicrous demands like not working 24/7 or eating".

SE showed that they already automated it so that gear adjusts to the different races. Sometimes they may still have to make adjustments, but they actually showed us the dev environment where they click a button and it adjusts it for all the races.

Blizzard recently did the same for WoW, from my understanding, using AI. Whether SE use AI to achieve it or not, I'm not sure, but they vaguely explained it was automated.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

SE showed that they already automated it so that gear adjusts to the different races. Sometimes they may still have to make adjustments, but they actually showed us the dev environment where they click a button and it adjusts it for all the races.

Blizzard recently did the same for WoW, from my understanding, using AI. Whether SE use AI to achieve it or not, I'm not sure, but they vaguely explained it was automated.

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There's no need for AI to do this kind of things. Believe it or not, computers have been used to automate things long before the recent AI fad.

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Originally Posted by Ath192

I would prefer this than more reskinned stuff in dungeons or anywhere else please. Consider if there is ever instances where there is no time or budget to hand make them, just use the AI instead of making a reskin of an existing asset. And worse yet, an undyeable reskin.

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https://media0.giphy.com/media/MF0qj...=200w.gif&ct=g

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Originally Posted by Taliriah

AI regurgitating the same stuff over and over

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Perhaps if you don't inject the ideas into the AI yourself. If you inject your fresh idea into the AI but say "do it faster for me", then it's still fresh.

Where it regurgitates is when you don't give it any input and just say "come up with something".

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Originally Posted by Taliriah

AI have "tragedy of the commons" written all over it. Here's a number of things that can and will happen medium to long term:

- people gradually stopping to study art, because it will become impossible to find jobs
- AI regurgitating the same stuff over and over, because of a lack of new material produced by actual human artists to train the AIs from (they're regurgitating engines and incapable of true creation because they don't have any actual "understanding" of human culture). Expect a great stagnation in the themes and art styles of games (and other things) in the medium to long term as everyone turns to AI to crank up "new" concepts that will constantly recycle the same crap.
- Oh and another fun thing, AIs will become increasingly trained on crap that was produced by other AIs, resulting in gradual degradation of the results as they will reproduce and amplify the mistakes made by the previous AIs.

And yet people will rush to use it for easy short term gains like "getting more armors in the final fantasy 14 video game" or "not having to pay employees that have ludicrous demands like not working 24/7 or eating".

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This is a doomer argument that doesn't work. People have been doing things traditionally since the dawn of time even when others forms have surpassed them in efficiency. There are still hand tailored dresses/outfits, horses and buggies, steam locomotives, armor designers, martial arts teachers of all manner of practices that are obsolete. Art will follow the same path, those who like to draw will continue to do so and study it because it is a passion, not a job. With this alone, rest assured AI will enhance visuals by providing better quality assets when the other solution is to copy and paste.

This sort of fear of the new has always happened, and people think technology will steal our jobs. The reality is the quality of life of every human being on the planet is 1000 times better thanks to automations, progress and technology. But if you ask a hunter gatherer to go into an ER and have surgery he will obviously freak out in a panic and decide to "ride out" his appendix exploding because he is unfamiliar with modern medicine and scared of it.

Either way, AI is here to stay and this is the worst it will ever be, meaning its going to get exponentially better and not using it will soon not be an option due to competition from those who aren't afraid to use it. Like the nuclear bomb, if you watched Oppenheimer, if you don't, others will. They can both coexist, and hopefully, for the asset designers it frees them to do the best quality work they have ever done, because their designs can now be master pieces since they don't need to design 50 armors just because the game has 50 dungeons and they need to pump them out like a sweat shop.

Companies are unable to enforce copyright for AI generated art. If the source of art in a game cannot be directly attributed to an artist or developer, anyone can utilize such AI generated art. Not going to happen any time soon.

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Originally Posted by Taliriah

AI have "tragedy of the commons" written all over it. Here's a number of things that can and will happen medium to long term:

- people gradually stopping to study art, because it will become impossible to find jobs
- AI regurgitating the same stuff over and over, because of a lack of new material produced by actual human artists to train the AIs from (they're regurgitating engines and incapable of true creation because they don't have any actual "understanding" of human culture). Expect a great stagnation in the themes and art styles of games (and other things) in the medium to long term as everyone turns to AI to crank up "new" concepts that will constantly recycle the same crap.
- Oh and another fun thing, AIs will become increasingly trained on crap that was produced by other AIs, resulting in gradual degradation of the results as they will reproduce and amplify the mistakes made by the previous AIs.

And yet people will rush to use it for easy short term gains like "getting more armors in the final fantasy 14 video game" or "not having to pay employees that have ludicrous demands like not working 24/7 or eating".

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AI is technology like any other. It can be disruptive in some respects, but unless we decide to never move forward technologically again we need to learn to live with it and avoid the potential problems. People won't stop studying art because art can still be performed for the sake of it, or because AI won't fully replace artists. AI also has no motivation like you said so somewhere in the process of AI generation a person must be involved. With AI to do repetitive work we can have more people to focus on creativity. If AI generation statnates due to a lack of trainable material, that also leaves opportunity for human artists to create.

The solution to the pitfalls of AI isn't to avoid AI, it's to integrate it correctly into the processes we have now. Being totally against AI is just going to lead to stagnation and worse products, just like banning computers in favor of work done by hand or banning cars to force reliance on horses.

I would be fine with them using AI to generate concept art.

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Originally Posted by CaptainLagbeard

I would be fine with them using AI to generate concept art.

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Ai trained on which artist's works? Are those artists being paid?

It can be supportive. I know at least one MMORPG-in-the-making that utilizes AI to some minor extent. The caveat is that all images the AI trains on are generated in-house by artists whose time and effort is bought and paid for specifically to train the AI.

The AI art is also "directed" by the developers/artists, therefore copyrightable. It is not done via the current AI-driven websites typing "male catboy wearing chain mail armor bikini".

It's all in how and where it's used. If it's used to port large amounts of assets to another race or to re-mege existing gear with more polygons I'm all for using AI. If it's for designing from scratch that's where I say no; unless it's for giving artists/designers ideas.

It's always cheaper to use the fruits of someone else's labor without paying them. In that sense, AI is a great idea!

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Originally Posted by LilimoLimomo

It's always cheaper to use the fruits of someone else's labor without paying them. In that sense, AI is a great idea!

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I would agree but AI's not a human. The problem with AI replacing human jobs is a problem with the type of government you agree to live under, or forced to live under.

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Originally Posted by DPZ2

Ai trained on which artist's works? Are those artists being paid?

It can be supportive. I know at least one MMORPG-in-the-making that utilizes AI to some minor extent. The caveat is that all images the AI trains on are generated in-house by artists whose time and effort is bought and paid for specifically to train the AI.

The AI art is also "directed" by the developers/artists, therefore copyrightable. It is not done via the current AI-driven websites typing "male catboy wearing chain mail armor bikini".

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If they do decide to go the way of AI, it would most definitely make the most sense for them to get their own in house AI trained off of their own artists work.

And as I said, use it for concept art, still would need people to actually turn it into actual ingame content and what not.

The fact that you even feel comfortable posting this is disgusting.

The art theft machine needs to go back into the trash where it belongs.

would much rather have a handful of hand-crafted models that get recolors every few months than a bottomless swamp of soulless sludge.

Whens SE going to give me a Dislike button?

What you leave out is that every major technological evolution has also come with significant negative societal effects until humankind has regulated its worst uses. For example, labor and safety laws for factories; regulatory agencies for food and drug mass manufacturing; road and safety laws for the internal combustion engine; medical regulatory agencies at the advent of medicine and surgery. The list goes on and on.

My concern is the various thought that has to go into making AI safe and a net good for society has not yet happened and a lot of people are going to be hurt along the way until it is.

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Originally Posted by Panic_at_the_Discord

would much rather have a handful of hand-crafted models that get recolors every few months than an bottomless swamp of soulless sludge.

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I definitely wouldn't. I'm unsure what a machine could come up with that has any less soul than clicking CTRL C and CTRL V on my keyboard and changing the color on an armor and call it a day. At the end of the day no matter how much push back AI receives, just like any other revolutionary inventions have in the past it will become a dominant tool sooner or later.

It would be cool to see it used for some nice in game assets whenever the company is too short staffed to create those assets themselves. There is a clear shortcoming in the capability of creating assets for all of XIVs content that drops loot, and this could shore up the weakness. If all assets were unique and well-made then I would probably be against AI replacing those. This is not the case though. I have no problem replacing reused assets that didn't bring anything new to the table.


I wanted to see how soulless an AI armor would look like to convince me to prefer the copy pasted assets we have, so simply openning up whatever AI windows bundles in with PCs now a days I asked it to create a fantasy armor set and to show me an elf wearing it.

here is the result:

https://i.imgur.com/1ZWmvYA.png



NGL, those armor sets look SUUUUPER cool, and I would much rather have some of those sets in game than another armor set like the "Classical" version we got in Endwalker, which was just the stormblood PvP armor again. These are crafted sets too, meaning players take time in game to make them and they are just crafting a reskin basically...

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Originally Posted by CaptainLagbeard

And as I said, use it for concept art, still would need people to actually turn it into actual ingame content and what not.

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What would be the benefit of that? Art still has to be created to be fed into the AI program to reconfigure into concept art, so why not just get people to create the concepts directly from their own ideas (ie. exactly what they're already doing) and skip a needlessly complicated and expensive part of the process that makes little difference to the end result?

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Originally Posted by Iscah

What would be the benefit of that? Art still has to be created to be fed into the AI program to reconfigure into concept art, so why not just get people to create the concepts directly from their own ideas (ie. exactly what they're already doing) and skip a needlessly complicated and expensive part of the process that makes little difference to the end result?

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Mostly speed up the process, since with a good enough machine they can make easily a few hundred sketches in an hour and see if it managed to put something good together to start working off of.

The fact we're discussing AI just shows SE has a problem. 1 Modder is able to create viera/hrothgar hats with ear holes and overall high quality meshing-work.

Something SE can't do in 6+ years, almost 7 now.

As paying consumers it's understandable we'd cry out for SE to adopt AI to get things like these done? I think it is. Something as simple as hats should not take a professional company 7 years.

Biizzard itself is blushing at SE's ability to tell its customers "we'll fix it later" when it comes to everything now.

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Originally Posted by Ath192

I would prefer this than more reskinned stuff in dungeons or anywhere else please. Consider if there is ever instances where there is no time or budget to hand make them, just use the AI instead of making a reskin of an existing asset. And worse yet, an undyeable reskin.

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Begone, heathen.

Nah, I'm good on supporting removing jobs from people and encouraging a toxic precedent to be set in the industry.