Alright, It's time, We need Light Party Extreme Dungeons

I don't care if they blatantly rip off Mythic + dungeons from wow, the point is, I'd really like something that lets me do the same idea as Mythic+ dungeons with 3 of my other friends, and get raid comparable loot (for the extra difficulty, I'd really like this to be an alternative to difficult raid content, being on par with that difficulty if not more difficult), and the aesthetics with it as well (aesthetics that are unique to extreme light party dungeons, just as there is loot that is unique to raids for aesthetics).

Square is triple downing on their current mmo, may as well give the players additional choices and challenges if you're going to sink all this capital into sustaining this mmo rather than making a new one.

Giving players more choices = good. Yeah, you have to develop more art assets to give 4 man dungeons their own aesthetics and gear so that raiders can do both and get double the cool aesthetics, but like, that's your job, man.

Raid worthy 4 man content has already shown it is a massive success, and only adds to player options, which is good for your sub numbers.

Make it happen Yoshi, stop being so hard headed on it.

I mean, we have those already, they just need to adjust the loot tables for them.

Aye though Critieron also give you a nice weapon for finishing.

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Originally Posted by Eloah

I mean, we have those already, they just need to adjust the loot tables for them.

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They could be so much better, a system that's adjacent to raid tier events.

That is exactly what Criterion is and if they add in something like an alternate way to get tome gear upgrade items then that will probably make them more appealing. If you want them to fully compete with Savage with like a separate loot table and comparable gear drops, I don't find that likely.

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Originally Posted by TaleraRistain

That is exactly what Criterion is and if they add in something like an alternate way to get tome gear upgrade items then that will probably make them more appealing. If you want them to fully compete with Savage with like a separate loot table and comparable gear drops, I don't find that likely.

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Problem is again that tomestone gear simply is too good. There is no room between Expert Roulette and Savage Raids for any content with meaningfull rewards. But Criterion would need that gap. And a grindy relic armor would be nice to have as well.

Criterion is this.

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Originally Posted by Tint

Problem is again that tomestone gear simply is too good. There is no room between Expert Roulette and Savage Raids for any content with meaningfull rewards. But Criterion would need that gap. And a grindy relic armor would be nice to have as well.

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OP isn't asking for something in that gap, though. They want it to be on par with difficult raid content and Criterion is Savage level.

I don't think they want to do this because the game isn't balanced for 4 man, Criterion shines a massive light on how abysmal balancing in this game really is.

This is what criterion tried to be

my problem in this game are the two sides in terms of mechanics: boring on the casual side and stale high precision with full party need to be alive on the other side.

they would need a new mechanic design for something like this... or at least more in the direction if bozja

They really need to have midcore content that's difficult for more basic reasons like more AoEs to dodge, more mechanic overlap, higher incoming damage, etc, not puzzle/body check mechanics that are almost guaranteed to wipe people the first time they happen.

Criterion is closer to savage with the amount of coordination it requires, and I feel like a proper midcore experience should be difficult but not "I need to read a guide on every single mechanic" difficult.

Chiming in and confirming that Criterion could have easily been just that but their design choices yet again prevented it from being so...

The rez limit should have been Criterion savage only while having free support in their normal versions imo. It basically turns off a lot of players that want some challenge but need a gentle nudge in that direction.
Instead it just feels like it's something close to Ultimate where making just one mistake will just kill your run --> that will basically scare 80% ppl away if not more.. That perfect play mentality has to go for midcore contents

Which is a shame cause doing criterion myself, the content itself is very refreshing being extreme to savage difficulty with only 4 players instead. It feels more of a raid than the 8man "raids" do atm...

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Originally Posted by Ayan_Calvesse

Aye though Critieron also give you a nice weapon for finishing.

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That's Criterion Savage. The issue comes with regular Criterion, and that's where they should focus some kind of gear progression.

I'd say, move the V&C dungeons to odd patches and make a tier just for Criterion - also another excuse to make unique glam models. Didn't they say we'll have more rewards in the future? The weapon cosmetic glams is actually a perfectly good reward for the Criterion Savage, though.

Criterion Savage should be known as Ultimate, I swear the learning curve on them is wild with basically 20 minutes of perfect gameplay required with no taking a break.

I'm not asking for them to make them easier, I actually love them.
And I hope my description inspires some peeps to give it a shot!

4-man savage content with better loot, challenge, replayability and meaningful progression? I want it too
I don't know if the xiv team understand what WoW's mythic dungeons are, but they need to go study from it - I'm honestly sick of 8 man savage content & idk what the xiv team was thinking with criterion, but they missed the mark

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Originally Posted by Asari5

my problem in this game are the two sides in terms of mechanics: boring on the casual side and stale high precision with full party need to be alive on the other side.

they would need a new mechanic design for something like this... or at least more in the direction if bozja

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Thats part of the new fight design at work
don't you love it? remove all job complexity -> add more body checks
body checks for all

Would love something like Mythic+ in FFXIV but by the Gods do not DARE to introduce a Time Limit/Enrage timer. This is just lazy design.

I was thinking about this earlier today, and I got the idea that if the criterion normal could give gear with the same ilvl than the memoquartz and upgradable the same way, it would be great. (Unique skin and different stats of course.) It would not make it totally equals with savage as it would need it anyway. The savage version would be here as a reason to use the gear. And then criterion would release in .X5 of even patch to maitain interest in the patch.