Is Bard a difficult job?

I don't know, I feel like it's pretty difficult, a lot of stuff to keep track of, busy ass burst windows, minucious optimization, risky af... most people agree with me but those who don't say it's braindead easy, like one of my friends said it's objectivelly easy because there's no animation lock, and I find this argument dumb because lvl 50 summoner would be harder than bard in this case. What's your opinion?

I wouldn't say it's hard, but it kinda demanding at 90 in terms of APM and attention required. You have to be pretty strict with your song timings, and oCGDs uses on top of song procs that have a chance occur every 3 seconds. It's mostly just incredibly, and maybe a bit too punishing when you die in fights. Like with all jobs, it takes practice, but eventually you start to internalize the timings, and when decisions have to be made. I really enjoy its hectic playstyle even though I feel like it could use a little more 'oomf' to its damage output.

You have to gauge what you mean by hard or not.

My wife plays it as her main job and she plays incredibly poorly from an optimization standpoint…yet she can 100% do all the content she wants to do and clear the game.

Of course, she’d never be allowed in any kind of endgame raider party…but she doesn’t care to do that in the first place.


So is it hard to beat the game with? No. Is it hard to clear 99% of the content in the game suboptimally? No.

Is it hard to do the rotation correctly to put out similar dps to others in savage? Don’t know.

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Originally Posted by kaynide

My wife plays it as her main job and she plays incredibly poorly from an optimization standpoint…yet she can 100% do all the content she wants to do and clear the game.

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You can press one attack button all game from level 1-90 ARR - EW and clear this game. During normal content noone cares what a DPS does, let alone a phys ranged lol. Depressing, but true, so this isn't a useful perspective on the job at all. A rock could clear this game.

Bard is deceptive. You would think it's the easiest job because you just spam 1 GCD. But it's actually the hardest ranged physical job, in my opinion.

Bard has to:

• Apply DoTs and refresh them right before they expire, without getting distracted by mechanics.
• Keep songs up and rotate them as each one expires, without fall off.
• Resist the temptation to use Pitch Perfect until they have reached 3 Repertoire stacks so it has max potency, then spend so they don't overcap.
• Try to use Apex Arrow near cap without overcapping.

Rest is just easy weave everything off cooldown.

In comparison an MCH just presses everything off cooldown and that's kinda it. The hardest part of MCH is accidently starting Hypercharge before using Drill/Air Anchor/Chain Saw, or overcapping Gauss Round and Ricochet, but compared to Bard it's just a ZzZz tank rotation.

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Originally Posted by Ath192

You can press one attack button all game from level 1-90 ARR - EW and clear this game. During normal content noone cares what a DPS does, let alone a phys ranged lol. Depressing, but true, so this isn't a useful perspective on the job at all. A rock could clear this game.

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That's (sadly) my point. There really isn't a reason to be good at the game or make an effort to be better when you can do it all with NPCs; it's not like you're inconveniencing others.

I get wanting to be good at the game if that's something someone feels is worth their time...but I dunno, I feel if someone wants to play a game that rewards playing well they either A) have to want to do the savage-level content, or B) might consider trying a different game that demands better play and rewards them for their efforts.

OP was asking if the job was hard to play, and my long-winded answer was essentially that it depends what content they're going to play.


Back to OP: This isn't to say "don't play good! you're wasting your time!", but to say "You don't need to worry about it unless you intend to play at a certain level of Endgame." I wish you all the best if you're looking to get better, but also wish you the best if this alleviates stress or anxiety about "doing it wrong."

I don't find Bard to be particularly difficult, mostly just DoT and song uptime to worry about honestly. The main thing that can interfere with that is boss mechanics happening at around when you need to refresh the DoTs so they might slip while you're not looking or the song runs out.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

• Try to use Apex Arrow near cap without overcapping.

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I would say some overcapping is fine if it's just before your burst window is coming around. Losing a few points in order to have a fully charged Apex/Blast Arrow with Raging Strikes and Radiant Finale.
And generally I find it to recharge a little over twice total over the course of all 3 songs.

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Originally Posted by Vandso

I don't know, I feel like it's pretty difficult, a lot of stuff to keep track of, busy ass burst windows, minucious optimization, risky af... most people agree with me but those who don't say it's braindead easy, like one of my friends said it's objectivelly easy because there's no animation lock, and I find this argument dumb because lvl 50 summoner would be harder than bard in this case. What's your opinion?

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It depends on what your goal is.

First, 99% of difficulty of any classes are due to the 2 minutes meta, where you have to align everything and jam packed into your burst window. Which is only important if you are going for Floor 3 and 4 clears on the first month, or you want to play competitive on FFlog for internet cookies.

Secondly, if your goal is to play so that you can meaningfully contribute to the party without being a deadweight. For example you're happy with 50-60 ish percentile with maybe the occassionally 70ishthen yes, BRD can be said to be pretty easy. In fact, all the 3 P.Range can be pretty relaxing to play, that's one of their selling point. When I switch from DRG to BRD it's so relaxing it made me feel skittish because it feels like I'm missing something and should do more.

And before anyone ask, I hate FFlog with a passion and want that thing burnt in hell. But I can't run from the fact it's one of the primary metric most people know, so using it as a frame of reference provide clearer and more meaningful context.

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Originally Posted by Vandso

I don't know, I feel like it's pretty difficult, a lot of stuff to keep track of, busy ass burst windows, minucious optimization, risky af... most people agree with me but those who don't say it's braindead easy, like one of my friends said it's objectively easy because there's no animation lock, and I find this argument dumb because lvl 50 summoner would be harder than bard in this case. What's your opinion?

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I feel of the aiming Bard is middle of the pack; Machinist being the hardest as they got to manage more of a straight jacket rotation. Dancer is the easiest though as it stands Dancers suffer from RNG feathers tremendously. I mained bard End of SB and start of EW and I found that the songs felt more reliable then Dancers feathers regarding procs. I actually mapped one of my mouse buttons to click and play a song and actually play a IRL song with the duration I was supposed to let the song run for...a 2nd click of my mouse would click my next song and queue up the next song in media player. Its kinda makes barding fun - sadly your also the generally lowest damage of the aiming classes and with the iron-clad marriage to 2min meta it feels like I'm not bringing anything to the battle that a Dancer doesn't do better.

As a former Bard main, I honestly say it's probably the second-hardest job after BLM for optimization.

For level 90 optimization, I would put it close to the top in difficulty:

Have to pay attention: BLM/NIN
Have to pay attention but not above: MNK/RPR/DNC <<<BRD goes here
Have to pay attention but not boring: DRG/SAM
Have to pay attention but still boring easy: MCH
Technically have to pay attention: RDM
Don't have to pay attention: SMN

BRD in particular keeps tacking on more and more things as it levels. All subject to change in a few months though.

Difficult is subjective. With Bard, it becomes a lot easier when you start organizing your bars. I do mine like this:

Bar Number [left] <---> [right]

3 - [song and coda related]
2 - [multiple target shots] <---> [buffs and debuffs]
1 - [single target shots] <---> [utilities and movement]

(Duty and Role actions are on a common, shared bar)

Next, think of your songs as party buffs. Get the whole musical idea out of your head. That's just job flavor. There's one sequence for single target and one for packs. Save Pitch Perfects until stacked. Single and multiple target ranged attacks should be easy and fall into a normal "priority" based rotation. Apex arrow!

It's actually rather simple, especially if you level like you're supposed to and get used to each abilitiy as you get it. I could see where many jobs might be confusing if you boosted. Not saying you did, or planned on it. Just pointing it out.

Read a full guide.

my 2nd fav job is bard, i don't find it that difficult to play. only thing i forget sometimes is refreshing the dots with iron jaws lol

BRD being Hard is subective, some will find it hard, others won't, and that all depends on a bunch of different aspects like location, ping, how good said player is, etc. In my own personal opinion, it's not hard, just keep your dots up and remember your priority.

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Originally Posted by VictorSpoils

For level 90 optimization, I would put it close to the top in difficulty:

Have to pay attention: BLM/NIN
Have to pay attention but not above: MNK/RPR/DNC <<<BRD goes here
Have to pay attention but not boring: DRG/SAM
Have to pay attention but still boring easy: MCH
Technically have to pay attention: RDM
Don't have to pay attention: SMN

BRD in particular keeps tacking on more and more things as it levels. All subject to change in a few months though.

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RDM's high end optimization is actually interesting, but the payoff is so small that other than trying to fit an extra finisher inside Embolden, I usually don't really care for it.

I'm fine with gameplay having different levels of difficulty among jobs, but it would be a best case scenario if every job had some sort of high end optimization to aim for. The thing that awards you that extra 5% dps, that probably won't matter anywhere else.

I wouldn't call it hard as much as....annoying. Those arrow proccs can be a bit distracting, if not overwhelming.

Personally, I always hated how the shots are instant but the animations have a 'cast time,' it makes me question my ping, not to mention it's visually jarring.

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Originally Posted by bloodSp3c

my 2nd fav job is bard, i don't find it that difficult to play. only thing i forget sometimes is refreshing the dots with iron jaws lol

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This. I can keep track of my song times, my gauges and the mechanics no problem but by god do I forget to refresh those dots sometimes.

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Originally Posted by bloodSp3c

my 2nd fav job is bard, i don't find it that difficult to play. only thing i forget sometimes is refreshing the dots with iron jaws lol

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Never understood why after disconnecting the DoTs from other abilities they didn't just have Iron Jaws apply the DoTs. Maybe in a future update they'll streamline that. It made sense when they affected other abilities but now it's just more buttons to press.

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Originally Posted by TaleraRistain

Never understood why after disconnecting the DoTs from other abilities they didn't just have Iron Jaws apply the DoTs. Maybe in a future update they'll streamline that. It made sense when they affected other abilities but now it's just more buttons to press.

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I'm fairly certain BRD is gonna lose one or both dots in DT, and I'm fine with that. If it loses one dot, say Stormbite then that just leaves Caustic Bite, and there will be no need for Iron jaws. You apply with Caustic Bite, and you reapply with Caustic Bite. The changes I would like to see is that BRD gets walking casts on Burst Shot, and then Stormbite gets reworked to be an ability that grants a personal haste buff for a duration, leaving Caustic Bite as the only dot. Iron Jaws could be reworked to be a conical AOE GCD that applies the Caustic Bite dot -- it could be called Gorgonbite to keep with the snake theming.

It's not necessarily hard unless you go into a static and they start making demands that change weekly to keep up with what THEY want. its not difficult but it can be tedious.

but that's my experience with it. and it made me switch to DRG which was my main through ShB & EW. I've slowly transitioned to BLM (wasnt for me) into NIN but I will be viper bc I don't like the ninja aspect & want to play a thief/rogue, not a ninja.
bard is not hard, just watch a few current guides & practice the rotation & then do it quickly without overlap.

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Originally Posted by Vandso

I don't know, I feel like it's pretty difficult, a lot of stuff to keep track of, busy ass burst windows, minucious optimization, risky af... most people agree with me but those who don't say it's braindead easy, like one of my friends said it's objectivelly easy because there's no animation lock, and I find this argument dumb because lvl 50 summoner would be harder than bard in this case. What's your opinion?

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I think one thing that's vital to accurately understanding these comments is that difficulty is subjective. You listed a variety of things about Bard that you find difficult, and for you they are. But there are probably plenty of people who find those same things to be easy. And likewise, there are surely things those people find difficult that you find easy.

Personally, I think Bard is one of the easier classes because its overwhelmingly instant cast ranged kit provides a freedom of movement and the ability to reactively change tactics on a dime. To me, the stuff Bard asks you to keep track of is the only thing that makes the job engaging, and the only thing that's difficult about it is not getting so bored waiting for something remotely interesting like a proc to happen that you forget to upkeep your dots.

But again, I'm just one person and that's my subjective opinion. It's going to be different for everyone.

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Originally Posted by LilimoLimomo

I think one thing that's vital to accurately understanding these comments is that difficulty is subjective. You listed a variety of things about Bard that you find difficult, and for you they are. But there are probably plenty of people who find those same things to be easy. And likewise, there are surely things those people find difficult that you find easy.

Personally, I think Bard is one of the easier classes because its overwhelmingly instant cast ranged kit provides a freedom of movement and the ability to reactively change tactics on a dime. To me, the stuff Bard asks you to keep track of is the only thing that makes the job engaging, and the only thing that's difficult about it is not getting so bored waiting for something remotely interesting like a proc to happen that you forget to upkeep your dots.

But again, I'm just one person and that's my subjective opinion. It's going to be different for everyone.

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That's my take as well, Lilimo. I feel Bard is one of the easier classes to play. It's mobility and ability to adjust are superb.

It may mean you will lose a DoT here and there but you'll stay alive if you're paying attention. That counts for something.

Try it for yourself;
You can't really tell if a job is difficult or not
without trying to learn it yourself..

Other people's experience isn't entry true for you..because they're not YOU!.