So uh..why does this forum hate FFXIV youtubers so much?

I really don't understand it.

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Originally Posted by Kaliesto

I really don't understand it.

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The most important rule applies: If someone criticizes FFXIV, they will be hated.


Edit: This is not a good thing, and it happens way too much in this community.

Because the x3 mean peopwe said my game isn’t :3 pewfect, theiw opinyion is wwong, my pwimawy activities of EWP *whispers to self* and asking fow mawe ;;w;; codes is mowe awive than evew *sweats*
*starts twerking*

Because posting about them is an easy way for trolls to stir up controversy.

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

Because the x3 mean peopwe said my game isn’t :3 pewfect, theiw opinyion is wwong, my pwimawy activities of EWP *whispers to self* and asking fow mawe ;;w;; codes is mowe awive than evew *sweats*

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Edit - aw you edited it out.

Lmao, that made me giggle. xD

You can tell the size of the man by the size of the things that bother him.

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Originally Posted by Kaliesto

Twerking...

Lmao, that made me giggle. xD

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I dealt myself some mad physic damage putting that into a post

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Originally Posted by Iscah

Because posting about them is an easy way for trolls to stir up controversy.

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Case in point

If there is controversy just by posting a video made by Zepla without any editing, that says something about the community ^^

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

Because the x3 mean peopwe said my game isn’t :3 pewfect, theiw opinyion is wwong, my pwimawy activities of EWP *whispers to self* and asking fow mawe ;;w;; codes is mowe awive than evew *sweats*
*starts twerking*

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Strong emphasis on the "3x mean people" because everyone who criticizes the game is perceived to be a gaius, aveyond, or stormpeaks alt, lmao.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

Because posting about them is an easy way for trolls to stir up controversy.

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Such concerns are voiced by many individuals who are not classed as such, however - suggesting that there's quite a bit of merit to them.

To say nothing of the fact that people criticising the game on any front (particularly when it comes to the story) face the very real risk of being sent credible death threats. As such a prominent content creator speaking critically of the game is such a breath of fresh air to those of us who regularly find ourselves stalked, threatened and persistently harassed by the more unhinged elements of this game's community.

It's not really a hated. I mean sure, some people do, but for the most part most people either support the youtuber because their opinions align, or they're against them for the opposite reason.

Then there's a handful of us around here who just admit that it's a youtube/e-celeb and that they don't speak for the general population(although some of those people only follow this idea when it benefits them).

https://media2.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2...PDDW/giphy.gif

I don't watch streamers because quite frankly, I make my own opinion. (Good for them for taking time to create content tho!)

That said, most ppl on this forums are trolls who just snipe at eachother over discords, past posts etc. It's quite a toxic forums here if you just want to jump into a constructive discussion and share ideas.

I really wouldn't pay it no mind. :)

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Originally Posted by Kaliesto

I really don't understand it.

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They don't, it's just react farm threads that would go away mostly if the forums only allowed 1 account per IP.

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Originally Posted by DivineP

I don't watch streamers because quite frankly, I make my own opinion. (Good for them for taking time to create content tho!)

That said, most ppl on this forums are trolls who just snipe at eachother over discords, past posts etc. It's quite a toxic forums here if you just want to jump into a constructive discussion and share ideas.

I really wouldn't pay it no mind. :)

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I don't think that's the case. There's the occasional 'troll', certainly, though as someone who has posted here consistently over the years I've never struggled to have meaningful discussions and debates with various individuals. I've even managed to make quite a few friends here who play on completely different servers/datacentres who I otherwise would not have met if not for posting on the official forum.

I'd say in terms of toxicity, there's far more to be found over on the likes of Twitter and Reddit which regularly allow individuals to say far more abhorrent things than they would get away with here.

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Originally Posted by SquishyPlushie

They don't, it's just react farm threads that would go away mostly if the forums only allowed 1 account per IP.

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Given that many people in a shared household play MMO's together using the same IP, I'm not sure that'd work out very well at all.

https://media4.giphy.com/media/9LPjXFCA3Bwgo/giphy.gif

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Originally Posted by Theodric

Given that many people in a shared household play MMO's together using the same IP, I'm not sure that'd work out very well at all.

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You are talking to what is likely a RaenMan alt or one of his friends.

I don't care either way or another. I can form my own opinion thus I don't need another to tell me what it should be. I have met people who can't form their own opinion so they always find someone else to tell them how they feel. However...

Sometimes it's good to see what they say cause they can put your own opinions and feelings into better words than your own. That said I just find youtuber content creators to be annoying and pander to their audiences.

Cause their assessments are usually accurate, just like conspiracy theorists and people don't like that. ahem (shills).

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Originally Posted by Renalt

I don't care either way or another. I can form my own opinion thus I don't need another to tell me what it should be. I have met people who can't form their own opinion so they always find someone else to tell them how they feel. However...

Sometimes it's good to see what they say cause they can put your own opinions and feelings into better words than your own. That said I just find youtuber content creators to be annoying and pander to their audiences.

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The problem is half the front page is just alt accounts at any time. Hence you get a post like this asking why the forums are stuck on one topic when it's often one very bored person doing it all.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

Given that many people in a shared household play MMO's together using the same IP, I'm not sure that'd work out very well at all.

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Alternatively:

- Phone number verification and the phone number cannot be used more than once.
- If an IP address associated with a blocked account, other accounts can't use the same IP to comment from.

Or just give up on this 20 year old build of vbulletin and switch to discourse with trust factor.

"Nobody talks bad about my final fantasy!" unsheathes katana, basically as soon as a streamer stops slurp glurping, the NPC's come out in full force

I don't watch any of them and I don't care what they said.

I doubt this forum hates youtubers at a greater frequency than anywhere else. Every one of them has their share of haters. Although I think some youtubers attract it a lot more due to their characters being deliberately controversial.

I don't personally watch them much for information purposes because I'm not exactly new to the game. Mostly just for entertainment purposes, or to see what they think in the very same way I read here to see what people think, or confirm that I understand a strategy people want to do.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

I don't think that's the case. There's the occasional 'troll', certainly, though as someone who has posted here consistently over the years I've never struggled to have meaningful discussions and debates with various individuals. I've even managed to make quite a few friends here who play on completely different servers/datacentres who I otherwise would not have met if not for posting on the official forum.

I'd say in terms of toxicity, there's far more to be found over on the likes of Twitter and Reddit which regularly allow individuals to say far more abhorrent things than they would get away with here.



Given that many people in a shared household play MMO's together using the same IP, I'm not sure that'd work out very well at all.

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Yet the post below yours speaks volumes. :)

Constructive discussion when?

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Originally Posted by DivineP

Constructive discussion when?

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When people aren't allowed to flood the forums with alt armies to farm reacts off people for fun.
It's hard to engage in proper discourse when you know that's happening.

For instance, when I left actual feedback, the posts were immediately farmed for argument loop reacts. People who do this know who they are, don't need to name names at this point, and I think at this point they want their name to passed around like some form of notoriety.

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Originally Posted by Noumenon

This is amusing considering you came back right as NekoSenpai got banned, and abuse thread tags just like he did.

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Sir or Maam, you're in a thread where I'm explicitly asking for alt hopping to be blocked, which I very much doubt alt hoppers would want. I am myself, and only myself, and starting to get the feeling I'm the only one using one account.

As well, I legitimately don't know you or the names you've mentioned. If you see tags from more than one person being the same there's a good chance it's because there's a trend of posts ongoing, and people are trying to identify the types of posts, regardless of author.

It would also be prudent to stop this conversation before your continued callouts identify as harassment.

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Originally Posted by SquishyPlushie

flood the forums with alt armies

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This is amusing considering you came back right as NekoSenpai got banned, and abuse thread tags just like he did.

The FFXIV forum hates anything related to FFXIV. Yet they continue paying despite this (I know because they keep posting here and you need active account to do it).

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Originally Posted by DivineP

Yet the post below yours speaks volumes. :)

Constructive discussion when?

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When SE can be bothered to moderate their own forum properly... and even then, it's still better than the other sites he mentioned. Reddit being something of a meme in terms of how it's moderated.

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Originally Posted by Noumenon

This is amusing considering you came back right as NekoSenpai got banned, and abuse thread tags just like he did.

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Exactly. I have been lurking on these forums for years.

I've seen multiple 'Titan men's, discords where ppl get called out from another person / people. Can we just go back to discussing the game instead of building cults?

No wonder the devs don't post here.

+1

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Originally Posted by DivineP

No wonder the devs don't post here.

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That'd be rather strange, since as Lauront pointed out it's their forum and they're fully in control of it. If they want to clean the place up they absolutely have the power to do so.

In this forum are maybe 12-15 consistent posters. And of them are maybe 1-3 very vocal people who dislike zep for the controversial over hogwarts legacy or for quitting. And if she Says something that's in anyway opinionated then yea.. People out if hate for her will say black is white.

- as a side note btw. My old fc through out 3 members who played hogwarts legacy and stalked the others who left over it-

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Originally Posted by Theodric

That'd be rather strange, since as Lauront pointed out it's their forum and they're fully in control of it. If they want to clean the place up they absolutely have the power to do so.

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I really hope they do. It's s toxic mess.

I recently voiced my opinion in the recent community dev post.

At the end of the day, I read these forums for ideas and information. But when it's spammed by ppl like totanmrn, stormpeaks etc I just don't want to read anymore.

Very bad look for SE tbh.

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Originally Posted by SquishyPlushie

Sir or Maam, you're in a thread where I'm explicitly asking for alt hopping to be blocked, which I very much doubt alt hoppers would want. I am myself, and only myself, and starting to get the feeling I'm the only one using one account.

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Oh please, NekoSenpai was literally writing thread tags like "ban evaders be gone" when he ban evaded from RaenMan. You're beginning to sound more and more like him.

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Originally Posted by Noumenon

Oh please, NekoSenpai was literally writing thread tags like "ban evaders be gone" when he ban evaded from RaenMan. You're beginning to sound more and more like him.

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And this is what I mean.

Sniping ppl with no PROOF they are an alt.

These forums need some serious moderation.

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

Because the x3 mean peopwe said my game isn’t :3 pewfect, theiw opinyion is wwong, my pwimawy activities of EWP *whispers to self* and asking fow mawe ;;w;; codes is mowe awive than evew *sweats*
*starts twerking*

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This absolutely killed me lol

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Originally Posted by Lauront

When SE can be bothered to moderate their own forum properly... and even then, it's still better than the other sites he mentioned. Reddit being something of a meme in terms of how it's moderated.

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I agree, in principle at least - as the emphasis has to be on "properly".

I've said this before, but I was permabanned from the forum of another game for expressing a negative opinion - I commented that the CM of said game needed to learn how to use a spellcheck and how to proof-read his sloppy blogs and news posts (since they were/are always filled with spelling errors, poor grammar, and incorrect dates), and actually learn how to make a professional looking customer-facing product. I also noted that there wasn't really any viable excuse for said CM's work to be so sloppy after six years and a promotion.
My forum account there became inaccessible a few hours later. Truth hurts I guess - but a friend, who still plays that game, still sends me links to the blogs the CM of that game produces and they're just as sloppy and unprofessional as ever, and the Devs of that game don't seem to mind demonstrating, via Twitter, their disdain for anyone who dares say anything negative about them or their game.

That sort of thing is probably why some do take to Reddit - to express opinions that forum moderators may not/won't tolerate.

I do think that there is a large amount of territory that lies between the extremes of what would be considered under moderated or over-moderated and I'm not sure many forum moderators (anywhere) are great at finding that balance.

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Originally Posted by Kaliesto

I really don't understand it.

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This happens in most gaming forums. Content creators are always hated by the forumites, no matter what game.

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Originally Posted by Carin-Eri

I agree, in principle at least - as the emphasis has to be on "properly".

I've said this before, but I was permabanned from the forum of another game for expressing a negative opinion - I commented that the CM of said game needed to learn how to use a spellcheck and how to proof-read his sloppy blogs and news posts (since they were/are always filled with spelling errors, poor grammar, and incorrect dates), and actually learn how to make a professional looking customer-facing product. I also noted that there wasn't really any viable excuse for said CM's work to be so sloppy after six years and a promotion.
My forum account there became inaccessible a few hours later. Truth hurts I guess - but a friend, who still plays that game, still sends me links to the blogs the CM of that game produces and they're just as sloppy and unprofessional as ever, and the Devs of that game don't seem to mind demonstrating, via Twitter, their disdain for anyone who dares say anything negative about them or their game.

That sort of thing is probably why some do take to Reddit - to express opinions that forum moderators may not/won't tolerate.

I do think that there is a large amount of territory that lies between the extremes of what would be considered under moderated or over-moderated and I'm not sure many forum moderators (anywhere) are great at finding that balance.

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As I see it, their role is to just make sure discussion is cordial and respectful, and largely stays on track. Their job is not to police opinions and there's elements of the TOS which are less than ideal in that respect, which fall into the kind of scenario you mentioned. Problem is, the exact same issue exists on reddit and to an even worse degree in terms of how capricious and opaque the moderation can be over there, coupled with moderators being responsible for multiple subreddits which are meant to nominally be independent of one another. And that's not even getting into the active userbase attitudes there. It's an independent site so maybe there's less of a reasonable expectation for fair moderation there (although equally it just sours my view on it that much more), but if this site is not well moderated there is ultimately only one party to blame. And I largely refuse to cut them SE slack for avoiding this place (other than to supposedly collate feedback) since it is one of their own making, plus they're fine visiting sites which have even more hostile environments for this. I don't think a forum is even an ideal way of harvesting feedback when tools like surveys exist, but sometimes they may end up asking the wrong questions in those so a forum can help course-correct. If SE is resigned to just not bothering with this site beyond obtaining summaries then so be it, but the decision lies at their feet.

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Originally Posted by SquishyPlushie

Alternatively:

- Phone number verification and the phone number cannot be used more than once.
- If an IP address associated with a blocked account, other accounts can't use the same IP to comment from.

Or just give up on this 20 year old build of vbulletin and switch to discourse with trust factor.

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Really, do you think any of that is necessary given the info they likely hold on your account already and can cross-check across accounts through firmer data they hold? If they wanted to do any of it, they could. I don't think they really care all that much.

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Originally Posted by Swordsman

The most important rule applies: If someone criticizes FFXIV, they will be hated.


Edit: This is not a good thing, and it happens way too much in this community.

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If someone opens their big mouth to try to spread garbage I don't agree with you better believe I am going to refute it. If they don't like it tell them to keep their trap closed.