TOP cleared without healer.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k65bhdogQKw

Props to the team that actually pulled that off.

Cool for the group that cleared but it's just depressing to know healers are still able to be made redundant! Like the most recent ultimate and it does not need a single healer. That's terrible to me. This will be my second tier now as a dps main... I miss my stormblood astro still :(((

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I3LZ65gwYGA

Skip to 3:30 for Xeno's opinion on it if you're in a hurry.

I'm inclined to agree entirely with his conclusions on it. It's very cool, it's very niche, but it also demonstrates that SE's approach to content design is fundamentally flawed (and IMHO has been for a long time now).

Just delete cover and force healer LB3 problem solved

ok but yeah for real Healers really need some work...

I don’t believe it’s a healer problem. It just bad design. What made it worse that the tanks can basically heal the party now, and the DPS can contribute healing on top. It’s the latest ultimate so for this group to do that, yeesh, that’s a sting for the devs for underestimating the players once again.

With any luck, the devs will be nerfing the healing on PLD and WAR a bit to help alleviate this.

How exactly does that help? The sensible solution would be to dump the stupid autoless critless bosses and spread the damage around more in the fight. Mitigation checks don’t really necessitate healers as you can clearly see.
Or they could remove addle, feint and party buffs to put them on healers.

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Originally Posted by fulminating

Mitigation checks don’t really necessitate healers as you can clearly see.

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Thats because to force a healer as requirement its not a mitigation check that is needed. Mitigation is about avoiding damage, which is what a tank does by default. So any event that only requires mitigation to beat, can in theory be trivialized this way.

Its an actual healing check that must be done: either through unblockable damage (making damage reductions like a tank lb ineffective since the value is staticly decided), or heavy damage over time (severely going over values and timespans mitigation can handle. for example losing 400% of the HP, but with 10 second intervals between each hit of 80%). As long as the healing requirement is more than mitigation is capable of blocking, a healer gets required again.

Tank lb3 is however to me quite an acceptable exception for most cases. Its an lb3. If that negates the need for a healer, it in theory could also in certain contexts negate the need for a tank (for example you take a dps with heavy self sustain, and focus the healing on that dps making him effectively like a tank. and potentialy even rotate the dpses so they can als recover their cooldowns). That its possible doesnt always mean its easy, most often these chalenges even if they are possible, are simply not the way to normaly handle such content.

There are a few proper healing checks in the game, and usualy they involve doom: dont heal someone to full health fast enough and they die. They arent even an issue in 4man content as a lvl 50 dungeon already uses such mechanic. This is something mitigation cannot cancel out as these are generaly combined with a static 'drop this player to x health'. More of these types of mechanics would definitely be welcome (instead of the contant: esuna this doom, which are only applied upon mistakes to begin with). I dont care that several wipes can happen, in 8man content due to having 2 healers it is normaly well doable anyway. The ivalice raids already involve such healer check, and while its trivialy easy to beat, it makes healers mandatory.

Why do I have visions of every single fight opening with a 1HP into Doom if not healed to full mechanic over all of this ;)

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Originally Posted by Sebazy

Why do I have visions of every single fight opening with a 1HP into Doom if not healed to full mechanic over all of this ;)

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Don't be silly...just make every raidwide a 1-shot if your health isn't at max. :p

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Originally Posted by RyuDragnier

Don't be silly...just make every raidwide a 1-shot if your health isn't at max. :p

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I almost want that to happen, just to be rid of the ranged DPS that feels like they should be 50 miles away from the rest of the group because they're ranged. Get in healing range or die.

Yoshi: "We hear you loud and clear."

*Removes Selene*

We all saw this coming...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Iedarus

Yoshi: "We hear you loud and clear."

*Removes Selene*

We all saw this coming...

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She's still there for the summon dress up game.

Saltbuncle on the other hand is now the perfect pet for Scholar.

I can't wait to get mine.

Put the sects back, put the faeries back.
All we're getting is convergent evolution to the literal worst designed healer.

Dunno why but when I came back to find this news after a tiny break of not playing the game, feel like just gonna:

Bahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahabsurd.

Surprising? No. Disappointing? Absolutely lmao. *slow clap*

Quote:

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Originally Posted by fulminating

Put the sects back, put the faeries back.
All we're getting is convergent evolution to the literal worst designed healer.

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The only way I can see them bring Sects back is if they do what I suggested long ago...make Neutral Sect the DEFAULT for Aspected heals. Half shield, half HoT. Weaker than SCH and WHM's, but useful because it's both at the same time. Diurnal Sect can then sacrifice the shields for X amount of time so it does stronger heals and HoTs, and Nocturnal Sect sacrifices the HoT for stronger shields for X amount of time. Both share the same cooldown, and it makes the Sects something you're actively having to swap depending on what you need. Because just having a different stance you're stuck with all battle is...not a good idea (we've seen how hard it is to balance).

Fairy glam makes sense considering Eos and Selene are two modes of the same fairy known as Lily. But I'd prefer for them to make Seraph the permanent form after level 80.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by GrimGale

She's still there for the summon dress up game.

Saltbuncle on the other hand is now the perfect pet for Scholar.

I can't wait to get mine.

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She's there but she's not. Yoshi saw that healers can still be made redundant in the hardest content in the game and still saw fit to shave down any potential for future skill expression.

They just need to remove tanks party wide healing and just have low self-healing like most dps gets.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by RyuDragnier

The only way I can see them bring Sects back is if they do what I suggested long ago...make Neutral Sect the DEFAULT for Aspected heals. Half shield, half HoT. Weaker than SCH and WHM's, but useful because it's both at the same time. Diurnal Sect can then sacrifice the shields for X amount of time so it does stronger heals and HoTs, and Nocturnal Sect sacrifices the HoT for stronger shields for X amount of time. Both share the same cooldown, and it makes the Sects something you're actively having to swap depending on what you need. Because just having a different stance you're stuck with all battle is...not a good idea (we've seen how hard it is to balance).

Fairy glam makes sense considering Eos and Selene are two modes of the same fairy known as Lily. But I'd prefer for them to make Seraph the permanent form after level 80.

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That seems like a really good way of addressing the sects - sorting out the levelling order might be a bit of a pain, but as long as it works well enough at 70 it should be fine. I like that it also plays into the stars aligning thing in a way too, favouring whichever aspect.

I don't know that I agree on making seraph the permanent faerie, if there must be a permanent one, lily should be it really. At the same time, given the fairies are literally introduced as "the sunlight of Eos doth soothe and shield. The moonlight of Selene doth silence and strengthen" (similar to the astrologian's diurnal sect being regens and nocturnal being shields), it seems sensible to preserve that. I'm not entirely sure how technologically possible it'd be, but having 2 actions/faerie until 80 and being able to use any faerie action from selene/eos while the faerie's up after 80/lily would feel like a sensible development without removing player options?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by RyuDragnier

The only way I can see them bring Sects back is if they do what I suggested long ago...make Neutral Sect the DEFAULT for Aspected heals. Half shield, half HoT. Weaker than SCH and WHM's, but useful because it's both at the same time. Diurnal Sect can then sacrifice the shields for X amount of time so it does stronger heals and HoTs, and Nocturnal Sect sacrifices the HoT for stronger shields for X amount of time. Both share the same cooldown, and it makes the Sects something you're actively having to swap depending on what you need. Because just having a different stance you're stuck with all battle is...not a good idea (we've seen how hard it is to balance).

Fairy glam makes sense considering Eos and Selene are two modes of the same fairy known as Lily. But I'd prefer for them to make Seraph the permanent form after level 80.

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This was how I assumed AST was gonna launch, since the stars themselves y'know move? so you have to adjust if you wish to continue observing them lmao.

Then again I thought SMN was gonna launch with no pets but morphing part of themselves/using limited attacks a la Yuna in Dissidia. Funny looking back on that given how XVI and EW SMN ended up turning out XD

It can be depressing to know, how less needed healers are, yes.
My tank Partner and i had maked fun about it, that whe had to clear EW bosses of the 90er dungeon very often only with two people. Because healer and other DD died.

But, for the whole picture is it good in my eyes.
It reduce the responsiplity and stress of the healer, to play completly right. It allow the healer to make mistakes, without the risk, that you alone (or two Player alone) are the whole reason for a wipe.

Yesterday by the last new raid have whe wiped around 4-5 times, only/mostly, because both healer died at the same time. And there was no one who was able to ress them (give more classes this option, like in Eso). It sucks, that one/two Player alone are so important to the whole group.

Yeah, they could give the healer more work, by using more aoe attacks again the player. Or using more tank buster. But, it would suck for the Black mage. Because, he can not take much dmg (i dont know much about the white mage durability, because i use the scholar more, as a healer. I like barriers, who prevent dmg, more, as having stronger healing power). And can easily die by unavoidable attacks. When he dont has his shield ready or max Lp (and, he isnt much of the prio list of healers).

And, healer have enough to do, before the group reach a boss in the dungeon.