Alliance Raid 6.3 tidbits from the trailer

So in 6.3 alliance raid we have Nophica, Althyk + Nymeia, Halone and Menphina as the last boss most likely. While this mostly follows the pattern most have already figured out, the addition of Nymeia, which most would've guessed would've been introduced in 6.5, leaves one unknown spot open for the last tier, as alliance raids tend to have four bosses.

For 6.5 alliance raid we now have Thaliak, Llymlaen and Oschon, with a mystery fourth. Any wild guesses as what the fourth might be?

Maybe something involving the Whorl?

It's interesting that they had Nymeia on full display, but made sure to hide parts of Nophica. You'd think Nymeia would be the "surprise". My guess is there is something about Nophica's face they are trying to hide. I doubt it's the booba, they haven't shied away from showing it before.

From the zoomed out shot before they move away we see Nophica on the left, Nymeia, Menphina, Althyk and Halone. As you can see the green of Nophica's dress and the icy tip of Halone's spear. They keep on seemingly wanting to temper people's expectations on Nophica. I'm not sure why we are shown Nymeia. I do wonder how the supposed theme of love will be applied.

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Originally Posted by Eloah

I doubt it's the booba,

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You can actually see it in 1:49 of the trailer. I'm not an expert but it looks normal so it's definitely the face or just an attempt to tease the playerbase with nothing.

Another interesting point is that there are twin moons in the shots of the heaven of Ice. Which to me is interesting as the small red one was Dalamud. Yet Dalamud wasn't always part of the night sky or part of Menphina's symbols.

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Originally Posted by SannaR

Another interesting point is that there are twin moons in the shots of the heaven of Ice. Which to me is interesting as the small red one was Dalamud. Yet Dalamud wasn't always part of the night sky or part of Menphina's symbols.

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That actually raises an interesting question as to why it wasn't. When the 12's religion was built up post Allegan calamity, no one would remember that Dalamud was a fake moon. You would think it would have more cultural significance. But aside from one tiny cult in Gridania, it is never brought up. According to what I could find out it was originally white like the moon created to contain Zodiark. Guess it is important to note Etheirys has no real moons? (Went to Elpis at night and could not find a moon). Which means originally it had no rising/falling tides for its oceans.

And now I am curious as to what was used to symbolize Menphina before there was a moon/moons. Assuming they actually do predate Ancient society and were not some post sundering creation. I don't recall any mention of them on the First and that also could mean many things.

Lore can of worms has now opened.

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Originally Posted by SannaR

Another interesting point is that there are twin moons in the shots of the heaven of Ice. Which to me is interesting as the small red one was Dalamud. Yet Dalamud wasn't always part of the night sky or part of Menphina's symbols.

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And they're both actual moons. So this shows that whatever they are, they're neither reflecting objective reality or current understanding, because if they were then Dalamud wouldn't even be in the picture, or at the very least wouldn't be depicted as a moon. We know that present-day worship of and symbology for Menphina hasn't exactly caught up to that whole 'there's only one moon' thing, though, but the only Menphina worshippers we've ever met were the Lambs of Dalamud, who are... probably extremists whose beliefs can't be taken as religious canon. But we can't be 100% on that without meeting any saner ones, which we haven't. So whatever the Twelve and the heavens are, they're reflecting an outdated faith.

We've already ruled out that they're primals, but taking a similar tack on this would explain it: if they were brought into being by or shaped around the people's faith in the Twelve at basically any point between the fall of Allag and the earliest instance of a sight of them we have (the refugees heading to Gyr Abania), then they'd have a belief in Menphina that would include the two moons. It can't be recent (or recently updated), or it would only have one... and they also can't just be an Ancient thing by the same token; if Menphina predated Dalamud then she wouldn't see and depict it as a regular moon unless she was motivated by depicting something else. So whatever they are, the central inflection point for them in being what we see them as was neither primordially ancient nor extremely recent.

(FYI: Elpis apparently does sometimes have a visible moon, but we don't know if that's an oversight because it's extremely rarely visible.)


On a different tack, as someone whose main is a patron of Althyk, I am very disappointed by his depiction. Really, that's all you can do for a god of time? A jacked dude with the world's dumbest cape? He is by far the least interesting design in the raid.

(It is very funny that they forgot to render the ground behind him for the trailer, though.)

I'm not sure I'd go with that look either. But I'm also not sure how an austere emperor wielding a mythril greataxe is supposed to look like. Slightly disappointed that Menphina doesn't show off her Julian Mandeville cosplay. Unless she pops a skillet out during her fight at some point. The moon in Elpis does look funny and out of place. It also seems to only show up during the Astral weather at night. Though Elpis is so bright that even at night it doesn't ever look like night even if you're able to see the stars.

Yeah, Althyk looks very dull, but I can't say he is one of my favorites because his backstory with Nymeia is very creepy, though of course very in line with Olympians and ancient pantheons in general.
I'm more excited for the gods in the next raid because we'll get a double doze of extremely pretty lads with Thaliak and Oschon.

Another thing about Althyk though is that you can briefly see him riding on some sort of a steed in the trailer.
Menphina's wolf companion has this disk-like object on top of it, I wonder if that's supposed to symbolize the skillet or something else entirely.

Here's my wild prediction: Zeus is going to be involved in some way, possibly the final boss of 6.5 Alliance raid.
And yes, I base all of this solely on the fact that the raids are named after the three graces Aglaia, Euphrosyne and Thalia, which in Greek mythology are the daughters of Zeus.
:)

Not really related to the thread but I had to get this off my chest: Halone looks like an Angewomon digivolution.

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Originally Posted by Cassar

Here's my wild prediction: Zeus is going to be involved in some way, possibly the final boss of 6.5 Alliance raid.
And yes, I base all of this solely on the fact that the raids are named after the three graces Aglaia, Euphrosyne and Thalia, which in Greek mythology are the daughters of Zeus.
:)

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If this was the case, then Zeus and the Twelve being related to the ancients is inevitable. The pandemonium raid has really double downed on greek mythology references, I think only of all the bosses Proto-Carbuncle has no connection to greek mythology. I'm unsure whether Greek mythology is somehow connected to other parts of the lore outside of the ancients, but I think the hints are starting to pile towards ancients being somehow responsible, and now the last boss seat is an unknown contender, or at least of the final bosses.

This also makes me wonder, since Greek mythology is being pushed in the Pandemonium raid, there are some connections to the alliance raid. Probably not though, but Greek mythology is a factor that ties both of the raids.

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Originally Posted by JeanneOrnitier

Not really related to the thread but I had to get this off my chest: Halone looks like an Angewomon digivolution.

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Looks more like Lenneth Valkyrie to me.
https://static0.gamerantimages.com/w...eth-Skills.jpg

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Originally Posted by Cassar

Here's my wild prediction: Zeus is going to be involved in some way, possibly the final boss of 6.5 Alliance raid.
And yes, I base all of this solely on the fact that the raids are named after the three graces Aglaia, Euphrosyne and Thalia, which in Greek mythology are the daughters of Zeus.
:)

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See I'd actually go more for Cronus, the actual father of the gods (perhaps better known is his Roman counterpart Saturn, of the 'devouring his son' fame). Not only is it a bit more mythologically accurate and interesting, it also establishes them on a different 'level' than the Ancients we know. You crack out Zeus and the immediate assumption is to put him alongside or directly connected to Hades in some way, but Cronus sets them as something else entirely.

You could also go for Chaos, the primordial something that everything sprang from in Greek myth (whether or not it's an entity or just a thing is unclear), but... well, we've already used Chaos.

Perhaps the "whorl" the first of the Twelve were believed to have sprung forth from is an actual entity as opposed to some kind of natural phenomena?

There was that one portal that wasn't attached to a domain of gods, so whatever is there (maybe... an underworld god and a half to bring it up to 14 since Nald'thal is like, 12.5 and they like their 14 allegories? A forgotten god from the pantheon?) is likely the final boss.

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Originally Posted by KageTokage

Perhaps the "whorl" the first of the Twelve were believed to have sprung forth from is an actual entity as opposed to some kind of natural phenomena?

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I like this idea, actually. Leans into the notion of Chaos without BEING Chaos.

Im calling it now. Itll be Greg. Last seen falling into another interdimensional rift. Missing(so far) for multiple expansions. Fan favorite. Fan service to multiple former games. Already an established part of the worlds "lore". Has enough appendages to theoretically engage the tanks of all 3 parties at once. Possession of multiple "mythic" weapons from other dimensions easily explains having a myriad of attacks. Itll be Greg.

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Originally Posted by Eloah

It's interesting that they had Nymeia on full display, but made sure to hide parts of Nophica. You'd think Nymeia would be the "surprise". My guess is there is something about Nophica's face they are trying to hide. I doubt it's the booba, they haven't shied away from showing it before.

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My theory is that Nophica and Halone aren't rivals but are either the same person or two people sharing one body (similar to Nald'thal but less Transformer-like) as a metaphor for seasons changing. They'll probably serve as the transition from the Earth zone to the Ice zone. (✿´ ꒳ ` )
I think the boss order is going to be Althyk + Nymeia (they're siblings and you fought someone important to them in the last raid, Althyk's eldest daughter Azeyma and Nymeia's servant Rhalgr) then Nophica, who will transform into Halone mid fight, and finally Menphina.
This would also mean that Azeyma (who is Nophica's mother) and Rhalgr (Halone's father) are a pair (with no clue if Byregot is related to Azeyma).

Surprised nobody's hypothesized Nophica's face looking like our resident Seedseer leader of the Twin Adders, judging by the bit of canon (not legitimate, but in-universe depiction of) artwork.

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Originally Posted by Mimilu

My theory is that Nophica and Halone aren't rivals but are either the same person or two people sharing one body (similar to Nald'thal but less Transformer-like) as a metaphor for seasons changing. They'll probably serve as the transition from the Earth zone to the Ice zone. (✿´ ꒳ ` )
I think the boss order is going to be Althyk + Nymeia (they're siblings and you fought someone important to them in the last raid, Althyk's eldest daughter Azeyma and Nymeia's servant Rhalgr) then Nophica, who will transform into Halone mid fight, and finally Menphina.
This would also mean that Azeyma (who is Nophica's mother) and Rhalgr (Halone's father) are a pair (with no clue if Byregot is related to Azeyma).

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The order seems more likely to be Nophica > Althyk/Nymeia > Menphina > Halone judging from the teaser footage that suggested Althyk was the second boss (The first boss was already KO'd and he's the one speaking in the stretch after that boss).

I will say that the new song seems a bit...ill-fitting for Halone, though, as the bagpipes sound a lot more evocative of the rolling plains the heaven of earth bears, though it's possible they have multiple new themes this go-around.

The violin in the song really makes me think Nophica will be last. Like it would start in Ice and then move to the fields of grain. Showing things out of order is nothing new for them.

Nophica is the first boss. Yoshi-P showcased the alliance raid during the live letter. He had 1/6 progression, and he was standing in the first boss area in the middle of the golden fields with brown fences (with the boss already defeated). This is the same area you can see Nophica in during the 6.3 trailer.

After you defeat Nophica and progress further, the area starts building up with floating islands as we see in the trailer, and during this sequence in-game it's Althyk who speaks, so it'd make sense that the next boss is Althyk + Nymeia.

Afterwards we have no clear indication on who is next, but it seems that Halone is fought outside of the ice/crystal palace with the two moons, while Menphina's fight takes you inside the castle. Furthermore, you can see a group of trashmob in the same area as where you fight Halone, and I don't think any alliance raid ever has had you fight trashmobs before the last fight. So to me, taking into consideration you fight Halone outside the ice/crystal castle whathaveyou, and there's trashmobs before her fight, she is the third boss, making Menphina the last one.

This would also follow the pattern on the order we fight the Twelve as set by Aglaia. Encyclopedia Eorzea's page on the Twelve, and the Patron Deity selection screen makes the pattern quite obvious, as Byregot, Rhalgr, Azeyma and Nald'thal appeared in the order they did. One can only assume the same pattern will continue in Euphrosyne, with the only new addition being Nymeia with Althyk.

The opoopo or deryk could be the 12th, assuming one of the pair is oschon.

There could be a twelve prime fusion deal.

Nymeia could just decide to have a rematch.

The spare door could be involved, assuming I didn’t miscount.

There’s likely a second phase to the twelfth fight if patterns hold (diablos, ultima, her inflorescence) so that might be worth considering.