Great idea for the future of the island thing

Wouldn't it be a great idea to be able to be invaded by a player or players like in Dark Souls or to be able to invade the island of other players to take their resources instead of farming, basically to give a pk loot aspect.

And that you can build your island with all your guild, your friends and that you can create defensive npc to protect your island during your absence or give you enough time to counter attack.

To be able to build a castle with several floors and guards, or even mobs would give life to the island.

This is so my dream I know it will probably never happen but I really wish it...

Doesn't sound like a Paradise to me!

no thank you.

I rather enjoy the lack of a major focus on pvp and dont need an island sanctuary to be invaded to add some mobile game aspect of not touching it for a few days and coming back to have everything smashed or stolen.

hard pass.

sounds like you'd enjoy pvp, which we have multiple different modes of already.

I'd love this, just make it so we can only invade players who're currently online on their island without too much complication about NPCs and bla bla

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Originally Posted by ErryK

sounds like you'd enjoy pvp, which we have multiple different modes of already.

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I know I am a pvp mentor...

I find as I had already said that there are very few pvp modes and it is often very poorly done to believe that the person who deals with pvp does not know what he does...

making pvp casual and accessible also makes things worse...

So yes Bukachu even without complication it would be really fun and at worst why not let the player activate or deactivate the possibility to invade and be invaded if he is not interested in pvp

Of course activating the invasion should bring bonuses or rewards in case of victory against an invader for example

No.

Or if it is added only if you opt into it and it's default is that you are opted out of it. Meaning that players have to actively turn that option on.

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Originally Posted by HanWenqing

making pvp casual and accessible also makes things worse...

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Wouldn't this idea be making it very accessible?

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Originally Posted by Shibi

Wouldn't this idea be making it very accessible?

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"To unlock the Island Sanctuary, players must first have already finished the Level 90 quest from the MSQ titled Endwalker."

By accessible I mean level 30 when before you had to be at least level 50...

The island is accessible from level 90 so i don't think you understand what I was saying.

Basically, pvp should not be available to new players who are just starting out, but rather afterwards.
At level 90 which is the max level at the moment pvp should of course be accessible so it's not a problem

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Originally Posted by HanWenqing

Wouldn't it be a great idea to be able to be invaded by a player or players like in Dark Souls or to be able to invade the island of other players to take their resources instead of farming, basically to give a pk loot aspect.

And that you can build your island with all your guild, your friends and that you can create defensive npc to protect your island during your absence or give you enough time to counter attack.

To be able to build a castle with several floors and guards, or even mobs would give life to the island.

This is so my dream I know it will probably never happen but I really wish it...

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Nope. Have zero interest in PvP.

If SE wants to create a separate Island Sanctuary with such features I have no objections as long as it's completely optional and doesn't gatekeep other content just like current PvP.

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Originally Posted by HanWenqing

Wouldn't it be a great idea to be able to be invaded by a player or players like in Dark Souls or to be able to invade the island of other players to take their resources instead of farming, basically to give a pk loot aspect.

And that you can build your island with all your guild, your friends and that you can create defensive npc to protect your island during your absence or give you enough time to counter attack.

To be able to build a castle with several floors and guards, or even mobs would give life to the island.

This is so my dream I know it will probably never happen but I really wish it...

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This sounds like Atlas, should try it.

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Originally Posted by HanWenqing

By accessible I mean level 30 when before you had to be at least level 50...

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OK, I see, you are not using the word in the normal way.

FF ARK, Survival evolved

Np
/10 characters

I have a better idea: At the end of 6.5, Goblez will cast double meteors crushing your island, and you go on a revenge quest to make the island-wrecker pay!

A flat NO.

Opt in? Want to know what EXACTLY will happen when the VAST majority wont opt in?

"No one wants to fight me Square Enix please force them"

Take your "wurld pee vee pee" cesspool back to WOW where it belongs.

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it would be really fun

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For you.

Not for anyone else.

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Originally Posted by HanWenqing

Wouldn't it be a great idea to be able to be invaded by a player or players like in Dark Souls or to be able to invade the island of other players to take their resources instead of farming, basically to give a pk loot aspect.

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Given that the stated purpose of Island Sanctuary is low-pressure, casual content entirely separate from the rest of the game... no? The idea of a PvP mode where you can invade people's islands and loot their gathered resources as a "PK loot aspect" sounds like kind of the opposite of "low-pressure relaxing casual content".

I'm not saying that the idea of something akin to WildStar's "war plots" or whatnot might not be interesting, but I do think that Island Sanctuary would absolutely be the wrong place for it. (Honestly, I'm not sure there's a place that's more wrong for it...)

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Originally Posted by SassyAssassin

FF ARK, Survival evolved

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Look, I love dinosaur eugenics as much as the next survivor, as my ridiculous multi-generation effort to create the ultimate tek giga can attest. But that game is a mass of congealed jank and technical debt on a scale no other game has achieved... and hopefully no other game ever will.

Sure, we love it regardless. (Even if periodically it does weird things like log you in 4000 feet in the sky and then hurl you at the ground at terminal velocity, so you log in, see the ground for like half a second, and then find yourself at the oops-you-died respawn screen.)

But... I mean, FFXIV's got enough technical debt, spaghetti code, and weird net-jank without adding, like, ARK levels of jank to the mix. ;P

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(Honestly, I'm not sure there's a place that's more wrong for it...)

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Given the revulsion a great deal of the playerbase have for the kind of gankfest OP envisions, the entire game is the wrong place for it.

Put open world pvp into FF 14?..lose 80% of your players in a MONTH. Many of us wont play other MMOs as they DO have this kind of insanity..hell, New World tried it and found out FAST why people dont want it. What makes me laugh my head off at Amazon, is that they spent millions learning a lesson i could have told them for nothing.

"Most people do not actively dislike open world pvp..THEY LOATHE IT"

"Please, lets have open pvp where I can invade another persons island and set their progress back to zero..over and over and over again...it will be fun for me but I dont care about anyone else but me anyway........"

Yeah thats a good way to keep players doing that content

NOT.

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Originally Posted by VelKallor

For you.

Not for anyone else.

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I forgot you were representing anyone else...

Do you really need to be so aggressive, it's an idea I share if you don't like it but I don't understand your hatred it's pretty pathetic

Otherwise just an opinion from everyone maybe you should play a Lalafell
Warriors in armor don't fit your mindset I think.
I'm sure you'd be better off as a lalafell with a cook or a tailor as your main class, it's up to you.

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Originally Posted by HanWenqing

I forgot you were representing anyone else...

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There are only 2 groups here, those who want pvp, and those who dont.

And balance wise its very easy to guess who will benefit here:
Invaders: No risk (if you dont have a lot of resources, you cant lose a lot either), high reward (those who have a lot can be farmed)
Defenders: High risk (why gather when its easy to be stolen), no reward (because why bother with this if any potential reward is much easier to be taken away)

The first thing i do when such feature would exist is to instantly make my island private. And if it can still be invaded. My island will permanently have nothing. The animals will be freed, crops will be removed. And any structure demolished. I wont give a pvper anything.

It's not even bait at this point.

I don't think it would fit in with the lore they already laid out. Isn't the whole point that the islands are no longer harried by pirates after they fell into the fold with Limsa Lominsa? It would seem that the notion of some raiding force (player or non-player alike) wouldn't be happening now that the islands are more or less patrolled by either the LL navy or the pirates that no longer pillage.

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Originally Posted by dspguy

I don't think it would fit in with the lore they already laid out. Isn't the whole point that the islands are no longer harried by pirates after they fell into the fold with Limsa Lominsa? It would seem that the notion of some raiding force (player or non-player alike) wouldn't be happening now that the islands are more or less patrolled by either the LL navy or the pirates that no longer pillage.

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There's also the fact that there's really only one of these islands. Being able to have people over is just a courtesy.

Oh, now I see who started this. :rolleyes: Someone needs a real hobby.

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Originally Posted by VelKallor

Given the revulsion a great deal of the playerbase have for the kind of gankfest OP envisions, the entire game is the wrong place for it.

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See, I can actually see a place for it if it were specifically and solely PvP, and entirely optional. Something where it's like "to have a variety of training scenarios, we've decided to allow adventurers space on the unused coast of Hullbreaker Isle to set up fortified positions which can be assailed". Where the place you're fortifying and setting up is literally only for PvP.

The real problem with open-world PvP of any form is that PvP appeals to several different types of players. There are the players who like the challenge of 1v1 duelling. There are the players that like the added element of threat/danger to the game if they can be attacked by more than just overworld mobs; players, after all, are often smarter than mob AI is. There are players that like team PvP where you cooperate with folks to take down the opposition.

And there are PvPers who just like to roll folks less powerful than them and laugh about it. And sadly, that last group is often the loudest, and the ones who most vehemently insist that people should be forced to PvP.

To quote a post of my own from the New World forums roughly a year ago, when some folks were insisting that harvesting a resource node in a territory controlled by a different faction should force your PvP flag on so you could be 'punished' for 'stealing'...

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I think if you want to brainstorm ways to encourage PvE folks to flag for PvP – beyond the existing XP benefit – you need to first brainstorm ways to keep folks from being trolls about it.

When you have level 30+ folks waiting outside the gates of the starting towns, prepared to gank lower-level players who step outside flagged for PvP, you’ve got behavior which discourages anyone from actually flagging. I know I tried during one of the betas to go flagged permanently, and I spent an entire evening being killed every time I stepped outside the gates, because I was level 10 and there were four level 25 folks waiting immediately outside, until I gave up and unflagged.

As a result, I’m definitely not flagging PvP when I actually want to get my main story progression done this time around.

And as long as there’s nothing working to stop trolls from doing that, scenarios that enforce PvP flagging are only going to earn resentment specifically because the people for whom PvP means “lol I can kill the babies” (as opposed to “this provides an element of challenge and strategy to actually operating in this game”) will deliberately work to take advantage of those situations.

Look at EVE Online, which is all-PvP-all-the-time, but has a concept of star systems with high security (hisec), low security (lowsec), and no security (nullsec). Attack someone in hisec (without paying off CONCORD to look the other way by buying a war declaration), and the NPC lawkeepers will almost certainly vaporize you. This means players who want a chance to build up resources and skills can do so by sticking to hisec, and those who try to PvP troll them there (waiting at the starting starbases to blow up people in their first ships or whatever) will quickly be nuked… but all the profit to be had is in losec or nullsec, so you can’t really excel if you just hide in hisec.

Anything where you have enforced PvP, you need some sort of buffer, some sort of limiting factor on PvP when it comes to power differential, that lets new players actually get their feet under them and get started. Otherwise, new players are just chum in the water for trollsharks.

And chum rarely sticks around long.

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The idea proposed here gives incentive to the folks who want to PvP and raid other people's stuff; it gives no incentive to engage for the people who don't. Moreover, it has no built-in buffer; if someone is already a seasoned island raider and well-equipped to steamroller someone, if they start picking on low-rank islands, there's never a chance for a low-rank island to build up the resources necessary for an effective defense.

Meaning this system makes anyone just starting in island sanctuary effectively chum in the water, to reuse my own terminology from the above-quoted post.

Any PvP system, in order to have buy-in, needs to benefit all participants, at least in theory. Any that does not -- or which actively disincentivizes participation, as with this proposed idea -- will at best land flat. And if it's forced participation (or opt-out, rather than opt-in) it's likely to only cause resentment and frustration, and potentially harm player retention overall. Doubly so if there's no buffer that allows someone to build up the resources to participate in a meaningful manner, rather than just being cannon fodder for folks who are already established.

If it's opt-in only (and thus I can opt out), then I don't object to it, but it's not something I'd ever participate in. I got roped into a PVP server on WoW once, and it was pure hell.

As a pvper, bringing pvp to the island is really stupid.

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Originally Posted by HanWenqing

I know I am a pvp mentor...

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Oh boy...

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Originally Posted by VelKallor

Take your "wurld pee vee pee" cesspool back to WOW where it belongs.

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oh boy 2.0...

This is one of the worst ideas I've seen posted in this forum. Not as bad as that one time someone wanted to make the 1.0 tattoos buyable in Mog Station, but it's up there.

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One of the problems we observed with this system was that some high level players were killing low level players, A LOT. Sometimes exclusively. This often led to solo or group griefing scenarios that created a toxic environment for many players. To be clear, this behavior was not shown by all PvP players, but enough to cause significant issues.

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The "significant issues" were players saying the hell with this goodbye and never coming back

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We set out to build a compelling world full of danger and opportunity that begs to be explored. The intended design was never to allow a small group of players to bully other players. Based on what we saw, we realized that we needed to make fundamental changes and not just incremental fixes, (which we tried several times during the Closed Alpha).

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Back in WOW Legion we had an area, the Underbelly, where pvp was available..what we had were groups of 40 or 50 in raid setup ganking anyone for ingame currency...when Blizzard changed the currency so it was no longer available in raid groups, the gangs disappeared overnight.

Their vaunted 'world pee vee pee", as soon as they didnt have the comfort of a huge backup, ceased, they refused to 1v1 ..why?

Good GOD man, they might lose and we cant have THAT.....open world pvpers are little more than gankers, online sociopaths and sniveling, mewling cowards who attack lowbies / new players, and run like hell when a possible real fight turns up.

That would be awesome! I think Yoshi-P said they'll be making more islands for us, so maybe one of those islands could be that! Also, it would be could if you could also use your caught minions, animals and mammets to defend your island base as well.

We already have a minion battle system. No one plays it.

Maybe they should make the Island where if person invades your Island all the animals on it attack them along with all the mammets and minions. Then if you get defeated they put you in a cage till owner of the Island lets you out.

I'd rather they allow us to invite NPC quests to wander the island like the Minions do.

We have a TON of NPCs that could be put up for this as an option. They don't need dialogue, and we can put 10-15 at a time.

I'm talking Scions, Ascians, Villains, Faction Rulers, dead characters, Job Quest NPCs, MSQ characters, Godbert and Hildibrand NPCs, the works.

That sounds absolutely dreadful. Hard pass.

pvp system is even worse after the change. No thx!