An incentive to do normal trials

I like Storm's Crown and try to farm her card for now, but after that, I don't have an incentive to do the trial in normal mode anymore.



I know about trial roulette, yes, but just like Alliance roulette, it can be manipulated by lazy people to just run the simple lv50 trials, so chance you have the trial you like is very slim.



I know about Extreme mode, but the thing is that I don't do Extreme/Savage/Ultimate. To me, the difficulty in the normal mode is just about right for non-raiding players like me.


I run Fell Court of Troia in a daily basis without roulette cuz I want the gear/glam and like the aesthetic/music, as well as it gives nice income of weekly-cap tome. In comparison, The trial itself, like every non-ARR trial, takes as long as one of a new Panda: Abyssos raid to finish, but has worse tome income and drop nothing save for a chance for a card. And the card itself can be grinded with Extreme mode, so people don't really have any incentive to grind the normal trial if they don't mind the harder difficulty.



I remember that the ARR trial drops weapons/weapon coffers in normal mode, which I think a very nice addition. Even if I don't like the glam, I can just turn them into Grand Company seal for other goodies.


I like that even a non-raider can still benefit from the new 8-man raid tier with non-dyeable gear. I wish to see a similar treatment to trials for this game, which are rich in mechanic and diverse in execution even in normal mode, so that casual players like me can feel eager grinding them, enjoy the aesthetic, music, instead of just going through them once and done.

I wish normal mode dropped non glowing weapons and then extremes came *with* the glowing weapons rather than 2 years later
But thats a tradition the devs dont seem to want to break, sadly.

What would normal trials offer? Certainly not the weapons or the totems used to buy them.

If you haven't, I would still say to give EX a try. While more difficult, it's also more structured. The fights don't last more than 12 minutes. There are always people learning there. There's enough incentive in the loot table to run it regularly or casually.

Unlike the ARR, I've actually had pretty good luck with the trial roulettes. I can't remember the last time I got the same one two days in a row.

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Originally Posted by Deveryn

What would normal trials offer? Certainly not the weapons or the totems used to buy them.

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I'd be cool with an undyeable lv1 skin (similar to how the gear is in PVP) of the weapon. Instead of coffers dropping for armor, maybe an item similar to totems that you can exchange for lv1 gear specifically for glam. Kind of like how Memoria is at the moment.

Most people, that I know at least, don't do EX or savage but are interested in the glam. Many of us just wait some years for unsynced. I feel like those who want the challenge and rewards of harder content can still get powerful gear while those who want the glam can get just that but will have to grind a bit more for it.

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Originally Posted by Deveryn

What would normal trials offer? Certainly not the weapons or the totems used to buy them.

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Instead of putting old relic mats in POTD / HOH they could have put them on Trials Roulette and Normal Raids.

Would have incentivized daily running. But nope, the SE devs had to put those in the most obscure content they've made at a ridiculously low drop rate. Hell they could keep it in POTD/HOH at a low drop rate but put it on the Trials / Raids roulette at a guaranteed 1 per day each.

They have this system that incentivizes doing them once a day in place to make consistent progress but they refuse to use it for other things that need grinding.

Extreme/Savage/Ultimate are about as starkly different from each other as Normal is from Extreme, and they really don't deserve to be lumped together like that. Many are easily puggable, Diamond Weapon for example is easier than some Normal trials once you got the 'limit cut' style mechanic down.

What I'm saying, is give EX a try, it's absolutely accessible for non-raiders.

That said, Normal modes should give something, Normal raids do. Even if it's just clusters/crystals/materia, a chance at a TT card, orchestrion scroll, or the rare material used to make the crafted weapons.

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Originally Posted by Deveryn

What would normal trials offer? Certainly not the weapons or the totems used to buy them.

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They could give "token fragments" and let you trade five fragments for one EX totem or something. It would let people get some benefit out of the normal modes while keeping the EXes more efficient and the only way to get the direct weapon and mount drops.

I wouldn't worry about ilv cheese for Trials roulettes. The roulette is used more for tomes than it is XP, and there isn't a whole lot of benefit from cheesing the ilv. The roulette can very well throw players into Chrysalis, which can and does wipe groups after the 7-8 minutes it takes to get to the point players wipe.

I agree with the poster who said to consider giving the EX trials a try. Some can be considerably more punishing than their NM counterparts, but I wouldn't let that deter you. The clears are also considerably more rewarding as a result of that. They are designed in a way to be not as demanding as Savage and Ultimate, but still not allow clears if too many mistakes are made. My experience with practice parties in the PF is they are very forgiving, and people are there to learn the fight. If they happen to clear it: bonus.

As for incentives, I am not sure what could be tossed in there. The EX versions already have everything: Orchestrion page, crafting mat for barding/furnishing, totem, and chance at mount. Plus it isn't really all that difficult to get into any particular trial at any given time by queuing into a specific trial that you like to run. Any kind of glamour/minion/random item would be a 'done once won' for most players much like the TT card is now.

I wouldn't say no for something that could be turned in for GC seals, but that is actually a nice little bonus for getting thrown into a lv50 trial.

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Originally Posted by Seraphor

Extreme/Savage/Ultimate are about as starkly different from each other as Normal is from Extreme, and they really don't deserve to be lumped together like that. Many are easily puggable, Diamond Weapon for example is easier than some Normal trials once you got the 'limit cut' style mechanic down.

What I'm saying, is give EX a try, it's absolutely accessible for non-raiders.

That said, Normal modes should give something, Normal raids do. Even if it's just clusters/crystals/materia, a chance at a TT card, orchestrion scroll, or the rare material used to make the crafted weapons.

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Define puggable. At least on Crystal I've yet to run through a PF listing for something end game that didn't eventually lead to you hopping into a discord and tolerating other people for a set amount of time in voice which can be really exhausting, especially if you join before the party is even full. Keep in mind that is my limited experience but myself and other players aren't all social butterflies and it's a bit of a shame that we have to get so up close and personal with others instead of simply learning a generic routine for fights that are rather generic and scripted.

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Originally Posted by NekoMataMata

Define puggable. At least on Crystal I've yet to run through a PF listing for something end game that didn't eventually lead to you hopping into a discord and tolerating other people for a set amount of time in voice which can be really exhausting, especially if you join before the party is even full. Keep in mind that is my limited experience but myself and other players aren't all social butterflies and it's a bit of a shame that we have to get so up close and personal with others instead of simply learning a generic routine for fights that are rather generic and scripted.

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I've never had to hop on discord for any of these Extremes, though I did join one for running blue raids. That's a whole different thing.

All fights can generally be done without a single callout. PF tends to cover basic strat derived from videos like MTQcapture You determine a few parameters at the start: clock spots, light parties, tanks position.

Try out Primal for a practice group.

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Originally Posted by Deveryn

I've never had to hop on discord for any of these Extremes, though I did join one for running blue raids. That's a whole different thing.

All fights can generally be done without a single callout. PF tends to cover basic strat derived from videos like MTQcapture You determine a few parameters at the start: clock spots, light parties, tanks position.

Try out Primal for a practice group.

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Extremes for sure never had to join from my experience. It may have been suggested once or twice in the past by players, but I think it was more as a social thing. When I tried doing savage it was encouraged every now and then though to join Discord. I think I still got clears w/o joining, either way it wasn't mandatory.

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Originally Posted by Momo_Kozuki

I like Storm's Crown and try to farm her card for now, but after that, I don't have an incentive to do the trial in normal mode anymore.



I know about trial roulette, yes, but just like Alliance roulette, it can be manipulated by lazy people to just run the simple lv50 trials, so chance you have the trial you like is very slim.



I know about Extreme mode, but the thing is that I don't do Extreme/Savage/Ultimate. To me, the difficulty in the normal mode is just about right for non-raiding players like me.


I run Fell Court of Troia in a daily basis without roulette cuz I want the gear/glam and like the aesthetic/music, as well as it gives nice income of weekly-cap tome. In comparison, The trial itself, like every non-ARR trial, takes as long as one of a new Panda: Abyssos raid to finish, but has worse tome income and drop nothing save for a chance for a card. And the card itself can be grinded with Extreme mode, so people don't really have any incentive to grind the normal trial if they don't mind the harder difficulty.



I remember that the ARR trial drops weapons/weapon coffers in normal mode, which I think a very nice addition. Even if I don't like the glam, I can just turn them into Grand Company seal for other goodies.


I like that even a non-raider can still benefit from the new 8-man raid tier with non-dyeable gear. I wish to see a similar treatment to trials for this game, which are rich in mechanic and diverse in execution even in normal mode, so that casual players like me can feel eager grinding them, enjoy the aesthetic, music, instead of just going through them once and done.

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I defnitely agree about the weapon part... Like, I feel that the Trial weapons are kinda boring to be the actual EX farm reward.

Or at least, it would be cool to have a Daily Expert Trial roulette (for tome rewards), consisting on the Endwalker Trials. This would also benefit players getting into level 90 later into the expansion, because the Trial queues wouldn't be as terrible.

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Originally Posted by Momo_Kozuki

An incentive to do normal trials

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I know that this is anathema on this forum, but I'm just going to say it: I run trial roulettes for fun.

Sometimes, I get home after work and just want half an hour or so of chill gaming, and I'll run trial and normal raid roulettes. They're quick, there's lot of variety, and you get to fight a couple bosses.

Fun.

If there was more incentive then mounts or weapons sure like say Allied Seals or Gil. I'd take 10k gil over tomestones any day.

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Originally Posted by MagiusNecros

If there was more incentive then mounts or weapons sure like say Allied Seals or Gil. I'd take 10k gil over tomestones any day.

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You might be onto something. We already have BLU to provide a glut of Allied Seals. Instead, make it Centurio Seals.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

They could give "token fragments" and let you trade five fragments for one EX totem or something. It would let people get some benefit out of the normal modes while keeping the EXes more efficient and the only way to get the direct weapon and mount drops.

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I think the last thing we need is another level of currencies and more inventory bloat. It also shouldn’t lead to the same rewards as Extreme.

Getting into an extreme isn’t that hard but unless you are lucky, you still need a lot of patience if you want the mount. You can also just wait it out: if the mount doesn’t drop by the time I can get my weapon for my main job, that’s what I do as I don’t have the time nor the patience to get the insane amount of required kills while synced. While I understand that this requirement keeps the at level content alive for some time, killing the same boss over and over is not my idea of fun. It is much faster when unsynched and I have never needed to get all the required totems before getting the mount (the weapon is then irrelevant unless used for glamour or desynth for mats).

Btw, Rathalos drops two different scales: one that drops in both normal and extreme and the second one only in exreme. Aside from some other items, we can buy armour with the normal mode scales but need the extreme only scales to upgrade it and make it dyable. It’s nice for one special trial but I can’t imagine having this system for every trial unless they add a special currency inventory.

They could always give normals a weekly weapon token that you need 5 or more of to trade in for the EX weapon. It would slowly allow more casual players to aquire minor upgrade and glam.

normal trials does not need anything added to it.

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Originally Posted by Deveryn

You might be onto something. We already have BLU to provide a glut of Allied Seals. Instead, make it Centurio Seals.

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Considering how fast A ranks get sniped in ARR zones, yes.

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Originally Posted by Reimmi

I wish normal mode dropped non glowing weapons and then extremes came *with* the glowing weapons rather than 2 years later
But thats a tradition the devs dont seem to want to break, sadly.

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I was thinking a while back it'd make so much more sense for the non-glowing versions of weapons (which I want) to be the ones purchasable off the MB, but I'd be fine with this too, tbh. Unfortunately, as you say, they're unlikely to change the formula at this point...

When you really like the trial, isn't that incentive enough to do it? I often hear people say that they like dungeon/trial X but don't want to do it anymore when they have the rewards they want. What is false to just do the content not because of rewards but because of fun?

I have no problem with doing content I like when there are no rewards (anymore) because I can have fun while doing it. But I also get that doing content without rewards isn't efficient and some people put efficiency over fun.

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Originally Posted by ACE135

When you really like the trial, isn't that incentive enough to do it? I often hear people say that they like dungeon/trial X but don't want to do it anymore when they have the rewards they want. What is false to just do the content not because of rewards but because of fun?

I have no problem with doing content I like when there are no rewards (anymore) because I can have fun while doing it. But I also get that doing content without rewards isn't efficient and some people put efficiency over fun.

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I do trials for fun if they meet one condition. If I can use Blue Mage. ^_^

Otherwise no if they don't offer 10k gil per run or loot/materia it probably isn't worth doing.

If I had the choice of doing trial/raid for fun or going on a fishing expedition I'll do fishing every time as a great source of xp/scrips and abundance of fine sand.