The Blackest Night

This isn't a post complaining about TBN generally, just 1 part.

This expansion has generally buffed shields to respond more quickly. 6.2 even buffed Shake by making the shield faster.

The Blackest Night is the most obvious shield to get this change. It's the only shield in the game that's a potential DPS-loss to use if it doesn't get value, and it has the shortest duration of any shield.

TBN should apply faster like other shields.

I feel like problems such as that typically just need players to adjust the timing themselves per encounter, but I don't play drk in anything super high end to know if that's top tight of a weave or not. It is fun to use on whoever might receive the most damage at a given point, though. Very satisfying when you make a clutch save with a shield and slap the boss right after.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by xAFROx

I feel like problems such as that typically just need players to adjust the timing themselves per encounter, but I don't play drk in anything super high end to know if that's top tight of a weave or not. It is fun to use on whoever might receive the most damage at a given point, though. Very satisfying when you make a clutch save with a shield and slap the boss right after.

---

Can say the same thing about every other shield that's been given the reduced delay.

The same reason every other shield got this buff is why TBN should get it, but even more due to the extreme punishment of TBN not breaking.

In case anybody is confused, I'm not asking for a CD reduction. If you ever pressed TBN, then took damage, then TBN is applied, that's due to the shield being delayed. Most other shields had this delay removed. Shake it Off just had this delay removed this patch.

Other shields got this QoL, so should TBN. If you press a button, the game should respond.

It's almost as bad as Hallowed Ground

I don't play DRK (yet), but I'm pretty sure I agree with this. TBN sounds like an amazing tool with a decent skill-ceiling , something that's becoming rarer and rarer these days. Using it to make a clutch-save (akin to a buffed Shake it Off, something I do have experience with), is something that absolutely benefits from the reduction in delay between activating the action and its effects going off. After all, how can you make that clutch save if you're in the moment, realizing something going HAYWIRE, only to press the button and have it's effect take until juuuuust after your teammate died. Feels really bad , and not in a "well i just have to be a better tank" kind of way. Those split-second adjustments aren't' planned in the fight, that's what makes them so special. So it's not like you CAN just plan for the delay; that only works for parts of the fight that are going routine.

If TBN has a delayed effect, it deserves the Shake Treatment for sure

It be nice yeah.

TBN probably needs a buff. The other tanks got awesome stuff this expansion and now TBN is pretty lackluster in comparison.
Having a 10s duration would be a nice start.
Providing something on top of it's 25% shield, is probably warranted too.

However, I don't really notice the delay when I play.

TBN is still comically powerful, and the rate at which it improves over the course over an expansion as stronger gear becomes available definitely keeps it from falling behind. It costing MP is still rather unpleasant, but it's at least easy to tell when to use it. Throwing up something like Rampart with it will turn many of the hardest hitting attacks in the game into a joke, though that's rarely actually called for.

What you should really be complaining about is Oblation. Oblation is ten gallons of disappointment in a five-gallon jug and just as much wasted potential. They could at least have attached a heal to it so DRK could have some kind of ability to go without healer supervision for longer than ten seconds.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by coffeeZealot

TBN probably needs a buff. The other tanks got awesome stuff this expansion and now TBN is pretty lackluster in comparison.
Having a 10s duration would be a nice start.
Providing something on top of it's 25% shield, is probably warranted too.

However, I don't really notice the delay when I play.

---

The duration could definitely add some QoL, however TBN is otherwise fine. Other possible changes would probably achieve better results

Additional changes catalogue:
[1a] Dark Mind: Magic mitigation 20% -> 10%, now also grants 10% generic mitigation (so 10% physical / dark, 19% magical)
[1b] Dark Dance: Re-added, physical copy of Dark Mind, all equal stats except damage type
[2a] Oblation: Heal over Time added
[2b] Oblation: Recharge shortened from 60s -> 45s
[2c] Oblation: Mitigation increased from 10% -> 15%
[3] Bloodspiller/Quietus: Heal potency added (think Lv84+ PLD attack spells), would off-set the reduced Souleater usage post-Lv60

Just some ideas. Obviously not all of them should come in, but they'd help DRK a fair bit without a full rework, especially those in category [1].

The core concept of tbn is being a shield, preventing damage.
The skill is meant to be use as late as possible, so you can possibly re-use it asap.
Drk is all about planning ahead, may it be your MP, or knowing when damage will happen ( potentially mess up from team mates ). If you always pay attention, you never have the problem of " it didn't applied fast enough ".

Also, i don't know why people still want tbn to be buffed, even though it's still probably the most busted cd out there.
Almost feels like people forget that you can use 4 tbn / min ( while other tank is more around 2 / min ).
80% of TBs are usually magical, so dark mind is also not a problem at all.
Oblation is also fine as it is ( considering we have tbn, do not forget ). Oblation is seemingly weak because it usually don't shine since damage is not that important. But the higher the damage, the better oblation becomes.
Eventually slap a regen effect on it, but not something too strong, it is not needed.

Tl;dr : if you play drk reactively, you will probably not have much fun.
If you play it while knowing what's coming to you, then it becomes very very fun

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dingodrole

Tl;dr : if you play drk reactively, you will probably not have much fun.
If you play it while knowing what's coming to you, then it becomes very very fun

---

No, even if you know what's coming, it's annoying.

Oblation is pretty bad, period, and could use something more to it since gaining a 10% mitigation cooldown at level 82 is an absolute joke.
Dark Mind is useless on anything that is not physical. Considering how they changed Feint/Addle, it's perplexing that they didn't give a 10% physical mit added to it. They probably should have merged this with Oblation for the 10% physical mit, and made it so Dark Mind can be thrown at other people with 2 charges (making it a much better cooldown).
TBN is the only tank cooldown that causes a damage loss if you misuse it or if the mitigation created by the party is too high, preventing you from taking enough damage. If other tanks had similar issues, I would not complain about this one.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dingodrole

The skill is meant to be use as late as possible, so you can possibly re-use it asap.

---

If you want to re-use it asap, then you should be using it as EARLY as possible. E.g.
If tank buster is at 1:00 mark, you should pop TBN at close to 0:53 as possible so that the buster eats it at the last possible second.
That way you can re-use it as early as 1:08 instead of 1:15

Dark Mind is busted where it matters. Which is in most high end fights. The problem isn't with the ability, the problem is that we should be able to distinguish magic vs physical abilities easier without third party tools, which is a whole other discussion.

And for the love of god, leave TBN alone. Even if you increase the CD to 25sec, removing dark arts and giving 25% HP free is absurdly overpowered. There will be no reason not to use it on CD even if a tankbuster was coming up, and no planning required for it. It is not hard to use, keep 3000 mp to use TBN on CD for trash pulls or whenever you see a tankbuster if you're not optimizing.

It's even more fun to use when you optimize and pop it on healers/DPS when they're taking hard hitting mechs. It's all about knowing when it'll pop. Though I do agree that it should be as responsive as possible, but that's a system wide change that should affect a lot more abilities too.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RaevusAstra

And for the love of god, leave TBN alone. Even if you increase the CD to 25sec, removing dark arts and giving 25% HP free is absurdly overpowered. There will be no reason not to use it on CD even if a tankbuster was coming up, and no planning required for it. It is not hard to use, keep 3000 mp to use TBN on CD for trash pulls or whenever you see a tankbuster if you're not optimizing.

It's even more fun to use when you optimize and pop it on healers/DPS when they're taking hard hitting mechs. It's all about knowing when it'll pop. Though I do agree that it should be as responsive as possible.

---

Honestly I think it be really underpowered.

A lot of what makes TBN good right now is its 15 second CD, put it up to 25 seconds and DRK will not be able to use it as much where its needed. This would hurt the current tier a lot where you can double TBN some DoTS, and it would honestly just make DRK completely unplayable in dungeon content.

TBN has a learning curve, but seeing as its really the only way DRK has to keep damage off itself instead of just lowering said damage, nerfing it so heavily would be extremely detrimental to the jobs performance at all levels, especially if it wasn't replaced with anything.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Oizen

Honestly I think it be really underpowered.

A lot of what makes TBN good right now is its 15 second CD, put it up to 25 seconds and DRK will not be able to use it as much where its needed. This would hurt the current tier a lot where you can double TBN some DoTS, and it would honestly just make DRK completely unplayable in dungeon content.

TBN has a learning curve, but seeing as its really the only way DRK has to keep damage off itself instead of just lowering said damage, nerfing it so heavily would be extremely detrimental to the jobs performance at all levels, especially if it wasn't replaced with anything.

---

What I'm specifically talking about is removing the MP cost from TBN, which is a straight buff. Regardless of whether it's 15sec or 25 sec, there is no cost to using it - it is just a free 25% HP gain on a short cooldown. That is what's overpowered. The fact that TBN is tied to mp balances it properly.

I would watch what you mean by "unplayable" in dungeons as well. With the living dead buffs, though it's still the weakest dungeon tank, it is now completely fine. If you slow the dungeon down where you're not wall to wall pulling, you don't even have to use mitigation. Every job always has and always can clear dungeons. Now, wall to wall pulls is normalized in the community and DRK is already kind of squishy even now, but it's not bad if you manage cooldowns properly.

That said, even if TBN was on 25sec, I think it's an exaggeration that it would be unusable for wall to wall pulls. Tanks have so much mitigation if you manage it properly, and dungeons are such casual content that a proper tank and healer shouldn't have an issue with wall to wall pulls either way. I didn't even imply I wanted them to nerf TBN, I'm responding to suggestions like "put TBN on 25sec and remove its mp cost/give dark arts free".