The WoL's Canonical Name? (ShB/EW Spoilers)

We learned in a recent live letter that every member of the Convocation has already had their real name decided. And of the ones we know, all have a clear theme in Greek mythology. But, what about our original name?

The seat of Azem is the only title not connected to the others by being from an Ivalice game. However, the former member we meet, is given a real name for FFXII, possibly as a way of connecting them to the others.

So the question is, have the devs thought of a real name for the original WoL? And if they have a name, would it follow the theme of Greek mythology or a name from an Ivalice game?

What do people think?

Mine is named Helios, nothing fancy. Greek god associated with the sun, which seemed appropriate and I wanted to stay in the "H" theme of her two best friends; Hythlodaeus and Hades. Even if the devs try to assign a name to Azem (which I don't really see them doing), she'll always be Helios to me.

The whole 'every Ancient was given a name from Greek mythology' doesn't always ring entirelly true though, and Ferne teased that might not actually even be the case even back in ShB, as there are indeed a few exceptions shown (Venat's name is actually derived from a French word for 'hunter', and Hythlodaeus's name despite being a Greek word, is not from Greek mythology but is a character from Sir Thomas More's Utopia - his name literally means speaker of nonsense, which also ties in with Amaurot's name and the names of it's localities also Greek words that were extended puns coming from the same source, Amaurot was the capital of Utopia in that book. A minor npc in the Mourning Dew in Elpis also has the name of a historical Ancient Greek poet as well).

So at the very least most might have Greek names or names derived from Greek words, but not necessarily from Greek mythology.

So my way of thinking is 'it's up to you to decide' what Azem's real name was, as I'm pretty sure SE are not going to go into detail on that part of the character (my own personal headcanon is Enki!Azem's real name was Hemera, a minor Greek goddess who was the goddess of daytime (and hence fits in well with the 'sun' aspect while also using a more obscure name). Once again it fits into the idea of the player's character being a cypher somewhat that is left up to the player to 'fill in the blanks' accordingly.

I don’t think the developers will put a given name to our Ancient Azem selves. They’d probably worry about disrupting personal headcanons the player has about their own character. I’d love to learn more about our original Ancient self, but they seem to dance around the questions surrounding them a lot. That was my impression from the last PLL, anyways.

If I were to give a name to Ancient Azem for my character, I like the name Selene. Being the name of the moon goddess in Greek mythology, I think it’s suiting: Hyomin being a Keeper of the Moon Mi’qote after all. And her chosen deity is Menphina.

In my mind, the WoL comes off as too much of a wild card to have been originally from Amaurot, so their real name is likely not Greek or Greek related. I settled on Maduin. Due in part to the references to FF6 and FF9, and because in Japanese they are basically the same name, with the only difference being whether or not you sound out the "e" sound short or long. So basically the difference between Madin (male) and Madeen (female) in pronunciation. Reference reason chosen below. Spoilers for those who have not played FF6 or FF9.

In both games Maduin/Madeen is the guardian of a world, is held in high regard, and is incredibly strong. Fits Azem to a T.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Eloah

What do people think?

---

Derplander

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Enkidoh

The whole 'every Ancient was given a name from Greek mythology' doesn't always ring entirelly true though, and Ferne teased that might not actually even be the case even back in ShB

---

I personally wasn't saying every ancient had a name from Greek mythology, I was just making a comparison between the prevalent themes we have for the Convocation members, and how Venat's name while not aligning with Greek mythos, aligns with the Ivalice names. So it made me curious if Azem's name might have a similar connection/theme.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RyuDragnier

In my mind, the WoL comes off as too much of a wild card to have been originally from Amaurot, so their real name is likely not Greek or Greek related. I settled on Maduin. Due in part to the references to FF6 and FF9, and because in Japanese they are basically the same name, with the only difference being whether or not you sound out the "e" sound short or long. So basically the difference between Madin (male) and Madeen (female) in pronunciation. Reference reason chosen below. Spoilers for those who have not played FF6 or FF9.

In both games Maduin/Madeen is the guardian of a world, is held in high regard, and is incredibly strong. Fits Azem to a T.

---

I like that idea.

Of course, Azem would be named Dionysus, god of the grape-harvest and wine making (among a loooooong litany of other things).

So, I remember making a similar thread back during ShB after we essentially found out that the WoL was the 14th member of the Convocation. I wondered what their original name was.

I said Artemis, at the time, and I totally wasn't biased because of my character's name. :p But Artemis was not only a huntress but she was also the Phaesporia - meaning Lightbringer. And the Warrior of Light was often referred to as the Lightbringer or Bringer of Light since 2.0.

We've since found out that Artemis was the original name of Mitron, so it's already taken. But I will always maintain that not naming the WoL Artemis is a HUGE miss, and I will die on that hill. :D

i kind of want to see azem get a canonical name but at the same time i kind of dont. itd work to differentiate the wol from azem but i kind of want him to stay mysterious to us.

I feel like it has to be Prometheus. You've got the sun/fire connection, and the siding with man against the 'gods'.

I don't think we will or should ever hear their name, but if it's anything, it should rightly be that.

There's a lot that Yoshida won't clarify in terms of our WoL, mainly because he doesn't want to say "it's this and that's final" since they are OUR characters. Some may not care, but others who roleplay or have their own backstory for their WoL would feel like their toes were being stepped on, and Yoshida would rather not have that happen. That's why there's no definitive place the WoL is coming from on their trip to the starting cities: that is up for us to decide. Sure, we could just be coming from Ul'dah to Limsa because we heard good things about the Marauder's guild and wanted to join up, or we were coming from Kugane to learn the art of conjury. Not having a definitive makes it more fun for those who like to think of their own story for their character, and I feel that the "you are obviously the last Azem" is something else for us as a player to decide on.

As for myself, I have two ways to go about it because I'm horribly indecisive on what I would want: either Clio or Mnemosyne as they both fit my character and how I see her so why not two different AUs for that?! Or she is Clio, daughter of Mnemosyne, and so she has a respect and love for memories and history and collects them for compiling. ...but she would be crazy enough to go save some grapes on an island that Ifrita wants to cover in fire because the wine there is GREAT.

I haven't given it enough thought, but I've seen some good ones like Nike and Nemesis. Persephone is popular in fanfic. :P Unfortunately, none of my favorite names from Greek mythology fit Azem. I think Eris would be amusing.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rulakir

I think Eris would be amusing.

---

It's Eros, because I'm sexy AF.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rulakir

I haven't given it enough thought, but I've seen some good ones like Nike and Nemesis. Persephone is popular in fanfic. :P Unfortunately, none of my favorite names from Greek mythology fit Azem. I think Eris would be amusing.

---

Apparently there was an April Fools prank saying Azem's true name was Persephone. Which, while a joke, makes me think they assigned one. But will they tell us, lol.

My self-canonical name for my Azem is Eos: the goddess of sex and dawn.

Also known to the Romans as Lucifer (or, sometimes, just Lucifer's mom).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Eloah

Apparently there was an April Fools prank saying Azem's true name was Persephone. Which, while a joke, makes me think they assigned one. But will they tell us, lol.

---

Hah! Wish I'd seen that. I figure it's probably Apollo, especially because I'd assume that canon Azem is Ancient Meteor/Derplander. Course, they've named two of the male characters after female goddesses so I suppose the reverse could happen too. The sun aspect is only part of it, Apollo is associated with just about everything from archery to dance, is generally favorably looked upon by those from all walks of life, and is considered to be a protector from evil. He seems to be an 'all-rounder' who fits the bill.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Eloah

So the question is, have the devs thought of a real name for the original WoL? And if they have a name, would it follow the theme of Greek mythology or a name from an Ivalice game?

---

I personally wouldn't like if Azem's name and/or appearance was already decided, I lean towards the 'Your Character Here' idea better as I poured a lot of hours into the backstory of my WoL and their Azem, so the ambiguity is appreciated. We only caught a glimpse of Azem back in ShB and that was enough for me to mold Azem into my vision of my WoL.

As for a name, I'm caught between two I'm trying to decide on. I didn't go with a major or minor Greek god like the Convocation, I wanted my Azem to be unique. The first one is Cleopatra, it rolls off the tongue and it would be cute for Hyth and Hades to call her 'Cleo' in gentle ribbing. The second one is Briseis, only because my WoL's true name is Paris (they went through the story called Helene for reasons). My WoL and their family are all named after human characters from the Iliad give or take and I wanna keep up the theme :).

Last year, I did a quiz for funs and my Tumblr. It said Nyx. That works perfectly for me and thus for the ToasTiE. Also, me and the sun don't have the best track record, so I like to pretend to be a bit subversive whilst remaining entirely obvious. :cool:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ceridwenae

Last year, I did a quiz for funs and my Tumblr. It said Nyx. That works perfectly for me and thus for the ToasTiE. Also, me and the sun don't have the best track record, so I like to pretend to be a bit subversive whilst remaining entirely obvious. :cool:

---

I just did this quiz and got Dionysus. Not quite the god I would associate with the WoL, but still interesting from a personal perspective.

Oddly enough, when I joined the game back in 2015 and was trying to come up with a name for my character, I almost named her Titania. I got to play her when I was in a school play 'A Midsummer Night's Dream'. I think the name came back to me because I knew I wanted to main SCH. Would be interesting to know how that would have played out come ShB. I couldn't have been the only one to think of that name. Then again, I haven't seen any Oberon's around either.

Anywho, I'm not invested in any particular name. But if the devs are going to eventually disclose the real names of all the members, it would need to include Azem as well, no?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ceridwenae

Last year, I did a quiz for funs and my Tumblr. It said Nyx. That works perfectly for me and thus for the ToasTiE. Also, me and the sun don't have the best track record, so I like to pretend to be a bit subversive whilst remaining entirely obvious. :cool:

---

Heh, I got Hephaestus. Neat.

As for the topic of the thread... I believe in the past when this has been teased around, or when I've made a thread about it before, I've leaned heavy on Azem being Apollo for reasons already stated by others in the thread.

But what if Azem's lineage expression is even elder to that of Hades? You know, just to put one more hammer down on that poor old man. What if Azem's name was Utu (Shamash) from Babylonian mythos? Utu was the god of the Sun, Justice, Morality, and Truth. He was the twin brother of the Queen of Heaven, Inanna (Ishtar). Obviously there's no Ishtar in FFXIV, but Venat's probably close enough (And in FFXII she assisted the Archadians - similar to Akkadians no? Ah, I'm reaching, but it's fun. It also doesn't need to make perfect logical sense).

I actually wouldn't mind them hammering down something more concrete about Azem, because we will never be past Azem, and even in individual fan fiction, people ignore what's set in stone all the time. It would also cause people to become more creative/think more about other elements of the past.

They'll probably never tell us. My personal pick is Prometheus. Not a Greek god, instead a Titan of fire, and defied the gods to help mankind. Azem got censured more than once according to the stories and we know of at least one instance where they went against the Convocation's wishes. It's not hard to imagine it happened more than once.

I'm also not convinced the Ancients were the only race on the star. I'm not sure what Azem would be out there learning about other cultures if they were all the same flavor.

Plus for whatever reason, Azem seemed to give the middle finger to summoning both Zodiark and Hydaelyn.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Gemina

I just did this quiz and got Dionysus. Not quite the god I would associate with the WoL, but still interesting from a personal perspective.

---

Dionysus was the god favored by outcasts and rebels, because his entire gimmick was ignoring the status quo. His followers were also well known for partaking in grapes and wine.

Seems fitting for an Azem, who are typically the rogues of the Convocation that ignore the rules when it suits them, and prefer making friends and allies across a diverse range of people including those marginalized by society. Likewise, we're also told that "our" Azem single-handedly stopped a volcanic eruption from killing a populace because they liked the grapes there.

Dionysus seems pretty damn well appropriate.

Incidentally, I got Aphrodite for my name.

Still fitting, considering Eos and Aphrodite used to be part of the same goddess.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CrownySuccubus

Seems fitting for an Azem, who are typically the rogues of the Convocation that ignore the rules when it suits them, and prefer making friends and allies across a diverse range of people including those marginalized by society. Likewise, we're also told that "our" Azem single-handedly stopped a volcanic eruption from killing a populace because they liked the grapes there.

---

I got the impression Azem didn't give a fig about the grapes and told that to the impressionable Elidibus and the real motive was rescuing the village there.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ceridwenae

Last year, I did a quiz for funs and my Tumblr. It said Nyx. That works perfectly for me and thus for the ToasTiE. Also, me and the sun don't have the best track record, so I like to pretend to be a bit subversive whilst remaining entirely obvious. :cool:

---

Yeah.... I took that test and got Hades.. I now think that the world is trying to tell me something...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TaleraRistain

I got the impression Azem didn't give a fig about the grapes and told that to the impressionable Elidibus and the real motive was rescuing the village there.

---

It's, somewhat ambigious, but how the story was written suggests that the villagers were already evacuating/preparing to evacuate (or at least the Convocation expected them to) so any casualties would have been minimal, if not outright nonexistent, and thus the Convocation's dismissal of helping save the island was just pragmatism on their part - why bother stopping a village being destroyed by a normal environmental process when buildings and crops can just be restored to normal with creation magic afterwards once the danger has passed?

And, add in the Convocation regarded themselves as the stewards of nature, so they did not want to intefere with a 'natural process', which using Ifritia to absorb the excess fire aspected aether would have definetely counted as intefering with. So their decision was a pragmatic one, do not interefere and let nature run it's course.

Of course Azem, being the practical one, had other ideas, and it definetely seems that saving the grapes for personal reasons probably did influence their decision as well (SE themselves played on that in EW, where you can tell an impressionable loporrit that you would gladly do the same thing Azem did to save some grapes, simply because you love to eat them. ;)).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rannie

Yeah.... I took that test and got Hades.. I now think that the world is trying to tell me something...

---

The world would be telling you you're a pretty decent person, then, albeit one who is often misunderstood by ingrates. :D Well, that's what I'd think, anyways.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vyrerus

I actually wouldn't mind them hammering down something more concrete about Azem, because we will never be past Azem, and even in individual fan fiction, people ignore what's set in stone all the time. It would also cause people to become more creative/think more about other elements of the past.

---

There are some decent opportunities for this to be explored between Pandaemonium and Myths. It's hard to say definitively yet if we aren't actually 'past Azem' given that we're apparently their spitting image (while Hermes and Amon look nothing alike physically). Perhaps our ancestral lineage has remained relatively identical in appearance across 120 generations, but there might always be an accidental second time travel loop lurking at the end of the Pandaemonium arc that explains Themis' 'falling star' prediction. I'm kind of hoping for the latter, because that seems like a very Azem thing to do.

What might resolve the issue somewhat is if Azem isn't actually even Amaurotian in origin. That allows their role in Amaurot to be fleshed out while leaving their overall backstory open ended. It also keeps them as a traveller of the world rather than tying them down to one culture.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rulakir

Hah! Wish I'd seen that. I figure it's probably Apollo, especially because I'd assume that canon Azem is Ancient Meteor/Derplander. Course, they've named two of the male characters after female goddesses so I suppose the reverse could happen too. The sun aspect is only part of it, Apollo is associated with just about everything from archery to dance, is generally favorably looked upon by those from all walks of life, and is considered to be a protector from evil. He seems to be an 'all-rounder' who fits the bill.

---

I think Azem, if they are named after a greek god, is probably Apollo, as well. He's associated with the sun, light, inquiry, truth. He has a twin sister who is goddess of the moon, which may or may not thematically tie into Menphina/Azyma.

And Apollo can work as a female name, imo, so that works for female Azems, too.

In addition to Hades, we've had Hermes and an Athena. (Who either was a previous Lahabrea or was a previous director of Panda? Both? I'm not clear on that.) And we may have a Hephaestus for Lahabrea, if this theory is at least partially right: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7IAPkEVAIOc

Plus, though Venat's name sounds french and apparently is derived from the french word for hunter according to earlier in this thread, the way its pronounced in the Japanese dialogue is definitely "Venus". Why they didn't just use "Venus" in her case, I have no idea, but its a thing and kinda pulls her back into both the "they're all greek" and the "convocation = olympians" folds, even though her name is technically an outlier. The only other outlier as far as "Convocation = olympians" seems to be Themis, but that may end up not even being his real name or something, so I'm waiting and seeing.

So I think Azem having a greek god name is very likely.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alleluia

we've had Hermes and an Athena. (Who either was a previous Lahabrea or was a previous director of Panda? Both? I'm not clear on that.)

Plus, though Venat's name sounds french and apparently is derived from the french word for hunter according to earlier in this thread, the way its pronounced in the Japanese dialogue is definitely "Venus". Why they didn't just use "Venus" in her case, I have no idea, but its a thing and kinda pulls her back into both the "they're all greek" and the "convocation = olympians" folds, even though her name is technically an outlier.

---

Panda spoilers:

I believe this Athena will be Igeyorhm, considering how Lahabrea and her were paired up after the events of the 13th and in Heavensward. Plus if Lahabrea is indeed Hephaestus it would make the myth of him and Athena more tangible in ff14's sake when it comes to the warder Erich, who told us and Themis that the current Lahabrea and the late Athena are his parents.

And a thought for Venat; maybe the Venus pronunciation is a roundabout way to link Venat to the convocation's naming convention, as Venus is the Roman equivalent to Aphrodite. Though Venus/Aphrodite and Venat's personalities, and what they represent, are vastly different from each other.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lyth

(while Hermes and Amon look nothing alike physically)

---

We actually don't know what Amon looked like, since we never see him without his mask. Supposedly he did look just like Hermes, since Hermes face is a re-purposed Elezen face, and Amon was an Elezen.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Raincrown

Panda spoilers:

I believe this Athena will be Igeyorhm, considering how Lahabrea and her were paired up after the events of the 13th and in Heavensward. Plus if Lahabrea is indeed Hephaestus it would make the myth of him and Athena more tangible in ff14's sake when it comes to the warder Erich, who told us and Themis that the current Lahabrea and the late Athena are his parents.

---

That doesn't really work since Athena is already dead prior to the start of the raid. So it's impossible for her to become the Igeyorhm we eventually meet. The Igeyorhm me know was alive during Zodiarks summoning.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Eloah

That doesn't really work since Athena is already dead prior to the start of the raid. So it's impossible for her to become the Igeyorhm we eventually meet. The Igeyorhm me know was alive during Zodiarks summoning.

---

Whoops, big oversight on my part, somehow I overlooked that detail when making my post :p. I'll have to wait until next tier to find out more

the warrior of light does not have a canonical name unless yoshi P says so, since he hasn't said anything of the sort you can call the warrior of light whatever you like.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Eloah

We actually don't know what Amon looked like, since we never see him without his mask. Supposedly he did look just like Hermes, since Hermes face is a re-purposed Elezen face, and Amon was an Elezen.[/HB]

---

I wouldn't pay too much attention to the character models. Modified elezen frames get used for a lot of the non-playable races (Garleans, Amaurotians, etc.)

Amon makes it fairly explicit that he's a different person, during the cutscene for Tipping the Scale (Lv. 80) at the Tower of Zot.

'Allow me to tell you a story. Surely you've yet to hear the one about Fandaniel, the sundered Ascian. I inherited the position - and the soul - of the Fandaniel who sat on the Convocation in the time of the Final Days. Theoretically speaking. Practically speaking, that fact is of no consequence! I was born and lived as... well, me. Eventually I was recruited into the Ascians and imbued with the former Fandaniel's knowledge and memories, but I never felt that they were truly a part of who I am. How to explain? Perhaps if I told you who I was before my Ascian embrace. Although that chapter, too, is a past I've long since discarded. I have it on good authority that you've poked your nose into an Allagan ruin or two, yes? Then I expect you've heard of me. The old me.'

This is also implied even in the flashback of Emet recruiting Amon into the Ascians that immediately follows it as well.

And when you fight Amon in the Aetheric sea, he delivers the line 'Many faces have I worn, but this is my favorite by far...' when he appears as Amon, not Hermes (a Hermes manta ray would probably not have the same effect). Is that just a mask? Hard to tell, really - the Crystal Tower hat that you can equip is just a half mask. And Amon's 'face' in Final Fantasy 3 was also a skull. Why? I have no idea. Bottom line is, Amon is a different person with the same soul, and the implication is that he looks different as well.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lyth

snip

---

I think you might've missed the point I was making. But ultimately, no, we don't know what Amon looks like.

Again, that's deliberate. He literally had a skull for a head in FF3.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Listrella

the warrior of light does not have a canonical name unless yoshi P says so, since he hasn't said anything of the sort you can call the warrior of light whatever you like.

---

Well, obviously. You can decide Azem’s real name was Ted until it’s stated otherwise. People are just speculating.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lyth

Again, that's deliberate. He literally had a skull for a head in FF3.

---

I don’t think Eloth was saying it wasn’t deliberate. They’re saying his facial features are up for debate, which u seem to agree on. They’re also saying he was elezen, which you seem to be saying we dont actually know. (please correct me if I’m misunderstanding you.)

I’d point out he’s got the tall lean frame and pointy elezen ears, at least in altiascope. So it’s very likely we do actually know his race and that that race was elezen. Unless it’s revealed that he cosmetically altered his body, which is possible but has not been implied at present. Simplest explanation is that those are his natural ears.