I ask how many times you've stood at a plaque lately, as a pro argument for a certain number of wards to be made in the style of 'First Come, First Serve' in Ishgard, and in the future for other available areas as well. I'm not arguing that Lottery system should be taken out entirely, I think it's a decent idea. I wouldn't normally post in a forum, but it was encouraged to show our desires if we wanted FCFS areas made available.
I've read statements that say 'real life stops us from getting the opportunity' to 'less people will be disappointed'. My opinion is as follows:
-The argument that "real life impedes being able to get a chance at FCFS because of work, etc", is exactly the same as saying "I don't want to wake up early, because I'd rather sleep in than go to bed early the night before, and even be able to try". You are then robbing yourself of that opportunity entirely.
-Having a 'Fair' opportunity via the Lottery system is something that is going to be implemented regardless of whether some wards are made FCFS anyway. Essentially, if you'd like the lottery system, then congratulations because you are already getting what you want. To say you don't think any FCFS areas should exist is to stand up and say "I not only want my opportunity, point a finger and say, but I also don't want you to have yours." It is a selfish statement that says you believe everyone should be confined to the choice you have deemed superior.
-To say the lottery system is more fair, goes against what a very large group of people are actively working towards, and that is getting a house. Would you like a house? Nearly everyone in the game would say yes. Are you putting in work towards getting a house?" Nearly everyone would say No, besides a select few. In my server, and likely in yours, there is a 'housing circuit' of the same people you see at plaques every single time a house comes up, because they are actively working towards it. There are people searching for houses, who every single day go through 24 wards, 24 sub-divisions, in all 4 housing areas, and who likely do it multiple times a day. I know because I do it, therefore my chance at getting a house should be better than yours because I am actively working towards it. If you are running the same boss fight over and over again for a rare minion drop, then your chances SHOULD be better than mine-wouldn't you be frustrated if suddenly that was made a lottery we could just bid on?
The lottery system deserves it's chance, and more so I strongly believe a First Come First Serve section deserves the exact same chance. It is not a dichotomy of either A or B, there is an option C where both opportunities coexist.
How many times have you stood at a plaque lately?
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02-22-2022, 03:15 AMLadySharpsHow many times have you stood at a plaque lately?
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02-22-2022, 03:21 AMDeveryn
FCFS boils down to whose keyboard macro hits at the right time. There is no justifying giving this a chance anywhere.
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02-22-2022, 03:22 AMRaoabolic
I said it once and i'll say it again. NFT housing, let's see how serious you are about wanting that plot!
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02-22-2022, 03:24 AMAzuri
No. From 6.1 housing should be lottery only. Always.
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02-22-2022, 03:28 AMLadySharps
I'm open to hear what you have to say, but you've given no thought to a response besides a single sentence. Your refutation is non-existent. This is a forum for discussion is it not?
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02-22-2022, 03:30 AMIllmaeran
I haven't stood at a placard lately because all the plots are full and there's no demolition timer going.
I have stood at placards for 8-10 hours a day a few times and found it to be a completely miserable experience thanks to people walking up and relocating after many hours of clicking.
I don't believe the current mechanism of Lucky Click, Lucky Buy is good or healthy. If they want to make initial sales in a couple wards truly First Click, First Served with ZERO random timer, sure, why not? I may even give that a go just to see what happens. If it doesn't work, to the lottery I'll go as it's a more enjoyable experience than praying a timer ends and I'm the lucky one who clicked 0.1 second before the next person after 10 hours of clicking. -
02-22-2022, 03:38 AMPaduduit's not a college class's discussion board lol people can respond how they wishQuote:
Originally Posted by LadySharps
in either case, yeah I'm not standing at a placard where the plots are full, there's a bunch of people and a bunch of them are likely using macros. It's just not worth it to me to sit there 8-10 hours clicking when you're likely going to lose to the person using the auto clicker
I'd rather the lottery -- I'm a little concerned about people who will use alts to flood the lotto, but meh people will exploit any system. It'd still be better than sitting around and clicking on end for practically nothing
LMAO yes this is the superior system, I'm down for NFT housing if we get monke nfts of the scionsQuote:
Originally Posted by Raoabolic
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02-22-2022, 03:41 AMAzuriAnd you've posted a bunch of watery sentences in a thinly veiled attempt to cover the only real intent of your argument.Quote:
Originally Posted by LadySharps
"I WANT A HOUSE AND I DESERVE IT MORE!"
And look, I respect that opinion. I also put myself and my own interests above any other player. But trying to present that as some "this is the fairer system" argument is just lame. -
02-22-2022, 03:43 AMLadySharps
Do you then disagree that the systems can co-exist?
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02-22-2022, 03:43 AMAvatre
Not since the newest wards for Shirogane were released...stood at a large, wondered if I had enough money for it, was short 8mil, ran to a mid, and got that. I don't stand at placards trying to get a house. I'll enter the lottery for a house, depending on what island sanctuary is like, either for myself or my FC. Otherwise, I don't bother standing at placards
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02-22-2022, 03:51 AMLadySharps
I never stated that I believe it's a fairer system, nor will I argue the straw man fallacy your creating by insinuating that I did state that.
In fact it was quite the opposite, I even gave credit to the lottery system itself. However I do think extra effort towards something should give you an upper hand. -
02-22-2022, 04:19 AMAbysmalDuck
Guarantee OP already has a house.
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02-22-2022, 04:25 AMLadySharps
*OP does not have a house.
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02-22-2022, 04:52 AMNanaWiloh
I am fine with fcfs as long all those wanting them never again complain about the clicking or a relocator swooping in and taking the plot. Do as the old saying "You made your bed now sleep in it"
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02-22-2022, 05:00 AMCosmicCoqui
Honestly rather lottery just be the new norm. With FCFS, you can't really enjoy the game and have to compete against bots while also clicking for hrs on a sign post. Though also hope it only allows 1 bidding at a time so its actually fair across the board. There would be more houses though if SE actually made it so one can only own 1 personal house and 1 fc house per account...
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02-22-2022, 05:13 AMConundrum
I feel there is an ulterior motive for all these people asking for first come first served.
I wonder if they've got something setup to bot getting them for resale or something (I mean more complex than a placard bot). I have no proof of that of course...but something smells likes the Limsa Docks. -
02-22-2022, 05:15 AMAbysmalDuckIn the other thread, all the people defending FCFS were all people that already had houses and were just upset they would be possibly stuck with an old house while someone that never had a house had the chance to get a new shiny house, or at least my opinion.Quote:
Originally Posted by Conundrum
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02-22-2022, 05:18 AMMr_Gyactus
Where is the bait meme when you need it?
Asking for free houses when the auto-demolition is off...
In crystalline honesty, they are worried to not be able to take some big house with their fake FC to re-sell in some shady site for dollars.Quote:
Originally Posted by AbysmalDuck
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02-22-2022, 05:19 AMPoporito_Popoto
Zero. Not interested in housing.
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02-22-2022, 05:20 AMIllmaeranI have the feeling that being the one to get that lucky click after tens of hours of mindlessness appeals to some peoples' sense of accomplishment and having "earned" the house. Even though we all have to earn the Gil needed to purchase the house, toughing out a horrible mechanic can contribute to a person's thought that they are somehow better than the rest and deserve the house more than another through simple endurance.Quote:
Originally Posted by Conundrum
I disagree with this notion and believe a lottery system is better on the whole as it helps to avoid all the actually harmful aspects of the current FCFS system.
Could I get up really early or stay up extra late to camp a placard? Sure, can, but I run a laboratory and need to have my head on straight at work to avoid potential safety issues. Being a responsible professional takes priority over a building made of pixels. -
02-22-2022, 05:21 AMConundrumGood point...they don't really want FCFS, they want to preserve relocation. I feel there pain, but don't agree with them...I have medium in the goblet that my character will likely live in until the day he dies.Quote:
Originally Posted by AbysmalDuck
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02-22-2022, 05:26 AMEradenYou have my appreciation for your stance on this issue. You are taking the high road and promoting a fair system for all despite the very real possibility that it may hurt your future chances at getting better housing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Conundrum
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02-22-2022, 05:29 AMSeiori
If they just somehow added some type of gardening system to apartments (like a plant stand) I would not even think about buying a house at all, that's the only thing making me think of it.
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02-22-2022, 05:30 AMConundrumI'm also a huge supporter of instanced housing. I like having cool stuff in games, but unlike many, I have no desire to block others from getting them because of "mUh eXCLusIvIty".Quote:
Originally Posted by Eraden
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02-22-2022, 05:48 AMTlachtga
i kinda don't care either way. if they make a few wards as normal, i might relocate my medium to Ishgard. possibly one of my smalls. if its purely lottery-based, i'll just keep my 3 houses where they are.
it sounds like mass disappointment either way. more plasters on the bullet wound. -
02-22-2022, 05:53 AMConundrum"See what you did there I do" - YodaQuote:
Originally Posted by Tlachtga
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02-22-2022, 07:49 AMBsrking5
FCFS that hits when the servers opens benefit people who use PC over PS5 and basically gives ps4 no ability to compete what so ever, regardless of what they do. And to top it off those with fastest ping have a serious advantage over everyone else.
FCFS after the timer benefit auto clickers over everyone else at the health of anyone who dare compete against them. Thus encourages cheating of auto clickers.
So you are willing saying that ps4 players should never have an option to compete for a house on server release is fair. That they didn't get up early enough when they could be spamming the log in screen until it finally lets them in(when servers open) just to see literally they are not allowed a house. Thats fair to you. Just because they are on ps4. Not because they didn't get up "early enough".
FCFS deserves to die off and never be used again. -
02-22-2022, 09:19 AMDaeriion_AeradiirThe flaw with this logic is that relocation is already dead, regardless of buying system chosen.Quote:
Originally Posted by Conundrum
In preparation for the lottery sale system scheduled to be implemented in Patch 6.1, it will no longer be possible to relocate an estate to plots of land that are not yet ready for purchase. ~ 6.0 patch notes.
So saying they're arguing for preserving relocation is false. It's impossible to relocate to a plot without playing the same game as everyone else is in FCFS. So anyone arguing in those threads is arguing purely on the pros & cons of FCFS vs Lottery.
Personally, FCFS makes more sense on patch drop, then lottery after that plot has been purchased at least once, gives people way better odds than lottery does. If nothing else, it'll be amusing to see the wakeup call for the people thinking lottery will help them get a house when the first lottery set goes up and people see a list of over a hundred entries for any given plot, and they're still left without a home after when they might have actually had a realistic shot if they were willing to wake up for 5mins in the morning of the patch drop. -
02-22-2022, 09:29 AMKrotoanExtra effort shouldn't always be rewarded. Especially in a video game that touts valuing the players time. Encouraging damaging or obsessive behavior and giving an edge to those who game the system to acquire a limited resource only breeds frustration and contempt.Quote:
Originally Posted by LadySharps
This is saying just because you put a lot into something you should get something out of it, always.
Criminals (alright.. SMART criminals) put a lot of effort into their plans and some put a lot of physical effort into executing their plans. Should they just succeed because they tried hard? Should someone force a relationship with someone else just because the person trying to initiate the relationship is trying hard and putting a lot of effort in it? No.
There are lots of other factors such as morality, game vision, distribution and overall satisfaction with the game to be considered over "they tried hard, they should get something for it. ".
What is being implemented is OBJECTIVELY more fair than the previous system for a release of an entirely new area. -
02-22-2022, 09:30 AMBristolRussThe European servers go up at 10am GMT when most people are already at work. Stop thinking that America = the rest of the World.Quote:
Originally Posted by LadySharps
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02-22-2022, 09:37 AMArrhin
The only solution is instanced housing.
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02-22-2022, 10:08 AMDeNada
I realize that after 4 pages of threads, no one has answered OP thread title questions.
I have camped probably more than 50 houses before finally getting a small house.
That's probably over 200 hours of my life gone and never coming back so no, I would never want to inflict that soul crushing experience of placard clicking even on my worst enemy and FCFS should die in a fire for being such a trash system. -
02-22-2022, 10:27 AMACE135
I wonder with how many people one has to compete when a plot gets free with FCFS. Is it 10 to 20? Or even less? I don't know. I think with the lottery system it would be way more, so the chances to win are smaller. But I could be wrong. Just curious.
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02-22-2022, 10:29 AMDiaDeem
As someone who has gone through Housing Savage three times, each time taking a physical and mental toll on me: F*ck FCFS and plaque click spamming.
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02-22-2022, 10:36 AMJojoyaIt's not a question of "can they co-exist". Obviously it's possible.Quote:
Originally Posted by LadySharps
The question is should they co-exist. For most of us, that answer appears to be "No".
FCFS would allow a select portion of the player base to double-dip into the system to gain an advantage in acquiring a house. It also heavily favors those who use bots then go AFK to do other things so aren't actually investing their time in trying to obtain the plot compared to those who are present and are investing their time.
If SE wants the system to be fair for all, then it needs to be a uniform system that every one uses.
While I believe extra effort deserves greater reward, that's not what is happening with the FCFS system. There's far too much RNG involved and someone who has devoted hundreds of hours to get a house can still lose out to a player who just decided 5 minutes earlier to try to get their first house.Quote:
Originally Posted by LadySharps
Also, most of those who end up winning under FCFS aren't putting in extra effort at all. They're botting.
Of course there's an ulterior motive. They feel that system gives them a significant advantage because competition is greatly reduced (and they'd be right).\\Quote:
Originally Posted by Conundrum
There is a gardening system in apartments using flowerpots. You can't intercross to get new seeds but you can grow every seed in the game (which can't be said for the outdoor garden patches that won't grow the decorative flowers), and you can use the Shroud topsoil to increase yield.Quote:
Originally Posted by Seiori
I know players dislike the cost of Thavairian Onions on the MB but there's a reason for those prices - it's a headache to get the seed in the first place then a headache to grow it.
It's not about improving their chances of winning. It's about having the time available to camp in the first place during the limited window the house is on the timer.Quote:
Originally Posted by ACE135
Having 2 hours 3 nights a week available to play the game is going to be less than entertaining if you're spending all 6 of those hours placard camping trying to get a house. For most players, that translates into zero chance to get a house because being online and at the placard at the moment the timer releases is far less likely. With the lottery, they can take 2 minutes to buy their entry for the lottery period and spend the remaining 5 hours and 58 minutes playing the rest of the game. Even being one entry out of 500 is better odds than having no entry at all.
As much as I believe effort should be rewarded, the housing system still does not reward effort under FCFS. It rewards luck. If it's going to come down to luck, might as well just use the lottery system which is also luck based so players can spend their time doing other things. -
02-22-2022, 02:51 PMkaynideIt’s more that the old system is not worth keeping. If it’s going to be given to someone at random anyway (be it lucky timing on a macro, or pulling a random number), it’s better it doesn’t waste the players’ time. There is no reason anyone should have to stand in front of a plaque for hours on end like some archaic monster pop from older mmos.Quote:
Originally Posted by LadySharps
If you want extra effort to be rewarded, go level up all 8 possible alts and have all 8 try to win the house. -
02-22-2022, 03:40 PMSeera1024
None because the system is not healthy. It's not worth it.
You have to spend an unknown time camping a plaque repeatedly clicking on it hoping that you get the magic click to buy the house.
When you have to gamble that you might not get the house because you had to use the restroom means the system is not a healthy one. When you have to weigh your options for getting food because the time it takes you to even go get a bowl of chips might be enough time for someone to get the house you've been spending hours at means the system is not a healthy one. When you have to weigh the chances of the timer going off during the window you can stay up later for or get up earlier for and not be too tired to function vs getting a full night's rest means the system is not a healthy one.
With a lottery, yes, my chances overall may be lower as more people may decide they want to try their hand at getting a house, but at least I'm not jeopardizing my health or giving up my life just for a chance at getting a house. -
02-22-2022, 04:15 PMYeol
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02-22-2022, 07:25 PMLianaThorneJust throwing this out there, RMT is actually incredibly frowned upon in the black market spaces and those who try to sell houses for real money are banned pretty quickly by moderators. It's not tolerated. The more probable outcome is someone bought the house with gil as that's how most, if not all of trades used to go down before all of the housing changes were made. If people used money to buy gil, that I can't say...but just flat out paying someone cash for a house is not allowed in those spaces and all of the major servers dealing with it have rules against it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yeol